setst777 said: ↑
The average profile of a terrorist is a person from a good family and is not living in poverty.
Joseph Responds:
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Can you provide a source for this?
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Setst RE:
The middle-class terrorists: More than 60pc of suspects are well educated and from comfortable backgrounds, says secret M15 file | Daily Mail Online
Islamic Terrorists not Poor and Illiterate, but Rich and Educated
Terrorism - Wikipedia [Heading: “Perpetrators”]
setst777 said: ↑
Almost all terrorist attacks are from Islam. The following list only shows major terrorist attacks around the world, but does not include the many terrorist activities within the Muslim nations themselves.
Joseph responds:
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Once again, Islamic terrorism on the scale we have seen over the past decade or so is a recent phenomenon.
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Setst RE: I am only concerned about where and, by who, terrorism is occurring, and if it is founded on sharia by Muslims to
justify acts of terrorism to solve their issues. That is certainly the case.
Joseph writes:
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Studies have shown that religion is not the primary factor.
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Setst RE: With Islam, religion is the basis for the strategies used to deal with their issues. That is why everyone has heard of the common battle cry, “
Allahu Akbar” when those acts are committed. That is why, when their cells are raided, many times quotes from the Qur'an and Hadith are found about conquering unbelievers for Islam.
Joseph, you then go into a prolonged emphasis on suicide bombings. They happen in Islam, and is only one of many methods used to carry out acts of terrorism – whether through taqyah, intimidation, threats, political warfare, social warfare, cyber crime or actual physical attacks etc. This is all in accordance with Sharia and the methods described in Sharia, which I listed for you from "
Reliance of the Traveller."
setst777 said: ↑
Whether you like it or not, the later Medina verses are the violent, political, military and controlling aspect of the Qur’an which precedes the earlier peaceful verses. The peaceful all inclusive earlier verses cannot be reconciled by the later violent non-accommodating verses. That is why the later verses replace the earlier ones, just as the Qur’an, Hadith and Sira and Tafsir teach.
Joseph responds:
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The only people you will find teaching that the older verses in the Qur'an that promote peace, tolerance, and coexistence have been superseded by verses revealed later in the Qur'an that promote war and violence are extremists and anti-Islamic propagandists.
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Setst RE: Your responses are so very gullible, bigoted and biased against Islam. Calling fundamental Muslims, and their scholars, extremists and anti-Islamic propagandists while proclaiming the hypocrites as the real Muslims is just plain evil and naive.
Here are some Meccan verses that are clearly peaceful and non-offensive
Qur’an 109:
1. Say: "Oh, you who disbelieve!
2. "I do not worship that which you worship,
3. "Nor do you worship That Which I worship.
4. "Nor will I worship that which you have been worshipping,
5. "Neither will you worship That Which I worship.
6. "To you your religion and to me mine."
Qur’an 2:256 Let there be no compulsion in religion.
Qur’an 2:62 Those who believe and those who are
Jews and
Christians, and
Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day and do righteous good
deeds shall have their reward with their Lord, on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
Qur'an 5:69 Surely, those who believe (in the Oneness of Allah, in His Messenger Muhammad and all that was revealed to him from Allah),
and those who are the
Jews and the
Sabians and the
Christians - whosoever believed in Allah and the Last Day, and worked righteousness,
on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
Qur'an 5:48 And We have sent down to you (O Muhammad ) the Book (this Qur'an) in truth, confirming the Scripture [ma bayna yadayhi: "that which is with you," (the Taurat (Torah) and the Gospel (Injeel) and [Mohayminan: trustworthy in highness and a watcher] over it (the previous Scriptures
). So judge between them by what Allah has revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging away from the truth that has come to you.
To each among you, We have prescribed a law and a clear way.
If Allah willed, He would have made you one nation, but that (He) may test you in what He has given you;
so strive as in a race in good deeds.
The return of you (all) is to Allah; then He will inform you about that in which you used to differ.
Qur’an 2:190 And fight in the Way of Allah
those who fight you,
but transgress not the limits. Truly, Allah likes not the transgressors. [This Verse is the first one that was revealed in connection with Jihad, but it was supplemented by another (V.9:36) Noble Quran]
Qur’an 5:32 For that cause We decreed for the Children of Israel that whosoever killeth a human being for other than manslaughter or corruption in the earth, it shall be as if he had killed all mankind, and whoso saveth the life of one, it shall be as if he had saved the life of all mankind.
These are very peaceful sounding verses of the Meccan period, even including Christians and Jews as saved along with Muslims, and which we all live side by side until we meet Allah who will then tell us where we differed (Q 5:48).
Quranic exegesis state that any inclusive and peaceful verses are abrogated by the later violent verses.
Muhsin Khan, [
1927 AD the translator of Sahih al-Bukhari and the Qur'an, entitled The Noble Qur'an, which he completed along with Muhammad Taqi-ud-Din al-Hilali], says God revealed "Ultimatum" in order to discard restraint and to command Muslims to fight against all the pagans as well as against the People of the Book if they do not embrace Islam or until they pay religious taxes. So, at first aggressive fighting was forbidden; it later became permissible (
2:190) and subsequently obligatory (9:5).
[Muhsin Khan, "Introduction," in ibid., pp. xxiv-xxv.]
This "verse of the sword" (
9:5) abrogated, canceled, and replaced 124 verses that called for tolerance, compassion, and peace.
[
Ibn Hazm, An-Nasikh wal-Mansukh, pp. 19, 27; Muhi al-Din Ibn al-'Arabi, Tafsir al-Qur'an al-Krim (Beirut: Dar al-Andalus, 1978), p. 69; Burton, The Encyclopedia of Islam, vol. 7, s.v. "Naskh," p. 1010; Salama, An-Nasikh wal-Mansukh, p. 130, mentioned only 114.]
Suyuti [1445–1505 AD; aka Jalaluddin; an Egyptian of Persian origin. Historian, biographer, jurist, teacher and scholar of Islamic theology; he was one of the most prolific writers of the Middle Ages.] Suyuti said that everything in the Qur'an about forgiveness and peace is abrogated by verse
9:5, which orders Muslims to fight the unbelievers and to establish God's kingdom on earth
[
Suyuti, Al-Itqan fi ‘Ulum al-Qur'an, part 1, pp. 60, 65, 164.]
Chapter 9 of the Qur'an, in English called "Ultimatum," is the most important concerning the issues of abrogation and jihad against unbelievers. It is the only chapter that does not begin "in the name of God, most benevolent, ever-merciful."
[
See explanations, Suyuti, Al-Itqan fi ‘Ulum al-Qur'an, part 1, pp. 60, 65, 164.]
Isma'il bin Kathir [
1301-1373 AD, was a student under Ibn Taymiyya and an influential Qur'an interpreter]: bin Kathir, in his commentary on
Chapter 9:5, expressed that jihad involves death and the killing of men, God draws attention to the fact that disbelief, polytheism, and avoidance of God's path as shown by the Qur'an are worse than killing them.
[
Ibn Kathir, Tafsir of Ibn Kathir, vol. 4, pp. 375-7.]
According to bin Kathir in his commentary on
Chapter 9:5, Abu Bakr al-Siddiq, the first caliph, used this and other verses to validate fighting anyone who either did not pay religious taxes to the Muslims or convert to Islam. Ibn ‘Umar Ibn al-Khattab, one of the hadith transmitters, quoted Muhammad as saying, "
I have been commanded to fight the people until they testify that there is no deity worthy of worship except God and that Muhammad is the Messenger of God." He testified that Ad-Dahhak bin Muzahim, an authentic transmitter of hadiths, said that the
verse of the sword "
abrogated every agreement of peace between the Prophet and any idolater, every treaty, and every term." ‘Awfi cited Ibn ‘Abbas, who argued that "Ultimatum" obviated earlier peace treaties.
[
Ibn Kathir, Tafsir of Ibn Kathir, vol. 4, pp. 375-7.]
Mohammed Said Ramadan Al-Bouti [
Notable Sunni Muslim scholar (a contemporary Al-Azhar University scholar) who was also known as "Shaykh of the Levant". Called a "prolific writer whose sermons were regularly broadcast on television," and "more familiar to Syrian TV viewers than anybody other than President Bashar al-Assad", Al-Bouti authored more than sixty books on various Islamic issues, and was considered an important scholar of the approach based on the four schools of Sunni Islam and the orthodox Ash'arite creed - the foremost theological school of Sunni Islam which established an orthodox dogmatic guideline based on clerical authority, founded by the Arab theologian Abu al-Hasan al-Ashʿari (d. 936 / AH 324)].
Muhammad Sa‘id Ramadan al-Buti wrote that "the verse (
9:5) does not leave any room in the mind to conjecture about what is called defensive war. This verse asserts that holy war, which is demanded in Islamic law, is not a defensive war because it could legitimately be an offensive war. That is the apex and most honorable of all holy wars. Its goal is the exaltation of the word of God, the construction of Islamic society, and the establishment of God's kingdom on earth regardless of the means. It is legal to carry on an offensive holy war."
Muhammad Sa‘id Ramadan al-Buti also wrote that defensive warfare in Islam is nothing but a phase of the Islamic mission that the Prophet practiced. After that, it was followed by another phase; that is, calling all people to embrace Islam. Even for People of the Book, there can be no role except conversion to Islam or subjugation to Muslim rule. Hence, Muhammad's statement, "
They would not invade you, but you invade them."
[
Muhammad Sa'id Ramadan al-Buti, Jurisprudence in Muhammad's Biography (Damascus: Dar al-Fikr, 2001), pp. 323-4.]
Muhammad Sa‘id Ramadan al-Buti also wrote:
"The Holy War, as it is known in Islamic Jurisprudence, is basically an offensive war. This is the duty of Muslims in every age when the needed military power becomes available to them. This is the phase in which the meaning of Holy War has taken its final form. Thus the apostle of God said: ‘I was commanded to fight the people until they believe in God and his message ..."’
[
Jurisprudence in Muhammad’s Biography, p 134, 7th edition]
See also:
List of Abrogations in the Qur'an
List of Abrogations in the Qur'an - WikiIslam
Here are some of many of the violent offensive verses and Sahih Hadith that clearly abrogate the peaceful, inclusive, non-offensive Qur’anic verses per the consensus of Islamic Scholars…
Qur’an 3:85 Whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers."
3:85 abrogates
2:62 and
5:64, which clearly taught the faithful Christians, Sabeans and Jews were also saved along with Muslims and need not grieve.
Qur’an 9:29 [
verse of the Sword]Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allah, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued.
Sahih Muslim 1:33 …the Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah
Qur’an 9:33 It is He Who hath sent His Messenger with Guidance and the Religion of Truth, to prevail it over all religion, even though the unbelievers may detest (it).
Qur'an 4:
55. Of them were (some) who believed in him (Muhammad ), and of them were (some) who averted their faces from him (Muhammad ); and enough is Hell for burning (them).
Quran 9:73 O Prophet! strive hard against the
unbelievers and the
hypocrites and be unyielding to them; and their abode is hell, and evil is the destination.
Quran 66:9 O Prophet! Strive against the
disbelievers and the
hypocrites, and be stern with them. Hell will be their home, a hapless journey's end.
The inclusion of "
hypocrites" within the above two quoted Qur'anic verses and Sahih Hadith also contradicts any defense that the targets of hate and hostility are wartime foes, since there was never an opposing army made up of non-religious Muslims in Muhammad's time.
Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, and I have been made victorious with terror (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand." Abu Huraira added:
Allah's Apostle has left the world and now you, people, are bringing out those treasures (i.e. the Prophet did not benefit by them).
Fighting for the Cause of Allah (Jihaad)
Sahi Bukhari :: Book 4 :: Volume 52 :: Hadith 220
NOTE that Jihad was understood as the unceasing quest to ‘make Allah's word supreme,’ as Hadiths described, through the ongoing expansion of the rule of God’s law on earth through terror, plunder, and war '
bringing those treasures in that Muhammad began to do.'
Joseph wrote:
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Once again, the Qur'an was written over 1,400 years ago. What you are reading in the Qur'an are verses that were supposedly revealed at different times in Muhammad’s life.
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Setst RE: Your understanding is myth – not in accordance with the best Islamic scholarship and Sahih Hadith.
setst777 said: ↑
So, to say that all these Christians schools that happily receive David Wood to teach must be illegitimate is totally biased of you.
Joseph responds
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Can you provide a list of Christian schools that have invited David Wood to teach?
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Setst RE: I will let you look them up, because this will be a good lesson for you on how to witness to Muslims. I have views at least 55 of his youtube videos giving lectures, teaching and debate at various Universities, Christian Academies, Churches and schools throughout the country. That is how Dr. Wood makes most of his income.
setst777 said: ↑
Your argument that Sharia can be adapted to be peaceful and conform to modern life is a fallacy.
Joseph responds:
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Then how do you explain the hundreds of millions of Muslims that currently practice Shari'a in modern developed countries today?
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Setst RE: No nation or group today implements Sharia – only parts of it.
In fact, Sharia itself teaches that Muslims who are in foreign lands should only practice Sharia as much as is allowed in the country they reside.
How can you even think that Sharia can be adapted, when only Muhammad himself is allowed to make any changes???? Don’t you get it?
Muhammad was the last prophet. No one is authorized to change one word, one command, one teaching, one example of the Qur’an or Sahih Hadith.
You have a complete mind block against the truth of Islam. Nothing on earth can change Sharia, because it is founded on the Qur’an, Hadith and Sira. That is why Muslims are still dressing and acting like it was still the 7th century.
Now why don’t you tell me how for so many years in Muslim lands you could share the Gospel with Muslims without any backlash – they were all friendly to you
?
That is not what I am familiar with when in the Military. Sharia and Islamic Law clearly condemns any Christian attempt to evangelize or share the Gospel with Muslims – strictly forbidden.