Do you agree that Christians should obey all 613 commandments?

[SolomonVII]

Those who live by the sword die by the sword.

Same can be said about the law, apparently.

 

[tzadik]

Those who live by the sword die by the sword.

Same can be said about the law, apparently.

Apparently the same can be said about the Word of God (Heb 4:12).
Get excited.

Unless of course we are misinterpreting Scripture

 

[tzadik]

Your quote has an interesting end to it.

Which is worse, to break the commands and teach others to do so also, and be the least in heaven on account of that, or to (somewhat) obey and teach the commandments, but not enter heaven at all in spite of this, on account of lack of sufficient righteousness?

I’d rather keep God’s Commandments and teach others to keep God’s commandments as He instructed me to in Matthew 28:19 then either of those. Thanks though.

Follow him instead, because his yoke is light.

3. By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
4. The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
5. but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him:
6. the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

 

[brinny]

I’d rather keep God’s Commandments and teach others to keep God’s commandments as He instructed me to in Matthew 28:19 then either of those. Thanks though.


3. By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
4. The one who says, "I have come to know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
5. but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him:
6. the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

"He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

which commandments was He speaking of?

 

[tzadik]

which commandments was He speaking of?

His Commandments are not dividable.
He doesn't say teach only these 20, or these 30 or these 2 even. Even in Matthew 22:40 He tells us that the ENTIRE LAW of GOD hangs or depends on Love God and love your neighbor. Those two don't replace His Law.

God's Commandments, ALL of them are truth. All of His Commandments are Holy. All of His Commandments are His Word.

So you tell me which commandments are not included in Matthew 4:4.
"But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God."

Or 2 Timothy 3:16-17
"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."


Or Hebrews 4:12-13
"For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do."

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
which commandments was He speaking of?

His Commandments are not dividable.
He doesn't say teach only these 20, or these 30 or these 2 even. Even in Matthew 22:40 He tells us that the ENTIRE LAW of GOD hangs or depends on Love God and love your neighbor. Those two don't replace His Law.

God's Commandments, ALL of them are truth. All of His Commandments are Holy. All of His Commandments are His Word.
So you tell me which commandments are not included in Matthew 4:4.
Or 2 Timothy 3:16, or Hebrews 4:12.

please list the commandments He was speaking of.

thank you.

 

[SolomonVII]

Apparently the same can be said about the Word of God (Heb 4:12).
Get excited.

Unless of course we are misinterpreting Scripture

Can the same really be said, that whosoever lives by the word of God, dies by the Word of God (since the word of God is sharper than a two edged-sword and able to discern our evil)?

Are we misinterpreting then>

Read on in Hebrews 4:

Jesus, Compassionate High Priest.

14
* Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus, the Son of God, let us hold fast to our confession.h
15
For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has similarly been tested in every way, yet without sin.i
16
So let us confidently approach the throne of grace to receive mercy and to find grace for timely help.j

Sinners look to the cross, and be saved.

The fact that God loves us to the point of dying for us— and is a God of mercy— gives the evil sinners an unconditional assurance that the law never will.

Those who live in the Word of God, die in the Word of the God, true enough, butare reborn in the Risen Christ, just as assuredly.

That is our Christian faith.

 

[Wally Cleaver]

But just remember that Jesus came because all the scribes and all the pharisees had fallen short, and had been broken by that yoke.

He came to reverse the curse of deut. 28 which was for forsaking the law, i.e. "I came for the lost sheep of the House of Israel" (10 lost tribes).

Ah, what an interesting job God has given to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. First we were lost and thought to be gentiles, now instead of simply proving that we are the Israelites and the covenant is ours, we're charged with showing how even the gentiles can be saved and should follow the law, as though we were gentiles. When really it'd be a lot easier to show how we are Israelites, and therefore obviously we should keep the law.

 

[SolomonVII]

He came to reverse the curse of deut. 28 which was for forsaking the law, i.e. "I came for the lost sheep of the House of Israel" (10 lost tribes).

Ah, what an interesting job God has given to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. First we were lost and thought to be gentiles, now instead of simply proving that we are the Israelites and the covenant is ours, we're charged with showing how even the gentiles can be saved and should follow the law, as though we were gentiles. When really it'd be a lot easier to show how we are Isrealites, and therefore obviously we should keep the law.

Teach the law and obey the law most certainly, and you will be great in heaven.

 

[tzadik]

Sinners look to the cross, and be saved.

The fact that God loves us to the point of dying for us— and is a God of mercy— gives the evil sinners an unconditional assurance that the law never will.

Those who live in the Word of God, die in the Word of the God, true enough, butare reborn in the Risen Christ, just as assuredly.

That is our Christian faith.

When oh when will they realize that the Law does NOT = redemption.
Messiah and the cross = Redemption
The Law of God = Instruction
Redemption does not REPLACE Instruction.
Instruction does not REPLACE Redemption.
Once we are redeemed we follow Instruction.
Why is this so hard?

Do you reject food for nourishment, growth and maturity, because it wasn’t the FOOD that brought you into this world?
Why then are we soooooo set on getting rid of the nourishing and nurturing and guiding Word of God, because we were not saved by it???

God’s Law will ALWAYS be for Instruction.
Until we live a sinless life and NEED no more teach man his neighbor, because everyone will know the Lord. Until then—like David I say

7. The law of the LORD is perfect, restoring the soul;
The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
8. The precepts of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart;
The commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9. The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring forever;
The judgments of the LORD are true; they are righteous altogether.
10. They are more desirable than gold, yes, than much fine gold;
Sweeter also than honey and the drippings of the honeycomb.
11. Moreover, by them Your servant is warned;
In keeping them there is great reward.

 

[tzadik]

please list the commandments He was speaking of.

thank you.

All of God's Commandments.

Which commandments are not included in Matthew 4:4.
"But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God."

Or 2 Timothy 3:16-17
"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."


Or Hebrews 4:12-13
"For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do."

 

[SolomonVII]

which commandments was He speaking of?

A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

I think that about sums it up.

(A nice light yoke for those of us who can't even concentrate enough to count to 613, let alone remember all 613 commandments and apply them correctly to the facets of our life as they arise).




Edit to add: But for those who have to love me, it might be easier to go with the 613.

 

[tzadik]

A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.

I think that about sums it up.

(A nice light yoke for those of us who can't even concentrate enough to count to 613, let alone remember all 613 commandments and apply them correctly to the facets of our life as they arise).

In other words God the Son cancelled all of God the Father's Commandments and replaced them with One Commandment.

hmmm

 

[SolomonVII]

In other words God the Son cancelled all of God the Father's Commandments and replaced them with One Commandment.

hmmm

I never said that.
I just looked up Wally's verse, and noticed how Jesus handled it.

"Teach the law and obey it and you will be great in heaven".

(Just make sure that your righteousness is greater than that of the pharisees, and scribes, that's all).

 

[tzadik]

I never said that.
I just looked up Wally's verse, and noticed how Jesus handled it.

"Teach the law and obey it and you will be great in heaven".

(Just make sure that your righteousness is greater than that of the pharisees, and scribes, that's all).

Are you saying that God's yoke was too heavy, so Messiah brought a lighter yoke for 'those who can't concentrate'?

 

[brinny]

Originally Posted by brinny
please list the commandments He was speaking of.

thank you.

All of God's Commandments.

Which commandments are not included in Matthew 4:4.
"But he answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God."

Or 2 Timothy 3:16-17
"All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work."


Or Hebrews 4:12-13
"For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart. And there is no creature hidden from His sight, but all things are open and laid bare to the eyes of Him with whom we have to do."

Here we got spiritual manna, literally living bread that is, Jesus Himself, as He is the Word, and as demonstrated in the last supper when he said:

"And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body." ~Matthew 26:26

He was "manna' in the flesh, our spiritual bread. He is the spiritual bread also, literally spiritual "manna' that feeds us when we read His Word.

 

[JRSut1000]

And He doesnt make His own Word void...

 

[tzadik]

Here we got spiritual manna, literally living bread that is, Jesus Himself, as He is the Word, and as demonstrated in the last supper when he said:

"And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body." ~Matthew 26:26

He was "manna' in the flesh, our spiritual bread. He is the spiritual bread also, literally spiritual "manna' that feeds us when we read His Word.

If Messiah IS the Word of God, do you believe it would be safe to say that He would be ALL of God's Word?
Or do you think that when John 1:14 says that the Word of God became flesh, it was ONLY referring to "part of God's Word"?

 

[brinny]

And He doesnt make His own Word void...

you hit on a truth there, but i thinks we're seeing it differently

 

[SolomonVII]

Are you saying that God's yoke was too heavy, so Messiah brought a lighter yoke for 'those who can't concentrate'?

Well when it comes to yokes, I believe it was the apostles discussing how the yoke of the law was too great for the Jews to carry in Acts 15, I think, and it was Jesus himself that called for people to come to him, for his yoke was easy and his burden light.

Matthew 11

28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

Jesus has always had a special appeal to— a special mission even as he elucidated upon by quoting Isaiah in the synagogue at the beginning of his ministry— those who have been crushed by the world's burdens, for those who, like you say "can't concentrate".

Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear?