Does "all things" mean everything?

[ralangley]

Let's add some more scripture to the issue, let's talk about Jesus temptations. Just because He was able to ... turn stones into bread...doesn't mean He did it, and why? Because it would not have glorified the Father. Seems to me we should be taking a lesson from Jesus own life here and allowing God to do the miracles that He sees fit, including but not limited to moving literal mountains, and flying men. Seems to me we should be taking a lesson from Jesus own life and ask only for the things that would glorify God, not self.

Ah well... (I'm not suggesting you ralangley specifically don't just talking in general, including talking to myself)

Yes. And therein lies the challenge of knowing the heart of God so intimately that we know when we're glorifying God or when we're simply gratifying our own desires.

From my reading of scripture, I read that signs and wonders should follow all of us who believe. We should be literally and figuratively moving mountains every day. But the intent of these signs is to forward the kingdom of God - to glorify God and serve His will. Seems that there are abuses on both sides of this. In one camp, signs are pursued in order to get that new Lexus or 10,000 member church; in the other camp, signs are negated and minimized in fear of being prideful or fleshy. IMO, we're called to a higher walk than either approach.

 

[JimB]

Jimbo, you've fallen into your error again, as you will not see me preaching this, unless you can get a quote where I've preached it's possible for men to sprout wings and fly, or anything even close to this. And since I don't believe this, it would be hard for me to fulfill your part of the scripture for you. And admit I was wrong, well Jim, I was wrong again. If you can again show me where I've said this though, otherwise perhaps one of us is simply jumping the gun a bit to prove a point? And did you think this thread would have a different outcome this time?

If you haven’t said what I have said you said and it is not part of your belief system, then I owe you an apology for thinking (and saying) it was.

Sorry.

But, as always, there are new members in this forum who have not had the "privilege" of discussing what may be old stuff to you and me. If I don't bring it up, they will.

~ Hugh D’Mann

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[JimB]

Travel broadens the mind! I discovered this place on Holidays In Israel.

http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/mokattam.htm
In one of those meetings in which Pope Abram and a Jew named Jacob Ibn Killis were present, the Pope got the upper hand in the debate. Plotting to take revenge, Ibn Killis quoted the verse where the Lord Jesus said in Mt 17:20: "If you have faith as small as a mustard seed, you can say to the mountain, Move from here to there, and it will move, nothing will be impossible for you" and demanded him to prove that his religion is right by means of this.
The Caliph saw in this an opportunity to remove the mountain that was spoiling his view. At the same time, if the Christians proved unable to perform this miracle, than it would be proof that the religion of the Christians was wrong and he would be finished with them, or so goes the Legend.
And so, after three days of prayers and fasts by the people throughout the land of Egypt, Simon was chosen to move the Mokattam Mountain. It is said that a great earthquake swept over the mountain. Each time the

people stood up to worship, the mountain was thrust up and the sun would be seen from under it. When the people sat down, the mountain thrust down. This was repeated three times. Afterwards, the Caliph was racked with fear and embraced the Pope warmly and this was a new beginning for a good friendship between them. However, St. Simon went missing and was never found. It is believed that his skeleton was discovered in 1991 in Babylon in the St. Mary's church (the Hanging Church).

Okay, that is allegedly one time in 2000 years. Got anything current?

~ Hugh D’Mann

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[JimB]

?
Some people find it so easy to lie against others. Just bare faced lies, twisting of the truth, misrepresentation, and false witnessing.
I find it impossible to discuss anything with these. Everything one says is just more fuel for them to ruin themselves and others.
Hence... the Dids will just bow out and leave you to think whatever you want.
Happy Holidays to all!

Oh, come on Dids, your feigned offense is unbecoming. One trip through he WOF forum will show how disingenuous this statement is. I am not welcome there, so I will leave it to readers to do their own research.

Maybe, Dids, you are not one of "them". You say you are not (although some of the positions you take betray you), and I guess we will have to take your word for it.

It is true that since some of the more unbalanced members of this forum have left (or moderated their positions and returned under a new alias), and we do have a more truthful and acceptable face on the “faith” doctrine and hopefully, so that some proponents of the more unbalanced “faith” (so-called) doctrine are moderating their positions as well. Maybe a little resistance from those who hold a more balanced view of scripture is doing some good.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[JimB]

Can God make an object so large that He cannot move it?

Of course He can.

(But maybe not in this forum.)

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[razzelflabben]

Yes. And therein lies the challenge of knowing the heart of God so intimately that we know when we're glorifying God or when we're simply gratifying our own desires.

From my reading of scripture, I read that signs and wonders should follow all of us who believe. We should be literally and figuratively moving mountains every day. But the intent of these signs is to forward the kingdom of God - to glorify God and serve His will. Seems that there are abuses on both sides of this. In one camp, signs are pursued in order to get that new Lexus or 10,000 member church; in the other camp, signs are negated and minimized in fear of being prideful or fleshy. IMO, we're called to a higher walk than either approach.

good point, so can we delve into what or how many signs should follow us? In other words, some people expect that everywhere they turn there should be wonderous signs. But others think that God alone is to say who, what, when.

Let me say it yet anther way, some time ago, I was praying. for lack of a better way to say what happened, I saw a light within me, collect, then shoot out toward the people I was praying for. As I checked on each, they each reported "good" things from God. Things that they had been very "focused" on. Is that also one of the signs and wonders. Do the signs and wonder have to be some massive wild ride, or is the wonder of what God does within equally miraculous. It seems that when we talk about signs and wonders, it is always related to the extremes of this life. Isn't salvation, peace, love, etc. equally miraculous and equally a sign and wonder of our Lord?

Let me say it yet another way.

 

[ralangley]

good point, so can we delve into what or how many signs should follow us? In other words, some people expect that everywhere they turn there should be wonderous signs. But others think that God alone is to say who, what, when.

Let me say it yet anther way, some time ago, I was praying. for lack of a better way to say what happened, I saw a light within me, collect, then shoot out toward the people I was praying for. As I checked on each, they each reported "good" things from God. Things that they had been very "focused" on. Is that also one of the signs and wonders. Do the signs and wonder have to be some massive wild ride, or is the wonder of what God does within equally miraculous. It seems that when we talk about signs and wonders, it is always related to the extremes of this life. Isn't salvation, peace, love, etc. equally miraculous and equally a sign and wonder of our Lord?

Let me say it yet another way.

Absolutely. I think signs and wonders can come in many different forms and packages - healings, prayers being realized, peace, and most importantly, salvation. Each one is a "wild ride" in that each reflects the arrival of God's kingdom. I believe as we become more aware of how God interacts with His people, we start to see more of how the Kingdom of God truly is at hand. We start to see the spiritual in the mundane. "Accidental" meetings become divine appointments; a random thought becomes a divine message. Healings, manifestations become natural extension of living a spiritual life, and as natural as breathing. I think this is the Church Christ is seeking. A church so infused with Christ that everything is spiritual, every moment is a moment with God.

I see your prayer as very much a sign and a wonder. Praise God.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Of course He can.

(But maybe not in this forum.)

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

Then if an object is too big for God to move - then He is not all powerful?

 

[razzelflabben]

Absolutely. I think signs and wonders can come in many different forms and packages - healings, prayers being realized, peace, and most importantly, salvation. Each one is a "wild ride" in that each reflects the arrival of God's kingdom. I believe as we become more aware of how God interacts with His people, we start to see more of how the Kingdom of God truly is at hand. We start to see the spiritual in the mundane. "Accidental" meetings become divine appointments; a random thought becomes a divine message. Healings, manifestations become natural extension of living a spiritual life, and as natural as breathing. I think this is the Church Christ is seeking. A church so infused with Christ that everything is spiritual, every moment is a moment with God.

I see your prayer as very much a sign and a wonder. Praise God.

my thoughts as well. the thing is, we are told that there will be greater signs and wonders. what would be greater than the spiritual God, touching the physical man and leaving His very distinct mark, evidence as it were of the supernatural God living and dwelling among men. Isn't that far greater, of much more value than the things we seek after, the things that this world affords us? In my opinion, I would much rather have God than anything this world could offer, and to an extent, that opinion has been challenged. And still to this day, I will tell you that the wonders of our Lord, the treasures of heavenly nature are far more precious than the things of this world.

 

[razzelflabben]

Then if an object is too big for God to move - then He is not all powerful?

God can create a thing so big that He cannot lift it, and then He will lift it.

As my children figured out, Jesus being fully man and fully God, God can create a thing so big that Jesus cannot lift it, then turn around and as the Father, lift it. God is both / and not either / or

 

[razzelflabben]

our son is very perceptive sometimes. He just said, that God's power and authority is never limited to our faith.

Consider some of the biblical stories in which God did what He did despite faith.

 

[JimB]

our son is very perceptive sometimes. He just said, that God's power and authority is never limited to our faith.

Consider some of the biblical stories in which God did what He did despite faith.

Your son may be a genius.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[JimB]

Then if an object is too big for God to move - then He is not all powerful?

Who said He couldn’t lift it? Don’t ask me how, but God can do anything.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[razzelflabben]

Your son may be a genius.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

Well I was always taught that if you can't spell genius, you aren't one. Our son is dyslexic, and his spelling is terrible so I'm guessing smart but not genius

 

[JimB]

Well I was always taught that if you can't spell genius, you aren't one. Our son is dyslexic, and his spelling is terrible so I'm guessing smart but not genius

I think they said something like that about Einstein when he was a child.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

 

[razzelflabben]

I think they said something like that about Einstein when he was a child.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

A bit of serious, our kids are not genius, however, some are close in fact, a great grandfather of theirs was a genius and their grandmother is just a point or two away from being one. In fact, our eldest son, took the entrance exam for the Navy and was just a couple of points from a perfect score. They told us several times that his score was the highest they had seen on some of the portions. They begged him to go into nuclear, but he refused, went to Iraq as a Corpsman for the Marine. Sports a tattoo that reads, "Love your enemies"

The son we are speaking of here, is still in high school (home schooled) is terrrible in spelling, as a dyslexic, he is reading at or above grade level (thought I'd never see that day) and is doing advanced math on self study from picking up a book and learning it.

So now I have bragged a bit about my kids and we can get back to the topic. Thanks for letting me brag, I need that once in a while.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Can God make an object so large that He cannot move it?

Of course He can.

(But maybe not in this forum.)

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

Then if an object is too big for God to move - then He is not all powerful?

Who said He couldn’t lift it? Don’t ask me how, but God can do anything.

~Justin Thyme

Contentment is not found in having what you want, but in wanting what you have​

Not lift - move.

Also first you say He can make something too large to move - then you said He could move it -

Which is it?

 

[enoch son]

All means the hold and everthing in the greek. I think alot of you let at a most important thing GOD"S WILL. If you don't think He saved the whole creation then how can you believe you could grow wing?

 

[razzelflabben]

Not lift - move.

Also first you say He can make something too large to move - then you said He could move it -

Which is it?

both, don't limit God to your logic

 

[razzelflabben]

All means the hold and everthing in the greek. I think alot of you let at a most important thing GOD"S WILL. If you don't think He saved the whole creation then how can you believe you could grow wing?

are you suggesting that no one will go to hell, or that Jesus came for all?