Do Not Resuscitate? - Real ethical decisions

[timothyu]

It becomes a tough ethical question when it becomes one of God's will be done, or ours.

 

[Tigger45]

Alzheimer’s killed my dad. We (his family) and the medical staff honored his directive to not prolong his agony.

 

[Occams Barber]

Alzheimer’s killed my dad. We (his family) and the medical staff honored his directive to not prolong his agony.

Hi Tigger

I think your experience also emphasises the importance of making an Advanced Directive setting out your wishes in the event of an end-of-life situation.

It not only makes it clear what you want, it also relieves your family of the awful decision of trying to second guess where you stand.

OB

 

[seeking.IAM]

I am POA for my 100-year-old mother. She asked for a DNR order probably 5 years or so ago. She had lived a long life, she was a tired person of faith, and she was ready to go when the time came. That was fine for me as a hypothetical decision. And then she got COVID-19 as a still otherwise pretty healthy 100-year-old.

It was gut wrenching when the facility called me to re-affirm the DNR order in case the COVID progressed. I found it a lot harder to be ready to implement now that it was more real than hypotethical. I was fortunate that she was still coherent and could have a conversation with me about the possible outcomes of COVID-19 to reaffirm her DNR wish. I recorded our phone call for my siblings who were wavering on the order. It was a lonely decision because it would be mine in the end, not theirs. Mom survived COVID-19 months ago. I know how hard it is to think about and I'm glad the order was not needed for her. She is now in the final days of her life and will slip away peacefully and naturally, a course that cannot be reversed.

I realize for me, it was all about my not being ready to let go. But, it's not about me. These are tough things, nonetheless, because you are now involved in a loved one's death in a way you might not be under other circumstances. I give my sympathies to care givers involved in such decisions. May God bless them.

 

[Tigger45]

Hi Tigger

I think your experience also emphasises the importance of making an Advanced Directive setting out your wishes in the event of an end-of-life situation.

It not only makes it clear what you want, it also relieves your family of the awful decision of trying to second guess where you stand.

OB

Right. He watched his mother lay five years in a semi comatose state in her last stages of Alzheimer’s which I believe that she would of wanted her life to be preserved as long as possible but seeing that was one of the main factors of my dad choosing practically just the opposite decision of DNR. I’d have to say seeing the effects of their choices (he passed in less than two weeks) I’ve chosen the latter also.

 

[Occams Barber]

I am POA for my 100-year-old mother. She asked for a DNR order probably 5 years or so ago. She had lived a long life, she was a tired person of faith, and she was ready to go when the time came. That was fine for me as a hypothetical decision. And then she got COVID-19 as a still otherwise pretty healthy 100-year-old.

It was gut wrenching when the facility called me to re-affirm the DNR order in case the COVID progressed. I found it a lot harder to be ready to implement now that it was more real than hypotethical. I was fortunate that she was still coherent and could have a conversation with me about the possible outcomes of COVID-19 to reaffirm her DNR wish. I recorded our phone call for my siblings who were wavering on the order. It was a lonely decision because it would be mine in the end, not theirs. Mom survived COVID-19 months ago. I know how hard it is to think about and I'm glad the order was not needed for her. She is now in the final days of her life and will slip away peacefully and naturally, a course that cannot be reversed.

I realize for me, it was all about my not being ready to let go. But, it's not about me. These are tough things, nonetheless, because you are now involved in a loved one's death in a way you might not be under other circumstances. I give my sympathies to care givers involved in such decisions. May God bless them.

One of the problems of implementing a DNR directive on behalf of someone else is that it runs counter to all our natural inclinations. If a younger person, or a normally healthy person, in your family were to become extremely ill your natural reaction would be to use all medical means possible to keep them alive on the assumption that cure is a real probability. This might include invasive surgery or debilitating chemotherapy or dialysis or aggressive CPR. In the 'normal' situation we accept that the 'end' (an ongoing quality life) justifies the 'means' (painful or invasive medical procedures etc,).

In the case of DNR we are saying the opposite - the 'end' (pain and discomfort leading to death in the relatively short term) does not justify the means (painful or invasive medical procedures).

Add to this the personal emotional loss of letting go, the sense of guilt that we may somehow be responsible for our loved one's death and the whole experience can be an emotional struggle.

OB

 

[Occams Barber]

It becomes a tough ethical question when it becomes one of God's will be done, or ours.

It's a tough ethical question even without God's will being a consideration.

OB

 

[dogs4thewin]

Thank God my parents answered those questions for themselves when they were deemed mentally capable to account for themselves.

My dad had a DNR ( turned out he did not need it as his battle with cancer ended at home. His mother however did not leaving him and his baby brother G to make that choice for her on the operating table. I am glad that my father spared my mother, sister and me that decision . My mother as far as I know has no such advanced directives actually written.

 

[Tigger45]

My dad had a DNR ( turned out he did not need it as his battle with cancer ended at home. His mother however did not leaving him and his baby brother G to make that choice for her on the operating table. I am glad that my father spared my mother, sister and me that decision . My mother as far as I know has no such advanced directives actually written.

A good way to initiate the conversation might be bringing up your preferences, maybe starting with cremation or burial and see where it leads.