Do we need to be baptized in order to be saved ?

[Guojing]

There is no difference between being justified by faith and being justified through faith. Both are ways of saying that we receive justification (the accounting of the righteousness of Jesus being given to us in God's ledger, and our unrighteousness being accounted to Jesus on the cross) when we exhibit our living, active faith in Jesus.

The bible has

• different instructions to
• different groups of people at
• different times

regarding salvation requirements.

Instead of rightly dividing the word of truth, what he and you are doing is merely standing firm on those different instructions and disagreeing with each other based on them.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The bible has

• different instructions to
• different groups of people at
• different times

regarding salvation requirements.

Instead of rightly dividing the word of truth, what he and you are doing is merely standing firm on those different instructions and disagreeing with each other based on them.

Um this is in error

salvation has been by grace through faith since noah. Salvation could never be earned, because the wage of sin is death

DEATH is the payment of sin (spiritual) so only death of an innocent could pay for sin.

Thats what the sacrifices of the law show. Thats what God showed hwhen he covered Adam and Eve after killing an innocent animal. Thats what God did on the cross.

I would recommend you do not insist someone else rightly divide the word when you do not.. Look inside before you attack someone else.

 

[Valletta]

Um this is in error

salvation has been by grace through faith since noah. Salvation could never be earned, because the wage of sin is death

DEATH is the payment of sin (spiritual) so only death of an innocent could pay for sin.

Thats what the sacrifices of the law show. Thats what God showed hwhen he covered Adam and Eve after killing an innocent animal. Thats what God did on the cross.

I would recommend you do not insist someone else rightly divide the word when you do not.. Look inside before you attack someone else.

To get back to the topic of the thread, the only way we know to be saved is through the sacrament of Baptism. However, I believe in the great mercy of God and thus believe there is great hope for those not baptized into the Christian faith.

 

[Danthemailman]

time to stop feeding someone..

Sadly, too many folks feed on God's word (filtered through their preconceived beliefs and biased church doctrines). This results in "eisegesis" (the process of interpreting a text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases). It is commonly referred to as reading into the text. It is often done to prove a preconceived belief, and to provide confirmation bias corresponding with the pre-held interpretation and any agendas supported by it.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

To get back to the topic of the thread, the only way we know to be saved is through the sacrament of Baptism. However, I believe in the great mercy of God and thus believe there is great hope for those not baptized into the Christian faith.

I was baptized by God himself.

Anyone relying on a work to be saved is not relying on God

There is one way to heaven not multiple ways.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Sadly, too many folks feed on God's word (filtered through their preconceived beliefs and biased church doctrines). This results in "eisegesis" (the process of interpreting a text in such a way as to introduce one's own presuppositions, agendas or biases). It is commonly referred to as reading into the text. It is often done to prove a preconceived belief, and to provide confirmation bias corresponding with the pre-held interpretation and any agendas supported by it.

Sadly people can’t let go of self. Wither their sins or their pride of not being able to make up for their sins without some work.

 

[Guojing]

Um this is in error

salvation has been by grace through faith since noah. Salvation could never be earned, because the wage of sin is death

DEATH is the payment of sin (spiritual) so only death of an innocent could pay for sin.

Thats what the sacrifices of the law show. Thats what God showed hwhen he covered Adam and Eve after killing an innocent animal. Thats what God did on the cross.

I would recommend you do not insist someone else rightly divide the word when you do not.. Look inside before you attack someone else.

Salvation has always been by grace through faith, agree.

But it has not always been by grace through faith alone

You understand the difference?

I am not attacking anyone, merely offering a reconciling comment.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Salvation has always been by grace through faith, agree.

But it has not always been by grace through faith alone

It has never been by grace and works. Otherwise grace is no longer grace.

and it has always been by faith alone. Because it takes faith to recieve grace, if you do not trust God. You will not receive it, You will reject it. Or you will try to work for it.

Do you understand the difference?

You understand the difference?

I am not attacking anyone, merely offering a reconciling comment.

You’re attacking the cross. Claiming that any mans work could even remove 1 sin and allow God to forgive a person

 

[Guojing]

It has never been by grace and works. Otherwise grace is no longer grace.

and it has always been by faith alone. Because it takes faith to recieve grace, if you do not trust God. You will not receive it, You will reject it. Or you will try to work for it.

Do you understand the difference?

You’re attacking the cross. Claiming that any mans work could even remove 1 sin and allow God to forgive a person

We have went through the logical flow when we discussed Noah already.

If it was always by faith alone, then Noah don't need to build an ark, just believe that there is a flood, and God will still save him.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

We have went through the logical flow when we discussed Noah already.

If it was always by faith alone, then Noah don't need to build an ark, just believe that there is a flood, and God will still save him.

Yeah we did and you were proven to be in error

 

[Guojing]

Yeah we did and you were proven to be in error

We are always the protagonist from our own point of view

 

[Eternally Grateful]

We are always the protagonist from our own point of view

Salvation is by grace

Grace is unearned by no works period

So Noah was not saved because he worked he was saved by grace because he had faith his faith kept him working

 

[Guojing]

Salvation is by grace

Grace is unearned by no works period

So Noah was not saved because he worked he was saved by grace because he had faith his faith kept him working

No doubt Noah was saved by his faith, but he had to demonstrate that faith by building the ark.

But today, we don't need to demonstrate our faith by any work, after believing the gospel found in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, and we will still be saved (Romans 4:5).

You understand there is a difference in the above 2 salvation requirements?

 

[ARBITER01]

So Noah was not saved because he worked he was saved by grace because he had faith his faith kept him working

Correct.

It was faith that initiated the work and kept him going. Without the faith, no desire, no work.

Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ. I live verily, yet now not I, but Christ liveth in me. The life which I now live in the flesh, I live by the faith of the son of God, which loved me, and gave himself for me.

 

[Guojing]

Correct.

It was faith that initiated the work and kept him going. Without the faith, no desire, no work.

Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ. I live verily, yet now not I, but Christ liveth in me. The life which I now live in the flesh, I live by the faith of the son of God, which loved me, and gave himself for me.

I agree that Noah was saved by his faith.

That was never the disagreement.

 

[Danthemailman]

Salvation is by grace

Grace is unearned by no works period

So Noah was not saved because he worked he was saved by grace because he had faith his faith kept him working

Amen! Noah had already "found grace" (Genesis 6:8), was "a preacher of righteousness" (2 Peter 2:5), and "walked with God" before he built the ark. His obedience was a demonstration of his faith and not the origin of it. Building the ark demonstrated that Noah believed God about flooding the earth and the ark saved Noah and his family (physically) from drowning. (Hebrews 11:17)

 

[Eternally Grateful]

No doubt Noah was saved by his faith, but he had to demonstrate that faith by building the ark.

He was saved

But today, we don't need to demonstrate our faith by any work, after believing the gospel found in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, and we will still be saved (Romans 4:5).

You are commanded to work also. As Paul said in eph 2:10. We were created for good works

You have your ark to build. Have you done it are you doing it?

You understand there is a difference in the above 2 salvation requirements?

There is one requirement

Abraham believed. Noah believed. I believed

We were all saved by that faith. No work was involved period

 

[Danthemailman]

He was saved

You are commanded to work also. As Paul said in eph 2:10. We were created for good works

You have your ark to build. Have you done it are you doing it?

There is one requirement

Abraham believed. Noah believed. I believed

We were all saved by that faith. No work was involved period

Romans 4:2-6 sums it right up. 1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. 5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Romans 4:2-6 sums it right up. 1 What then shall we say that Abraham our father has found according to the flesh? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 4 Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. 5 But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works:

Why is it so hard for them to understand

 

[Guojing]

He was saved

You are commanded to work also. As Paul said in eph 2:10. We were created for good works

You have your ark to build. Have you done it are you doing it?

Can you be more specific if you believe we also need to do works today to demonstrate our faith?

What kind of work?

There is one requirement

Abraham believed. Noah believed. I believed

We were all saved by that faith. No work was involved period

If you are willing to say "If Noah believed there is a flood but chose not to build an ark, he would still have been saved",

then I will see that you really believed that "no work was involved period".

But you kept avoiding making that clear statement.