Do Disbelievers Go Too Hell?

Morghaine · Apr 30, 2006

:: Starlight :: said:
Why, in your opinion, if someone doesn't become a Christian in their life, they go to hell for eternity? For me, it sounds unjust and plainly evil. Can you convince me that there is anything good in it?

Well, I guess one thing is that if a person chooses not to live their lives for God on earth, why should they be forced to spend eternity with God?

linssue55 · Apr 30, 2006

:: Starlight :: said:
I think you misunderstood me...

Why, in your opinion, if someone doesn't become a Christian in their life, they go to hell for eternity? For me, it sounds unjust and plainly evil. Can you convince me that there is anything good in it?

No, there is NO good in going to hell. This is NOT my oppinion, this is the WORD of God. God is NOT unfair, unjust, or evil. God is perfect and there never was time when he was not perfect.

We ALL have choices, God did not create robots to do His ever bidding. We have free will, volition. So if you believe God sending unbelievers to hell is evil, then your problem you would have to take up with th the Lord, for I cannot which I tried with verses, as others have here also, it must come from your own free will to believe what God say's, and not negative volition. Faith, love, and the intake of bible doctrine for the Lord errodes doubt.

*Starlight* · May 1, 2006

Morgaine1205 said:
Well, I guess one thing is that if a person chooses not to live their lives for God on earth, why should they be forced to spend eternity with God?

Because otherwise they would be suffering?

Anyway, people are non-Christians not because they reject God, but because they don't have enough evidence that God exists, or just view God in a different way. Why do you think that if someone's not a Christian, they are going to eternally reject God?

linssue55 said:
No, there is NO good in going to hell. This is NOT my oppinion, this is the WORD of God. God is NOT unfair, unjust, or evil. God is perfect and there never was time when he was not perfect.

We ALL have choices, God did not create robots to do His ever bidding. We have free will, volition. So if you believe God sending unbelievers to hell is evil, then your problem you would have to take up with th the Lord, for I cannot which I tried with verses, as others have here also, it must come from your own free will to believe what God say's, and not negative volition. Faith, love, and the intake of bible doctrine for the Lord errodes doubt.

I don't understand... No one actually chooses to go to hell with their own free will. Do you think anyone wants to suffer eternally?

And, if you believe that there's nothing good in going to hell, does that mean that God lets such evil thing happen and isn't doing anything against it?

linssue55 · May 1, 2006

:: Starlight :: said:
I don't understand... No one actually chooses to go to hell with their own free will. Do you think anyone wants to suffer eternally?

First off, you need to undestand.......unbelievers DO NOT believe in hell. They deny hell as they do God..The ENTIRE plan of God from eternity past is to solve the angelic conflic, and to aid in doing this, MAN was created. From the beginning man had free will, for the reasons I mentioned previously. Man (from Adam) has rejected good in place of evil (eating the fruit) also many has except Good (Adam). IT ALL COMES DOWN TO FREE WILL!! God wants all to come to Him, but many have not. This is NOT God's fault......just like it is NOT God's fault that YOU don't ACCEPT unbelievers going to hell. You have FREE WILL to believe what you wish.

For example......a child is told by the parent "Do not eat between meals, you will ruin your dinner", "IF" you do eat there will be punishment"! The child eat's, there fore punishment.

And, if you believe that there's nothing good in going to hell, does that mean that God lets such evil thing happen and isn't doing anything against it?

You don't understand whom and what God is, here is the Godheads "Attributes". These attributes DO NOT CHANGE, the Lord is TOTALLY and COMPLETELY consistent.......ALL of the time.

........Omniscience: all knowing.
........Omnipotence: all power.
........Omnipresence: infinite presence.
........Sovereignty: Supreme Being of the Universe.
........Love: infinite capacity for affection, esteem, respect, and pleasure of same.
........Eternal Life: timeless existence without beginning or end.
........Righteousness: intrinsic Good, intergrity, honor, uprightness..
........Justice: absolute fairness, equity, judgement.
........Immutablilty: Unchanging, "not subject to change or variation in quality or nature".
........Veracity: Truth.

God's JUSTICE comes into play when men don't follow whom and what God is and does. JUSTICE (His justice cannot change for He is also Immutable) was used with child eating before dinner, also warned before hand. You just don't understand the justice of God.

"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him." -John 3:36.

This is the way it is.......you either accept it or reject it, your decision.

I have nothing futher to say on the subject, you have been given proof here and elsewhere. You have to work this problem out without me, because you see, you are negative (just like unbelievers) to this doctrine, and from experience I have learned that when a person is negative, their soul is locked up, and they won't let the truth in, and ONLY God the Holy Spirit can soften your heart. So good luck!

mike1reynolds · May 1, 2006

A god of religious bigotry is an evil, hateful, petty god. Bigotry is always petty, hateful and evil. The real God hates bigotry. To assert that anyone who disagrees with your sect's religious dogma must be a negative person, is also religious bigotry. He is a very bright young man and you simply haven't provided a convencing reason to believe in religious bigotry. Always refering back to the Bible and never addressing the equally fundamental issue of justice in its own right is circular reasoning. If the law used this kind of circular reason our legal system wouldn't be much better than Islamic Sharia law. Justice is such a fundamental issue that every point about it need not come from the Bible. Just like love, not everything that you think about love comes from the Bible. It is so fundamental that it exists all around us and people who knew nothing about the Bible experienced it just as vividly as you, maybe more so.

abbasdaughter · May 1, 2006

In Ephesians it says "in your anger, do not sin - do not let the sun go down while you are still angry and do not give the devil a foothold." [4:26-27] Anger is an emotion - staying in your anger when it is not a righteous anger from God, is a sin - stewing un unrighteous anger is the problem.

The OP asked if "disbelievers" were going to hell. There are times that I don't "believe" God, but never times when I don't believe IN God. I don't stand in faith on everything so I can be disbelieving. Unbelievers, those who reject the gospel of Jesus Christ, reject and by their rejection, choose God's wrath. God's wrath (anger) is against sin and unrighteousness. Hell was created originally for the devil and his angels - but the Bible is very clear that we choose whom we follow - either Christ or the enemy - there is no middle ground. When we choose Christ - we have eternal life. When we choose the enemy - we also choose the punishment that was prepared for the enemy in the first place. Don't be deceived. There is a hell and unbelievers will go there. There is a lake of fire and unbelievers will be put there. It is God's heart that we all should come to repentance, but it is our choice to reject the invitation.

mike1reynolds · May 1, 2006

Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love. -1 John 4:8

So conversely, those who love must know God, according to this verse.

linssue55 · May 1, 2006

mike1reynolds said:
A god of religious bigotry is an evil, hateful, petty god. Bigotry is always petty, hateful and evil. The real God hates bigotry. To assert that anyone who disagrees with your sect's religious dogma must be a negative person, is also religious bigotry. He is a very bright young man and you simply haven't provided a convencing reason to believe in religious bigotry. Always refering back to the Bible and never addressing the equally fundamental issue of justice in its own right is circular reasoning. If the law used this kind of circular reason our legal system wouldn't be much better than Islamic Sharia law. Justice is such a fundamental issue that every point about it need not come from the Bible. Just like love, not everything that you think about love comes from the Bible. It is so fundamental that it exists all around us and people who knew nothing about the Bible experienced it just as vividly as you, maybe more so.

Whatever! Just another negative believer that lives on emotion instead of knowledge of doctrine.....the word of God.

mike1reynolds · May 1, 2006

linssue55 said:
Whatever! Just another negative believer that lives on emotion instead of knowledge of doctrine.....the word of God.

Such as: Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. -1 John 4:7

I am a negative person because I focus on love rather than dogmatic condemnation?

mike1reynolds · May 1, 2006

Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. [...] No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.

-1 John 4

Splayd · May 1, 2006

Hmmm... this post that you're reading is out of order as is the one below it. Something funny going on.

Splayd · May 1, 2006

That's a great verse mike, but what exactly does John mean by "love one another"? If you keep on reading you'll find out:
1Jo 5:2 Hereby we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and do his commandments.

You see we only use one word for "love" but the Greeks used a couple. "Love" for food, for a child, from a man to a woman, for a friend etc... all carry different conotations and meanings. The Greeks usually used "Phileo" for affectionate love, here the word "agape" is used which is Godly love. John goes onto to explain that our love for each other is truly "agape" if we also love God AND follow His commands.

Just in case anyone missed John's usage and understanding of what "agape" love is, he says it again in his next letter:
2Jo 1:6 And this is love, that we should walk after his commandments.

livingword26 · May 2, 2006

There are 2 kinds of love. Conditional and unconditional. Love that serves oneself, and love that serves God and everyone else. Just because one says that they love, it doesn't really mean anything. Will one still love if you are persicuted, if you are lied to and screwed around. Of course this only relates to the topic in that we can tell who a believer is if we spend enough time with them

Mat 5:45-48 so that you may become sons of your Father in Heaven. For He makes His sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. (46) For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax-collectors do the same? (47) And if you greet your brothers only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax-collectors do so? (48) Therefore be perfect, even as your Father in Heaven is perfect.

Joh 13:34-35 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another. (35) By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another.

Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

Splayd · May 2, 2006

This was posted out of order so I'll quote it here:

Splayd said:
That's a great verse mike, but what exactly does John mean by "love one another"? If you keep on reading you'll find out:
1Jo 5:2 Hereby we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and do his commandments.

You see we only use one word for "love" but the Greeks used a couple. "Love" for food, for a child, from a man to a woman, for a friend etc... all carry different conotations and meanings. The Greeks usually used "Phileo" for affectionate love, here the word "agape" is used which is Godly love. John goes onto to explain that our love for each other is truly "agape" if we also love God AND follow His commands.

Just in case anyone missed John's usage and understanding of what "agape" love is, he says it again in his next letter:
2Jo 1:6 And this is love, that we should walk after his commandments.

Rut · May 2, 2006

I haven`t read all the posts but shall we see what is a disbeliever as you call it is:

For example

Jude 1:

7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Rev 18:1 - 19

Galatians 5:

19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

1 Corinthians 6:9 - 10, Ephesians 5:5

That is some scriptures that show what a disbeliever is because it`s says they shall not inherit Gods Kingdom

WarriorAngel · May 2, 2006

mike1reynolds said:
I've noticed that most folks who feel this way aren't angry, they are sad for disbelievers. This seems contradictory to me, since their feeling of pity is based on the assumption that God doesn't. Why would they feel pity and God feel only anger? If you had two people, one that was angry at disbelievers and the other who felt pity for disbelievers, which one do you think would be the more positive and constructive person?

I suppose pity is compassion.

Knowing your fellow brethren might be dead to the Lord for all eternity should make you pray hard for them...AND this stems from love.
WHICH is the golden rule.

I cannot see anyone being happy at the loss. The Lord surely does not rejoice in it...but grieves it.

SO if anyone is elated, then they have not got a whole lot of love....

Once in Heaven, we do not worry for them, but the not knowing ....we pray hard for the last moment of conversion, if not a turn around in conversion.

I certainly wouldnt want to go to hell, and I surely hope others would pray that I dont.

The more constructive would be the one who pray for others. Prayer is never wasted....because the prayer comes back to you in merit by your love.

Unity...and love. The Lord knows our hearts.

kimberly_x · May 2, 2006

read the bible properly and find out that hell was made up by a tripped out man sitting on an island all by himself! there is no helll! if was all loving he'd let everyone into heaven anyway!

Melethiel · May 2, 2006

kimberly_x said:
read the bible properly and find out that hell was made up by a tripped out man sitting on an island all by himself! there is no helll! if was all loving he'd let everyone into heaven anyway!

The Revelation of John isn't the only place where the idea of hell is found....

Lynn73 · May 2, 2006

kimberly_x said:
read the bible properly and find out that hell was made up by a tripped out man sitting on an island all by himself! there is no helll! if was all loving he'd let everyone into heaven anyway!

You evidently choose not to believe the Scriptrures or Christ who spoke abundantly about such a place. God's love doesn't negate His holiness and hatred of anything unholy and impure such as sin. If He didn't love us, He could've just let us die in our sins and go straight to hell. Instead, Christ came and took the penalty or those sins so that those who believe on Him can have life and not have to go to that place. Now you can sit there and holler forever that there is no hell but that doesn't make it cease to exist or change what the Scripures say about it. You have your head in the sand.

Flicker said:
What if the operation of divine punishment upon the sinner was calculated to correct the non-Christian instead of destroy him? Wouldn't that be good news -- that everybody goes to a kind of joyful purgatory instead of being the object of either divinely rendered penalties or rewards?

This belief was held by the such notables as St. Clement of Alexandria, Origen, St. Gregory of Nyssa, and St. Maximus the COnfessor.

While that sounds good, I see no indication in the Bible that hell has anything to do with correction or rehabilitation. It doesn't matter who believed or believes in it. What matters is what the Bible says.

seekingpurity047 · May 2, 2006

kimberly_x said:
read the bible properly and find out that hell was made up by a tripped out man sitting on an island all by himself! there is no helll! if was all loving he'd let everyone into heaven anyway!

I guess people who begin genocides and never repent of it are in heaven right?

Hmm...

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Randy

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