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Nope not at all. And you don't provide any discussion on the statement. Why? What is offered is ad hominem.i can't even believe you went there!
you must be getting desperate to defend your position!
Surely there must not be anything such as reality.maybe this will help:
Matthew 19:4-6(NKJV)
4And He answered and said to them, Have you not read that He who made them at the beginning made them male and female,
5and said, For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh?
6So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.
since God created the institution of marriage, how can we say that it's regulated by the man's government?
Is it who changed things or who one submits to? Do or did you not submit to the government in the matter of course assuming you're married?who changed things?
Is this what you are looking for?
Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
1 Peter 2:13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;
1 Peter 2:14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.
When there is no government, there is anarchy because of the sin and selfishness of fallen man. The role of government is to maintain peace and order in this wicked world, to punish evil and to reward righteousness.
Nope you're trying to get me to say that I follow the law. Fat and Last Chance left town a long timae ago ad said they weren't ever coming back. II was responding to scratch. I showed the basis for law without marriage.
I think the issue before us is following the law and a law and what law is followed. There is an issue what a legal marriage is. Here in the states the right is regulated by the state and not God. The church has submitted to the state and not God on the matter. If indeed the insitution of marriage is still regulated by God why submit to the state for permission to marry or divorce? Let the unregenerate do so as they give no credence to God.The first question is: who gave a person the authority to marry?
Second question is: Who gave a person the authority to divorce?
Third question is: What said the Bible about divorce.. and what does the state saying about divorce.
The point that I wanted to make is... And I think in the US it is the same as Holland. There is a separation between church and state.
What mean here in Holland: The Bible isn't leading when we make the law. It is possible here to make laws against the will of God.
The idea you present is submitting to a rule list (called law or the law) opposed to following the leading of the Holy Spirit which doesn't lead us to follow a rule list. A Christian doesn't submit to the lusts of the flesh or the law - Gal 5:19-21.My point was, whether we are married or not we're commanded to abstain from fornication. Fornication being intercourse outside marriage.
It is being used to point one to the law. Fornication is a distracting side issue.Yes but then we get into other works of the flesh and get off subject. Abstaining from fornication is backed by the word commandment in scripture, thats why i use it for an example. But i would agree it includes those things.
I certianly agree with you on submission to the government as the scripture states. This opens up to more issues like abortion. It is legal and protected by the state and I see christians saying it isn't sin. I shake my head in disbelief. Now is it the Christian that causes disorder in marriage? Please understand what I'm saying here. Christians have by in large submitted to the wicked in the area of government and we have a wicked government. A wicked government was never meant to be by God. I really don't wish to get into the subject. But this is certianly an issue.Is this what you are looking for?
Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
1 Peter 2:13 Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme;
1 Peter 2:14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.
When there is no government, there is anarchy because of the sin and selfishness of fallen man. The role of government is to maintain peace and order in this wicked world, to punish evil and to reward righteousness.
I agree...God wants His people to obey civil government, but there is a limit: when the government requires disobedience to God, (Acts 4:19-20; 5:29; Daniel 6:10) God does not require obedience to man's laws if in so obeying the Christian is forced to disobey the Scriptures.I certianly agree with you on submission to the government as the scripture states. This opens up to more issues like abortion. It is legal and protected by the state and I see christians saying it isn't sin. I shake my head in disbelief. Now is it the Christian that causes disorder in marriage? Please understand what I'm saying here. Christians have by in large submitted to the wicked in the area of government and we have a wicked government. A wicked government was never meant to be by God. I really don't wish to get into the subject. But this is certianly an issue.
Amen. Fornication is complicated. It's a capital crime in the Old Testament. In the New Testament, it's a crime that gets you sent to hell.
Not necessarily. Some verses list both and next to each other. So there must be a difference.
Your first sentence is my point exactly.
Many Christians do love to throw this definition for fornication around and claim it as an absolute truth. Scripture, however, does not support it as being sex out of marriage.
Each to his own. Let them be fully persuaded in their own mind. If you wish to follow a list of rules more power to ya. I deeply resent anyone trying to push something I've not reasonable or legal obligation to adhear to. That is conversion. I have no objection to personal testimony and this has gone way beyond that to a conversion attempt. I validate no one. We both think each is unreasonable. I don't think you can jsutify your position considering the whole Bible. Part of which is clearly rejected. Sorry, but not an apology.
Then please tell me why the religous community submits to civil government and not God in religious issues such as the marriage ceremony and rite.
Many Christians do love to throw this definition for fornication around and claim it as an absolute truth. Scripture, however, does not support it as being sex out of marriage.
Nope you're trying to get me to say that I follow the law. Fat and Last Chance left town a long timae ago ad said they weren't ever coming back. I
It is being used to point one to the law. Fornication is a distracting side issue.
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