Do you support a balanced budget amendment?

[Always in His Presence]

This thread is more about the falsehood that the budget can be balanced without cutting entitlements (and/or raising revenue).

Of course you can prove that.

For it not to be a falsehood, there has to be a factual backing.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Of course you can prove that.

For it not to be a falsehood, there has to be a factual backing.

Post #20 already covered the simple mathematics involved.

Assuming we don't default on debt service, discretionary spending is less than the deficit, so balancing the budget requires cuts to mandatory spending (and/or raising revenue).

What is the breakdown of FY24’s discretionary spending?​

The $1.6 trillion in discretionary spending for FY24 is split between $842 billion for defense programs and $758 billion for nondefense activities, reflecting respective 3% and 7% boosts from FY23 enacted levels.

Monthly Budget Review: Summary for Fiscal Year 2024​

In fiscal year 2024, which ended on September 30, the federal budget deficit totaled $1.8 trillion

--

Thus, to eliminate the deficit (i.e. balance the budget), we would have to reduce discretionary spending by $1.8 trillion, leaving -$0.2 trillion for discretionary spending.

 

[Always in His Presence]

Thus, to eliminate the deficit (i.e. balance the budget), we would have to reduce discretionary spending by $1.8 trillion, leaving -$0.2 trillion for discretionary spending.

You went from entitlements. With an emphasis on Social Security to discretionary spending

Two totally different things.

Federal SSI benefits and administrative costs are financed by annual appropriations from general revenues. SSI benefits are mandatory spending, while administrative costs are discretionary spending.

Get more efficient, cut Administrative cost.

Social Security is not discretionary

Want to try again?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Social Security is not discretionary

Want to try again?

No, I just want you to understand what I did the first time. (and the second time)

If you cut all of the discretionary spending, the budget is still not balanced.

The only thing left to cut is mandatory spending, i.e. entitlements.

 

[perplexed]

Federal SSI benefits and administrative costs are financed by annual appropriations from general revenues.

Ideally general revenues would not have cover issuing lots of T-bills to pay interest and the shortfall from the amount paid in and the amount paid out due to demographic changes. Things are far from ideal.

 

[essentialsaltes]

The National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) just passed the House. The 1,813 page document contains additional spending, but no new revenue, making the deficit worse.

The NDAA sets Pentagon and U.S. national security policy for the year ahead. Republicans and Democrats alike lauded the bill’s 14.5 percent pay increase for junior enlisted troops, along with its authorization for spending increases on military “quality of life” issues.

The bill authorizes the expansion of U.S. military resources to assist with migrant interdiction on the border with Mexico and expands U.S. assistance to Israel — core Republican priorities.

The bill also strengthens U.S. defenses against China, and expands investment in new military technologies and replenishing U.S. weapons stockpiles, they said.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

I voted no...

But without knowing the details of what kind of balanced budget amendment you had in mind, I was just going off of the sentiments surrounding it I often hear presented.


A flat out "no, you can't spend more than the government is bringing in" is too rigid and it doesn't allow for emergencies and other extenuating circumstances.

Same would be true for a personal budget as well.

While I like striving for keeping my spending within my budget with savings set aside. I like knowing I've got the option for lines of credit should an emergency pop up.

 

[durangodawood]

I voted no...

But without knowing the details of what kind of balanced budget amendment you had in mind, I was just going off of the sentiments surrounding it I often hear presented.


A flat out "no, you can't spend more than the government is bringing in" is too rigid and it doesn't allow for emergencies and other extenuating circumstances.

Same would be true for a personal budget as well.

While I like striving for keeping my spending within my budget with savings set aside. I like knowing I've got the option for lines of credit should an emergency pop up.

I've deficit-spent to purchase a house few times. Its worked out pretty well.

 

[durangodawood]

I've deficit-spent to purchase a house few times. Its worked out pretty well.

I think my deficit was 200% of Gross Durangodawood Product one time!

 

[perplexed]

I think my deficit was 200% of Gross Durangodawood Product one time!

did you keep that up for 30 years ?

 

[essentialsaltes]

Mandatory spending in FY2024 about $4.2 trillion. So cutting that to $3.3 trillion requires a ~21% cut in mandatory spending. No one will cry if we cut Congresscritters' salaries, but that's not going to save very much out of the mandatory budget. So inevitably it'll get into SNAP, Social Security, disability insurance, Medicare, veteran's benefits -- things people rely on and are literally entitled to.

White House insists Musk cuts to Social Security, Medicare won’t affect benefits​

Elon Musk alleged that up to $700 billion in entitlement spending could be “waste and fraud”

[Sort of like feeding malnourished children through USAID is 'waste and fraud'. You feed them, and the kids are hungry again tomorrow! What a waste!]

Discussing his efforts to cut federal spending during a Fox Business interview Monday, Musk suggested that “waste and fraud” in the programs is “the big one to eliminate.” [as I pointed out above, it is impossible to cut your way to a balanced budget without touching them] Musk estimated that a “half-trillion, maybe 6, 700 billion a year” could be saved through eliminating the waste and fraud he claims exists in entitlement spending.

The programs cost more than $2.9 trillion in fiscal 2024, meaning Musk is suggesting that up to 24 percent of their budget is fraud and waste. That figure is much higher than what has been identified by watchdogs.

Government auditors have previously found that about $10 billion in improper Social Security payments are made per year on average, accounting for less than 1 percent of benefit payments, and about $100 billion in payment errors were made in Medicare and Medicaid in 2023. Those numbers don’t encompass other types of fraud found through government investigations.

On Tuesday afternoon, White House press secretary Karoline Leavitt said that Musk was referring only to cutting “the waste and the fraud and the abuse that does exist in these programs,” alleging that the “mainstream media has taken Mr. Musk out of context.”

Musk has previously attacked Social Security, calling it a “Ponzi scheme” and reposting a meme calling people who receive federal benefits “the Parasite Class.”

Giving money to parasites sounds like waste and fraud.

 

[Always in His Presence]

White House insists Musk cuts to Social Security, Medicare won’t affect benefits​

Elon Musk alleged that up to $700 billion in entitlement spending could be “waste and fraud”

[Sort of like feeding malnourished children through USAID is 'waste and fraud'. You feed them, and the kids are hungry again tomorrow! What a waste!]

Discussing his efforts to cut federal spending during a Fox Business interview Monday, Musk suggested that “waste and fraud” in the programs is “the big one to eliminate.” [as I pointed out above, it is impossible to cut your way to a balanced budget without touching them] Musk estimated that a “half-trillion, maybe 6, 700 billion a year” could be saved through eliminating the waste and fraud he claims exists in entitlement spending.

The programs cost more than $2.9 trillion in fiscal 2024, meaning Musk is suggesting that up to 24 percent of their budget is fraud and waste. That figure is much higher than what has been identified by watchdogs.

Government auditors have previously found that about $10 billion in improper Social Security payments are made per year on average, accounting for less than 1 percent of benefit payments, and about $100 billion in payment errors were made in Medicare and Medicaid in 2023. Those numbers don’t encompass other types of fraud found through government investigations.

On Tuesday afternoon, White House press secretary Karoline Leavitt said that Musk was referring only to cutting “the waste and the fraud and the abuse that does exist in these programs,” alleging that the “mainstream media has taken Mr. Musk out of context.”

Musk has previously attacked Social Security, calling it a “Ponzi scheme” and reposting a meme calling people who receive federal benefits “the Parasite Class.”

Giving money to parasites sounds like waste and fraud.

What is the last three words or the title of your own link?

won't effect benefits - nuff said...

 

[essentialsaltes]

What is the last three words or the title of your own link?

won't effect benefits - nuff said...

That is what the White House insists. Trump also insisted he wouldn't 'touch' Social Security and Medicare.

So we may have to wait and see. Trust but verify.

 

[RDKirk]

White House insists Musk cuts to Social Security, Medicare won’t affect benefits​

Elon Musk alleged that up to $700 billion in entitlement spending could be “waste and fraud”

[Sort of like feeding malnourished children through USAID is 'waste and fraud'. You feed them, and the kids are hungry again tomorrow! What a waste!]

Discussing his efforts to cut federal spending during a Fox Business interview Monday, Musk suggested that “waste and fraud” in the programs is “the big one to eliminate.” [as I pointed out above, it is impossible to cut your way to a balanced budget without touching them] Musk estimated that a “half-trillion, maybe 6, 700 billion a year” could be saved through eliminating the waste and fraud he claims exists in entitlement spending.

The programs cost more than $2.9 trillion in fiscal 2024, meaning Musk is suggesting that up to 24 percent of their budget is fraud and waste. That figure is much higher than what has been identified by watchdogs.

Government auditors have previously found that about $10 billion in improper Social Security payments are made per year on average, accounting for less than 1 percent of benefit payments, and about $100 billion in payment errors were made in Medicare and Medicaid in 2023. Those numbers don’t encompass other types of fraud found through government investigations.

On Tuesday afternoon, White House press secretary Karoline Leavitt said that Musk was referring only to cutting “the waste and the fraud and the abuse that does exist in these programs,” alleging that the “mainstream media has taken Mr. Musk out of context.”

Musk has previously attacked Social Security, calling it a “Ponzi scheme” and reposting a meme calling people who receive federal benefits “the Parasite Class.”

Giving money to parasites sounds like waste and fraud.

We could just put retired people out on ice flows, as the Inuit used to do long ago.

 

[iluvatar5150]

We could just put retired people out on ice flows, as the Inuit used to do long ago.

Not if the arctic keeps melting.

 

[dogs4thewin]

would it be nice sure. Do I think that it will happen or is reasonable on the federal level no.

 

[dogs4thewin]

We could just put retired people out on ice flows, as the Inuit used to do long ago.

We probably could not reduce it by quite that much but depending on whether it would affect retirement or just disability we could liely reduce it by quite a bit ( and I am saying this as someone who is disabled by the way.

 

[dogs4thewin]

What is the last three words or the title of your own link?

won't effect benefits - nuff said...

just because he SAYS it will not affect benefits does not make it SO.

 

[Desk trauma]

We probably could not reduce it by quite that much but depending on whether it would affect retirement or just disability we could liely reduce it by quite a bit ( and I am saying this as someone who is disabled by the way.

Surely the leopards will leave you alone.

 

[Always in His Presence]

just because he SAYS it will not affect benefits does not make it SO.

just because he SAYS it will not affect benefits does not make it a conspiracy either.