...Do you even believe in Evolution in the first palce?

[kellhus]

I've never had wine at all, except what we call New Testament wine (grape juice).

Wine in the area and time period in which the New Testament took place was not grape juice... It was quite alcoholic.

 

[bhsmte]

You mean your boys at the Jesus Seminar?

Biblical scholars. There is a profession known as; "biblical scholars" and "historians". Sort of like a physician knowing about disease states of your body, these folks know the bible. Make sense?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Wine in the area and time period in which the New Testament took place was not grape juice... It was quite alcoholic.

So much so that it was commonly cut with water -- the pure stuff would put you on the floor in no time flat.

 

[AV1611VET]

Wine in the area and time period in which the New Testament took place was not grape juice... It was quite alcoholic.

You were there?

 

[AV1611VET]

Biblical scholars. There is a profession known as; "biblical scholars" and "historians". Sort of like a physician knowing about disease states of your body, these folks know the bible. Make sense?

You mean your boys at the Jesus Seminar?

 

[AV1611VET]

So much so that it was commonly cut with water -- the pure stuff would put you on the floor in no time flat.

You & kellhus were there?

 

[TLK Valentine]

You were there?

You were?

 

[TLK Valentine]

You & kellhus were there?

You were?

 

[kellhus]

You were there?

Yes, I can read first hand accounts, and agricultural manuals written in that period. Educating oneself is quite the beneficial activity, everyone should try it out.

 

[bhsmte]

You mean your boys at the Jesus Seminar?

I believe there were 200 scholars that participated in the jesus seminar. With that said, their work is much more broad than just the Jesus seminar.

An analogy would be; a group of orthopedic physicians getting together at a seminar to discuss treatment for tibia fractures, when in reality, their work involves much more than that.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by kellhus

Wine in the area and time period in which the New Testament took place was not grape juice... It was quite alcoholic.
​

You were there?

What would be the purpose of wine if not for the alcohol affect derived from drinking it?

http://www.christianforums.com/t99559-4/
Wine or Grape Juice?

The Bible refers to Jesus creating wine and drinking wine. Many Protestants say that "wine" doesn't refer to wine, it means grape juice. This despite the clear tradition of Catholics, Orthodox and Orthodox/Lubavitcher Jews going back forever. It's not even a valid Passover meal or Eucharist with grape juice.

They take the clear word "wine," then translate it into something ambiguous like "fruit of the vine," and then construe the ambiguity to mean grape juice. (No different than taking Jesus is "God," then interpret God to mean "heavenly," and then say he's just an angel.)

Jesus talked about being "born again." He said you need to have a spiritual "new wineskin," because an old wineskin can hold old wine but new wine will cause it to burst; new wine requires a new wineskin. Why? Because the wine is releasing gas as it finishes fermenting, and the old wine has completed the fermentation process. The Bible says a good Christian will not drink too much wine; strange that it would matter how much grape juice you drink.

They did not (fundie beliefs notwithstanding) have access to the Welch pasteurization process that was unveiled at the very end of the 1800s.

.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes, I can read first hand accounts, and agricultural manuals written in that period. Educating oneself is quite the beneficial activity, everyone should try it out.

I hope you never read Mein Kampf then.

 

[AV1611VET]

What would be the purpose of wine if not for the alcohol affect derived from drinking it?

Wine never had an "alcohol effect" until scientists got ahold of it.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Wine never had an "alcohol effect" until scientists got ahold of it.

You know, AV, your irrational fear and hatred of all things scientific is occasionally cute -- this is not one of those times.

The things you will do with the truth are just plain nauseating.

 

[bhsmte]

Wine never had an "alcohol effect" until scientists got ahold of it.

So you saying, wine did not have alcohol content until when exactly?

 

[AV1611VET]

You know, AV, your irrational fear and hatred of all things scientific is occasionally cute -- this is not one of those times.

I believe science has morally bankrupted this country.

The things you will do with the truth are just plain nauseating.

Wine has that effect on people ... I think.

 

[AV1611VET]

So you saying, wine did not have alcohol content until when exactly?

How should I know, bhstme? I'm not a connoisseur of wine.

I made the statement that wine in the Bible was grape juice -- now I'm being put through an inquisition for some reason.

 

[bhsmte]

I believe science has morally bankrupted this country.

How exactly?

Wine has that effect on people ... I think.

Lame attempt at humor. Please answer my question, at what time did wine begin to have alcohol content?

 

[bhsmte]

How should I know, bhstme? I'm not a connoisseur of wine.

I made the statement that wine in the Bible was grape juice -- now I'm being put through an inquisition for some reason.

You make a claim of knowledge (wine in the bible was simply grape juice) and I ask a simple question - what are you basing that on? You must have some knowledge or evidence if you are making that claim, or are you simply making that up so it fits your personal beliefs?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I made the statement that wine in the Bible was grape juice -- now I'm being put through an inquisition for some reason.

That's what happens when you spread false information.