Does God's plan require evil?

[RDKirk]

It's like starting out as kids being cared for (in the Garden), then we lose our innocence realizing the realities of the world and struggle for years amid the hypocrisies, then hopefully providing we have saved enough proper currency cashable only in the Kingdom, we can retire, once again cared for as in youth.

Do you not know that we will judge angels? -- 1 Corinthians 6:3

It does not appear that our future is merely to be cared for like children.

I would argue that "knowing good and evil" was always the plan. There is room to discuss whether Adam and Eve disrupted the intended curriculum...or whether we actually are on the path that the course always required.

 

[RDKirk]

I do not believe God had evil in His plan of creation since it says repeatedly in Genesis 1 that He considered His creation as good. Perhaps, & I only say “perhaps” because I better not speak for God, in some aspects there is an experiment in creation & which must be allowed to act itself out.

Surely, the plan of salvation is to overcome evil ( a major part of our Lord’s Prayer in Matthew 6:9-14). Everything is from God & all of our hope of redemption is of God ( see Colossians 1 ).

For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us for adoption to sonship through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will -- Ephesians 1

And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. -- Revelation 3

If it was all in God's plan before He even created the universe, then it was always in God's plan.

We are not living God's Plan B, we are living God's Plan A.

 

[TedT]

Evil is absolutely necessary and was created by God because without evil there’s no cycle of life. Also without evil there’s no learning and the main purpose of this earthly life for us is to learn valuable lessons.

In my Christian opinion: there was no necessity of evil in all of creation nor even the hint of an aroma for the necessity of evil:

Is not the heavenly state the culmination of all life? Is not the heavenly state characterized as the marriage of Christ and HIS Church: Revelation 19:6-7 “Alleluia! For the Lord God Omnipotent reigns! Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready” Is not the sexual union of married people symbolic of the spiritual unity with GOD of those married to GOD?

So: "Why were we made?"

We were made to have a full unity with GOD in a full communion of emotion (love) and communication (telepathy, like the angels enjoy) within all of created reality with GOD and everyone else within the marriage, for eternity.

All doctrine must flow from this revelation to us of HIS purpose.

A marriage that is forced is not a marriage but a rape.
A marriage that is built on tricking the bride into not understanding that she could say no is not a marriage at all but a fraud.

Therefore for HIS purpose for us to enter into the communion of a unity with us called marriage to be real, it must have been as a offered to us as a proposal of marriage which we had the right and understanding to accept or reject by our free will. Those who accepted HIS proposal (and the attenuating promise of salvation if we should ever fall into sin) were chosen to be HIS bride, a promise of marriage called election. Those who rejected HIS proposal of marriage immediately became enslaved to the addictive quality of evil with no chance of salvation as they were rejecting their only hope to be freed from their addiction, that is, they were condemned to banishment from all of created reality to the outer darkness from that second on.

No one was created as evil as HE had no reason or need for evil people in HIS purpose for finding a Bride. HE could not and would never marry an evil person. Those of you who know this to be true must redefine your theologies which mangle this truth to stay reconciled to itself. GOD is love and in HIM is no evil at all.

I champion GOD’s holiness:
- GOD did not need evil to fulfill HIS plan and did not create evil for any reason.

- All evil is creature-created by their true free will.

I champion Our Free will:
- All spirits created in the image of GOD were created with the ability to make true free will decisions and had an equal opportunity and ability to choose for HIM or against HIM.

Peace, Ted

 

[timothyu]

Is not the heavenly state characterized as the marriage of Christ and HIS Church: Revelation 19:6-7 “Alleluia! For the Lord God Omnipotent reigns! Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready”

No. That disrespects the kingdom.
Rev. 21:9And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

 

[RileyG]

Evil is the absence of good. God can create good out of evil.

 

[timothyu]

God can create good out of evil.

Why not? Man traditionally creates evil out of good.

 

[RileyG]

Why not? Man traditionally creates evil out of good.

Yes. What's your question?

 

[GenemZ]

Does God's plan require evil?

God's plan requires evil, to reveal why God must send souls to the Lake of Fire. Evil must be understood to see why the Lake of Fire is justified...

Remember.... before Satan fell.. the concept of evil was a foreign concept to all the angels. They were living in total innocence. There was no 'good or bad' for them to deal with in God's kingdom. It was God in His omniscience who judged the (evil) they could not yet understand when Satan rebelled with his angels.

Since evil was not yet understood? In order to make His judgment understood? He had to teach the angels about what God already understood about evil.

God did so by requiring evil to be made manifest in His plan. In doing so, the reality that evil is malignant to the lives of others was able to be shown and understood by all angels.. Especially as to why their previously "beloved friends" must be separated and quarantined for the ultimate good of all.

grace and peace ........

 

[TedT]

No. That disrespects the kingdom.

WoW!!! Your let field sure is waaaaay out there....

 

[TedT]

Why not?

??? Because HE is holy, loving, righteous and just!!!

 

[TedT]

God's plan requires evil, to reveal why God must send souls to the Lake of Fire.

Yikes...

No evil means no lake of fire. Eternal death and suffering gives HIM no pleasure nor does HE want it...so why would HE require it???

Is not the heavenly state the culmination of all life? Is not the heavenly state characterized as the marriage of Christ and HIS Church: Revelation 19:6-7 “Alleluia! For the Lord God Omnipotent reigns! Let us be glad and rejoice and give Him glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready” Is not the sexual union of married people symbolic of the spiritual unity with GOD of those married to GOD?

So: "Why were we made?"

We were made to have a full unity with GOD in a full communion of emotion (love) and communication (telepathy, like the angels enjoy) within all of created reality with GOD and everyone else within the marriage, for eternity.

All doctrine must flow from this revelation to us of HIS purpose.

A marriage that is forced is not a marriage but a rape.
A marriage that is built on tricking the bride into not understanding that she could say no is not a marriage at all but a fraud.

Therefore for HIS purpose for us to enter into the communion of a unity with us called marriage to be real, it must have been as a offered to us as a proposal of marriage which we had the right and understanding to accept or reject by our free will. Those who accepted HIS proposal (and the attenuating promise of salvation if we should ever fall into sin) were chosen to be HIS bride, a promise of marriage called election. Those who rejected HIS proposal of marriage immediately became enslaved to the addictive quality of evil with no chance of salvation as they were rejecting their only hope to be freed from their addiction, that is, they were condemned to banishment from all of created reality to the outer darkness from that second on.

No one was created as evil as HE had no reason or need for evil people in HIS purpose for finding a Bride. HE could not and would never marry an evil person. Those of you who know this to be true must redefine your theologies which mangle this truth to stay reconciled to itself. GOD is love and in HIM is no evil at all.

I champion GOD’s holiness:
- GOD did not need evil to fulfill HIS plan and did not create evil for any reason.

- All evil is creature-created by their true free will.

I champion Our Free will:
- All spirits created in the image of GOD were created with the ability to make true free will decisions and had an equal opportunity and ability to choose for HIM or against HIM.

 

[GenemZ]

Yikes...

No evil means no lake of fire. Eternal death and suffering gives HIM no pleasure nor does HE want it...so why would HE require it???

I just told you why.

 

[timothyu]

WoW!!! Your let field sure is waaaaay out there....

Rev. 21:9And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

 

[timothyu]

Because HE is holy, loving, righteous and just!!!

He is, but we are not.

 

[BobRyan]

Does God's plan require evil?

No. God does not "need evil" to be good or to have "good" in the Universe.
What He needs is "free will"

 

[BobRyan]

God's plan requires evil, to reveal why God must send souls to the Lake of Fire.

no because that would be circular...

With no evil there is no lake of fire and no sending anyone to it.

 

[BobRyan]

Since evil was not yet understood? In order to make His judgment understood?

That logic does not work. It is like saying

"we need murderers so everyone can appreciate the death penalty. Surely people would object to the death penalty being applied to people randomly who had committed no crimes --- so we need murders... see??"..​

It makes no sense.

 

[Jonaitis]

Does God's plan require evil?

I suppose you could say that, because without sin, where is redemption? Without wrongdoing, where is justice? Without severity, where is mercy? Without imposition, where is grace? We learn more about God in the world of opposites. He displays more of His light in the midst of darkness. Evil teaches us about good in ways that good does not teach us alone, in a sense. If God is all wise, good and powerful, then this existence must be the best of worlds.

 

[Chriliman]

Why not? Man traditionally creates evil out of good.

Technically, God created evil, if he created us knowing we’d do evil things.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Does God's plan require evil?

God's plan does allow evil to occur, but evil is not God's will, He does not want people to be evil. Jesus said:

Mat 18:7 Woe to the world because of offenses! For offenses must come, but woe to that man by whom the offense comes!​

I believe strongly in the free will of man, that people can either choose to do good, and be rewarded for it, or choose evil and have its negative reward. God has allowed this to occur, so in that sense, it is His will, but He does not desire people do evil.

Justin Martyr - First Apology - Ch 56-50

Chap. XLIII — Responsibility Asserted.

...that they who choose the good have worthy rewards, and they who choose the opposite have their merited awards. For not like other things, as trees and quadrupeds, which cannot act by choice, did God make man: for neither would he be worthy of reward or praise did he not of himself choose the good, but were created for this end; nor, if he were evil, would he be worthy of punishment, not being evil of himself, but being able to be nothing else than what he was made.​