Do you agree with this statement?

[Knee V]

Well find the "God will claim that on earth we were sinless like Christ, co-redeemers with Christ, and in heaven all-powerful like Christ" or that "no man comes to Christ but through you" etc.

in Christ,

Bob

I don't understand what you're asking, exactly.

 

[mmksparbud]

"Without the Virgin Mary, there would be no Jesus Christ. Without the Virgin Mary there would be no Mother Church."

Yes or No?

Without the virgin Mary, God would have found the virgin Helen, or the virgin Ruth, or the virgin Penelope----It was never the "virgin" that saved us anymore than it was the boat that saved Noah and his family--It is God through Jesus Christ. God could have saved Noah without that boat if He so chose. He could have stood an elephant on four fig leaves to ride out the storm if He wanted. God is not limited by our limits. God never mentioned, by name, any certain virgin. "God Himself will provide.."

 

[MoreCoffee]

Without the virgin Mary, God would have found the virgin Helen, or the virgin Ruth, or the virgin Penelope----It was never the "virgin" that saved us anymore than it was the boat that saved Noah and his family--It is God through Jesus Christ. God could have saved Noah without that boat if He so chose. He could have stood an elephant on four fig leaves to ride out the storm if He wanted. God is not limited by our limits. God never mentioned, by name, any certain virgin. "God Himself will provide.."

Yet God did choose Mary and Mary is a Virgin and Jesus was born of Mary and the Church is the body of Christ who is Mary's son, so what's to object to in the statement? You're complaining about a hypothetical and the statement is about what actually happened. Seems kind of weird for you to do that.

 

[Rick Otto]

Without the virgin Mary, God would have found the virgin Helen, or the virgin Ruth, or the virgin Penelope----It was never the "virgin" that saved us anymore than it was the boat that saved Noah and his family--It is God through Jesus Christ. God could have saved Noah without that boat if He so chose. He could have stood an elephant on four fig leaves to ride out the storm if He wanted. God is not limited by our limits. God never mentioned, by name, any certain virgin. "God Himself will provide.."

(Wierd objections aside)

 

[mmksparbud]

Yet God did choose Mary and Mary is a Virgin and Jesus was born of Mary and the Church is the body of Christ who is Mary's son, so what's to object to in the statement? You're complaining about a hypothetical and the statement is about what actually happened. Seems kind of weird for you to do that.

I am not complaining--just answering the question!!!--Nothing weird about it. Mary could have refused--another vessel would have been found. End result would have been the same--I do not understand your weird complaint!!!
God will always win in the end!

 

[MoreCoffee]

I am not complaining--just answering the question!!!--Nothing weird about it. Mary could have refused--another vessel would have been found. End result would have been the same--I do not understand your weird complaint!!!
God will always win in the end!

But Mary did not refuse and Christ was born of Mary and the church is Christ's body and he is Mary's son. Like I said the facts back the statement.

 

[mmksparbud]

But Mary did not refuse and Christ was born of Mary and the church is Christ's body and he is Mary's son. Like I said the facts back the statement.

LOL--Coffee--I declare--I think sometimes you disagree just because you think you can't possibly agree with anything an SDA would say!!
For crying out loud--if Mary had refused, and God had asked virgin Helen and she had agreed, then you'd all be worshiping the Virgin Helen--the only difference would be the name, you all would have still gone the way you did so the Caholic Church would still have been the same, just a name would have changed!! No reason in the world to disagree with that, how does that step on your toes??--God does not force. Mary was willing. So we all know she did not refuse---I was just answering the OP's question which had nothing to do with the facts, it's a "what if" question!!--Chill out, go oil your feathers!

 

[concretecamper]

Yet God did choose Mary and Mary is a Virgin and Jesus was born of Mary and the Church is the body of Christ who is Mary's son.

Furthermore, if you claim to be part of His Church (His Body), you must have Mary as your mother......if you follow the bible that is.

 

[MoreCoffee]

LOL--Coffee--I declare--I think sometimes you disagree just because you think you can't possibly agree with anything an SDA would say!!

For crying out loud--if Mary had refused, and God had asked virgin Helen and she had agreed, then you'd all be worshiping the Virgin Helen--the only difference would be the name, you all would have still gone the way you did so the Caholic Church would still have been the same, just a name would have changed!! No reason in the world to disagree with that, how does that step on your toes??--God does not force. Mary was willing. So we all know she did not refuse---I was just answering the OP's question which had nothing to do with the facts, it's a "what if" question!!--Chill out, go oil your feathers!

It depends on what the SDA says really. In face to face contact with SDAs good manners and better theology seem common.

 

[Lion King]

Furthermore, if you claim to be part of His Church (His Body), you must have Mary as your mother......if you follow the bible that is.

Sarah is my mother.
Ruth is my mother.
Rachel is my mother.
Mary is my mother.
Elizabeth is my mother.
Hannah is my mother.
Esther is my mother.
Rahab is my mother.
Deborah is mother.

Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.

 

[Lion King]

Without the virgin Mary, God would have found the virgin Helen, or the virgin Ruth, or the virgin Penelope----It was never the "virgin" that saved us anymore than it was the boat that saved Noah and his family--It is God through Jesus Christ. God could have saved Noah without that boat if He so chose. He could have stood an elephant on four fig leaves to ride out the storm if He wanted. God is not limited by our limits. God never mentioned, by name, any certain virgin. "God Himself will provide.."

Exactly!

Only God saves.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

No, I don't agree with either statement. God could have chosen another person if he wanted to.
Mary was a vessel for Jesus, and we all can be used to be God's vessel is his choice and there is no way any person can stop God's plans

Saul/Paul was also a "vessel of choice" to carry the Gospel message, to the Jews first, and then the Gentiles.

Acts 9:15
But the Lord said yet toward him "Be thou going!,
that a vessel of-choice/ekloghV <1589> to Me is this-one,
of the to bear the Name of Me before Nations and Kings--Sons besides of Israel".

Acts 13:46
Being bold yet Paul and Barnabas said "to ye it was necessary first to be spoken the Word of the God.
Since ye are thrusting away it and not worthy judging yeselves of the age-abiding life, behold! we are turning into the Nations".

.

 

[Rick Otto]

Furthermore, if you claim to be part of His Church (His Body), you must have Mary as your mother......if you follow the bible that is.

You mean, follow it like the pope does.

 

[concretecamper]

Sarah is my mother.
Ruth is my mother.
Rachel is my mother.
Mary is my mother.
Elizabeth is my mother.
Hannah is my mother.
Esther is my mother.
Rahab is my mother.
Deborah is mother.

Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.

Context my friend. None of the women you mention is the mother of the Head of the Church

 

[concretecamper]

You mean, follow it like the pope does.

if you say so

 

[Lion King]

Context my friend. None of the women you mention is the mother of the Head of the Church

So?

They're all still my mothers as far as I'm concerned.

 

[mmksparbud]

Furthermore, if you claim to be part of His Church (His Body), you must have Mary as your mother......if you follow the bible that is.

Mat 12:48 But he answered and said unto him that told him, Who is my mother? and who are my brethren?

Mat 12:49 And he stretched forth his hand toward his disciples, and said, Behold my mother and my brethren!


If Christ wanted Mary to be worshipped as the mother of all---He'd have said so right there and then. Eve is the mother of the human race. Mary was a very blessed woman, but a woman, a married woman with children. She was not translated as Enoch and Elijah. There is not one sinle verse in the whole bible that says to give her homage. For that matter, not one verse exists thst says anything about her being "forever virgin", either. She is not the author and finisher of my salvation--Chris is. The old testament only mentioned a virgin of a certain lineage---it didn't narrow it down to one specific virgin of that lineage. Virgins were far more common place then they are now!!---There were also far many more virgins who stayed that way till death then there are now!

 

[MoreCoffee]

Sarah is my mother.
Ruth is my mother.
Rachel is my mother.
Mary is my mother.
Elizabeth is my mother.
Hannah is my mother.
Esther is my mother.
Rahab is my mother.
Deborah is mother.

Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother.

It is amazing how far folk will go to minimise statements made in praise of the blessed virgin Mary. Truly amazing.

 

[mmksparbud]

It is amazing how far folk will go to minimise statements made in praise of the blessed virgin Mary. Truly amazing.

Do you consider the statement of Christ amazingly minimalistic??

 

[MoreCoffee]

Do you consider the statement of Christ amazingly minimalistic??

No, but the way I've seen you explain it in previous posts is definitely minimalist!