Do Non-Christians Have the Possibility of Going to Heaven?

[Basil the Great]

This same poll is being posted in other forums. Your vote is deeply appreciated.

 

[food4thought]

Those who are God's will recognize the gospel, accurately preached, as God's truth and respond.

I am uncertain of how God will judge those who have never heard the gospel, but I leave the door open for the possibility that some of them could be saved.

 

[mark kennedy]

Clearly from Rom. 1:18¬20 we know God's divine attributes and eternal nature have been revealed to every soul that comes into the world. In Romans 2 Paul will go on to say that Gentiles who do by nature the things in the law become a law unto themselves, they call it the law of conscience. What happens at the end of the age the books are opened, by this time believers have been raised 1000 years. God judges not just deeds but hidden motives even you May only be dimly aware of. This is called the Great White Throne judgment and some argue that all appearing at this judgment are lost, I don't think so.

When Jesus separates the sheep and the goats the goats are pleading Lord did we not do many great works in your name. He says in as much as you failed the least of my brethren you failed me. The people who are saved are just as confused they probably never knew anything about him till that moment. In as much as you did it for the least of these my brethren you did It unto me. Clearly this is final judgment and people who are not Christians are saved and professing Christians active in ministry are lost.

The first shall be last and the last will be first. How many suffer in isolated areas without having a chance to receive Christ? You are responsible for what you have. God judges righteously and will save all who can be saved. Oh and BTW it's a real good idea to be generous with compassion and kindness because you never know when God might take it personally.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[circuitrider]

Unfortunately, the way the three questions are worded makes it hard to vote. John Wesley affirmed that idea that persons who are try to serve God in other faiths may receive God's mercy because God is God and it is up to God whom God saves. But that would be based on God's grace and mercy and not their works.

But the way question 3 is worded "depending on the life the lived" makes it sound like works oriented salvation, not something that I support. So I didn't check any of the three.

Also, "salvation" is equated with going to heaven. For Methodists at least, salvation is our entire life journey with God, not just what happens when we die.

 

[OneChristianLight]

I didn't select any answer on the poll because none of the choices accurately reflect my views on who can enter heaven. For example, the third choice says that everyone, presumably including atheists who lived good earthly lives but rejected Jesus as their savior, can get into heaven based solely on how they lived their lives. Salvation isn't something you earn by donating to charity, doing good deeds, and living a good life in general; salvation is earned by having faith in the redeeming sacrifice of Jesus for our sins.

If Jews can't enter heaven because they are Jewish, that would mean a righteous, humble Jew who was gassed by an SS officer would go to hell because he's Jewish. Meanwhile the SS officer, if he survived WWII, could repent of his crimes of genocide and come to know Christ later in life. Does that really make common sense?

I believe Jews can enter heaven if they were good people. So can moderate Muslims (I think). But I don't believe Hindus, who believe in man-made gods, Buddhists, who are atheists, and atheists/agnostics will go to heaven, even if they lived good lives.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Does anyone have a BIBLE to check this ? Some statements are directly opposed to what Y'SHUA(JESUS) says, aren't they? Who is able to check the BIBLE to see ?

 

[circuitrider]

This is a Wesleyan forum, so I doubt you'll get any takers to argue with you about soteriology as you aren't a Wesleyan Christian yesuasavlejeff.

 

[EvangelistMusgrove]

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Mark 16:16, which says,

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved ; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

The meaning behind "He that believeth" indicates to me, from the previous verses in the chapter, that it means he that believes in Christ, or even more specifically, Christ's resurrection.

Is there something else that I am missing that gives a very explicit appeal to who receives salvation?

But in the end, it boils down to the fact that we are not the judge; the judge is God Almighty.

 

[mark kennedy]

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Mark 16:16, which says,

16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved ; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

The meaning behind "He that believeth" indicates to me, from the previous verses in the chapter, that it means he that believes in Christ, or even more specifically, Christ's resurrection.

Is there something else that I am missing that gives a very explicit appeal to who receives salvation?

But in the end, it boils down to the fact that we are not the judge; the judge is God Almighty.

Just one passing observation, Mark is saying that believers should be baptized but that it is the unbelieving that are condemned not the unbaptized. I can't cite the reference but John Wesley wrote an essay once about baptism. I'm shamelessly paraphrasing, but the gist of it was I don't care if you were dunked, sprinkled or even if you were not baptized at all only give me your hand.

We talk so much about being 'saved', how we are 'saved' and how we keep being 'saved'. Sometimes I think we forget the heart of God is that all that can be saved will be saved. We do know this much:

They show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts sometimes accusing them and at other times even defending them.) (Rom. 2:15)
​

We know what people do but only God knows why, sometimes we don't even know why we do certain things. Surely God who spared not his only begotten Son to save us, would have compassion on those who by nature keep the law of conscience. Maybe those unfortunate enough not to have heard the gospel don't have the opportunity to be raised with the church at the end of the age and miss out on the Millennial kingdom. But at the Great White Throne judgment God will expose the hidden motives and you never really know, maybe there is a host of those who never received the Law or the Gospel still moved closer to God enough that they receive the salvation we all share in Christ. I firmly believe many will, as Abraham said, will not the judge of the whole earth judge righteously. If we are going to trust him for our salvation don't you think we can trust him to judge the unfortunates that never had the opportunity to hear the gospel. I think we know better or at least should.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[hedrick]

The UMC generally accepts textual criticism. Mark 16:16 is in a portion of Mark that's generally not believed to be part of the original text.

 

[mark kennedy]

The UMC generally accepts textual criticism. Mark 16:16 is in a portion of Mark that's generally not believed to be part of the original text.

Actually a lot of Calvinist scholars would agree with that, one of those rare cases where if there was something that originally followed verse 8 we can't be sure what it was. I've often wondered if the autograph was damaged.

 

[Dave-W]

Actually a lot of Calvinist scholars would agree with that, one of those rare cases where if there was something that originally followed verse 8 we can't be sure what it was. I've often wondered if the autograph was damaged.

There are at least 3 different endings for Mark 16, following verse 8.

But which ever is the "true" version (if any) the version we have is the longest and latest. (most likely to be changed) That said, the text of the longer version accurately describes the belief and practice of the NT church circa 100 ad.

Here are the other 2 common endings:


But they reported briefly to Peter and those with him all that they had been told. And after these things Jesus himself sent out through them, from east to west, the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation.

[II] This age of lawlessness and unbelief is under Satan, who does not allow the truth and power of God to prevail over the unclean things of the spirits [or, does not allow what lies under the unclean spirits to understand the truth and power of God]. Therefore reveal your righteousness now’ – thus they spoke to Christ. And Christ replied to them, ‘The term of years of Satan’s power has been fulfilled, but other terrible things draw near. And for those who have sinned I was handed over to death, that they may return to the truth and sin no more, in order that they may inherit the spiritual and incorruptible glory of righteousness that is in heaven.

 

[JoeP222w]

sorry missed the forum category, deleted.

 

[JoeP222w]

sorry missed the forum category, deleted.

 

[JoeP222w]

sorry missed the forum category, deleted.

 

[mark kennedy]

There are at least 3 different endings for Mark 16, following verse 8.

But which ever is the "true" version (if any) the version we have is the longest and latest. (most likely to be changed) That said, the text of the longer version accurately describes the belief and practice of the NT church circa 100 ad.

Here are the other 2 common endings:


But they reported briefly to Peter and those with him all that they had been told. And after these things Jesus himself sent out through them, from east to west, the sacred and imperishable proclamation of eternal salvation.

[II] This age of lawlessness and unbelief is under Satan, who does not allow the truth and power of God to prevail over the unclean things of the spirits [or, does not allow what lies under the unclean spirits to understand the truth and power of God]. Therefore reveal your righteousness now’ – thus they spoke to Christ. And Christ replied to them, ‘The term of years of Satan’s power has been fulfilled, but other terrible things draw near. And for those who have sinned I was handed over to death, that they may return to the truth and sin no more, in order that they may inherit the spiritual and incorruptible glory of righteousness that is in heaven.

I'm aware of that, many Calvinists will tell you Mark simply ended at verse 8, why someone added the rest is a mystery:

the vocabulary is not consistent with Mark. It doesn’t even read like Mark. There are eighteen words here that are never used anywhere by Mark. The structure is very different from the familiar structure of Mark’s writing. The title, “Lord Jesus,” is used here in verse 19, never used anywhere else by Mark. There’s no reference to Peter here, although Peter was mentioned in verse 7...

You say, “Well where did this thing come from?” Well, we don’t know who it came from, but I know where. It came from…some people got together and they started picking things out of the other gospels and out of some of the other New Testament books and putting them together. For example, verse 9 is taken right out of Luke 8:1 to 3. Verse 10 is taken from John 20, verse 18. Verse 12 is taken from Luke 24:13 to 32, the road to Emmaus account. Verse 13 is taken from Luke 24. Verse 14 is taken from Luke 24:36 to 38; verse 15 is taken from Matthew 28:19, you know that. “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation.” That’s right out of Matthew 28:19. Verse 16 is taken right out of John 20:23 and verses 17 and 18, with all the signs and things, are drawn from a lot of sources. (The Fitting End to Mark’s Gospel, John MacArthur)
​

That's a rare instance where you have a highly questionable passage. Most of the proverbs were written hundreds of years after Solomon was gone, there's even a note in the original telling you that. To this day no one really knows who wrote Job or Hebrews.

If you want room for doubt, you can always find something. What you don't get to do is to make a passage something it's not.

 

[circuitrider]

Interesting Mark, but you might want to notice that you are in the Wesleyan forum. Only Methodists, Nazarenes and other Wesleyan Christians are supposed to be teaching doctrine here. Most certainly Calvism is not appropriately taught in this forum.

 

[GraceSeeker]

As long as God is sovereign, God an do whatever God wants, including, but not limited to, saving people in boxes I haven't checked or even yet created.