Do atheists have any evidence to support their beliefs?

[Kylie]

No. You asked what facts are there outside the scientific method and I gave you a whole field of knowledge.

Very well.

Try for facts about our universe then. Can you show me one demonstrably true fact about our universe that does not come from the scientific method.

 

[Kylie]

None.

That's not very much. Care to expand on this?

 

[Eudaimonist]

(replying to the thread title)
None.

Which beliefs do you mean?


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Holoman]

Very well.

Try for facts about our universe then. Can you show me one demonstrably true fact about our universe that does not come from the scientific method.

Depends what you mean by demonstrably. There are lots of metaphysical facts that cannot be proved scientifically, such as the fact the external world exists at all and is not a construct of my mind.

And like I said, plenty of mathematical truths are demonstrable. You can draw a right-angled triangle and measure the sides to confirm pythagorus's theorem

 

[GrowingSmaller]

Is that true? Just for you or everyone?
You get my point, relative truth is self defeating.

Relative in the sense that it depends on presuppositions, like an external reality. I think "sensory experience" is itself a translation - back in the day they didn't have the same model of the senses we have nowadays, so even something so basic as "sense data" is based in a model with its presuppositions.

How is relativism self defeating?

 

[GrowingSmaller]

(Yesterday night I attended a two and a half hours service and sermon at a charismatic church. Well, I thoroughly regret it, though.)
But what does any of this have to do with "justifying beliefs" (the topic of this thread)?

Not sure to be honest. Sometimes I just post and hope.

I was thinking of the pragmatic idea of asking what difference a belief would make.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pragmatic_maxim

 

[GrowingSmaller]

The usefulness of religion.

I don't know, what about it?

I'm alive.

 

[KCfromNC]

? They are all facts based on axioms.

I'm not sure what you're getting at.

That facts based on made up assumptions are a lot different than facts based on observation of reality.

 

[Belk]

Very well.

Try for facts about our universe then. Can you show me one demonstrably true fact about our universe that does not come from the scientific method.

A squared + B Squared = C squared. I think you have this one backwards. Facts are not scientific, science uses facts. Facts exist all on their own.

 

[Abraxos]

That's not very much. Care to expand on this?

You tell me. What's to expand on?

Which beliefs do you mean?


eudaimonia,

Mark

No proof or evidence for atheism.

 

[Kylie]

Depends what you mean by demonstrably. There are lots of metaphysical facts that cannot be proved scientifically, such as the fact the external world exists at all and is not a construct of my mind.

I've never met another solipsist.

But I have to ask - how is it a fact that the external world exists and isn't a product of your mind? How have you proven this to be a fact?

And like I said, plenty of mathematical truths are demonstrable. You can draw a right-angled triangle and measure the sides to confirm pythagorus's theorem

But mathematics is an abstract concept. Numbers and shapes don't actually exist in reality. We only have representations of them.

 

[Kylie]

A squared + B Squared = C squared. I think you have this one backwards. Facts are not scientific, science uses facts. Facts exist all on their own.

Science is a tool used to discover facts about our universe. It was science that discovered the fact about how our sun glows, for example. Science discovered the facts about how old dinosaur fossils are.

Where do facts come from if not from scientific investigation? And how do we determine that they are facts if not for science?

 

[Kylie]

You tell me. What's to expand on?

For a start, how you reached the conclusion that atheists have no evidence for their conclusions...

 

[Belk]

You tell me. What's to expand on?


No proof or evidence for atheism.

Atheism is not a claim therefore it requires no evidence.

I require no evidence to state that I do not find your claims convincing. I am the worlds foremost expert on what I think.

 

[Belk]

Science is a tool used to discover facts about our universe. It was science that discovered the fact about how our sun glows, for example. Science discovered the facts about how old dinosaur fossils are.

Where do facts come from if not from scientific investigation? And how do we determine that they are facts if not for science?

Science is the tool of exploration, agreed. But it is not the only viable tool. It is simply the most accurate one.

 

[Kylie]

Science is the tool of exploration, agreed. But it is not the only viable tool. It is simply the most accurate one.

Please describe for me another tool by which we can learn about our universe.

 

[Eudaimonist]

No proof or evidence for atheism.

Atheism isn't a belief. There can't be a proof of atheism that isn't simply a refutation of theistic apologetic arguments. I'm not sure how I would provide proof of the non-existence of fire-breathing dragons either.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[Belk]

Please describe for me another tool by which we can learn about our universe.

Math, Logic, and religion have all served that purpose to some extent.

 

[Kylie]

Math, Logic, and religion have all served that purpose to some extent.

Math and logic are abstract concepts that do not describe things that exist in reality.

And I don't think that religion has ever provided a reliable way to learn about our universe.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Math, Logic, and religion have all served that purpose to some extent.

WINNER! YES! TRUE that men use math, logic, (even science) and religion to learn about the world and universe, (they think so anyway, though usually .... )

but, sadly, "always learning but never coming to knowledge of the truth" is also a fact....

Oh well.......