Disobedience has consequences.

[LostMarbels]

Do you believe the burden of proof lies with God to support your claims ?

No. I believe the burden of proof lies with God to support Jesus's claims that I attest to.

 

[Skavau]

Oh okay well I don't believe He punishes people for what they think but for what they do.

Do you think a single misstep justifies eternal torment?

 

[LostMarbels]

You believe that I will be punished for not believing in God. Non-belief in God is a thought.

Speculative. It is your opinion.

The bible says belief is a matter of choice, and acceptance of something as true.

 

[oi_antz]

What thoughts are you personally in favour of prohibiting?

Lol, is that possible? I would like to see a reduction in and condemnation of, thoughts that cause people to abuse others, like fear or violence. Eg, the ones that some people have that animals are property and can be handled unsympathetically.

 

[Messy]

Do you think a single misstep justifies eternal torment?

No not a single misstep and I don't even know if there's eternal torment since a whole lot of texts indicate annihilation. I just don't say that's correct since I'm not sure.

This is how He judges:

12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.


34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

 

[oi_antz]

What thoughts are you personally in favour of prohibiting?

No not a single misstep and I don't even know if there's eternal torment since a whole lot of texts indicate annihilation. I just don't say that's correct since I'm not sure.

This is how He judges:

12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.


34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

BTW, His judgement criteria has been quoted four times in this thread, it seems unusually excessive.

 

[TillICollapse]

No. I believe the burden of proof lies with God to support Jesus's claims that I attest to.

Aside from other questions this could raise, who do you believe should support your own claims ?

 

[Skavau]

No not a single misstep and I don't even know if there's eternal torment since a whole lot of texts indicate annihilation. I just don't say that's correct since I'm not sure.

This is how He judges:

12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law 13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified; 14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves, 15 who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them) 16 in the day when God will judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ, according to my gospel.


34 Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:35 for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; 36 I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? 38 When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? 39 Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on the left hand, ‘Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: 42 for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; 43 I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’

Then you are not my target audience.

 

[Skavau]

Speculative. It is your opinion.

The bible says belief is a matter of choice, and acceptance of something as true.

What part are you calling speculative there?

Belief whether a choice or not (it isn't) is still a thought. If you are in favour of punishing someone for what they believe then you are in favour of thought-crime.

 

[oi_antz]

Then you are not my target audience.

Is your target audience someone who does not agree with what the scriptures say?

 

[Skavau]

Is your target audience someone who does not agree with what the scriptures say?

My target audience are those who defend the idea that the unsaved deserved to be tormented for eternity.

 

[LostMarbels]

Aside from other questions this could raise, who do you believe should support your own claims ?

I'm make no claims, I only attest to what I know to be true in the word of God.

Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
This is one of many claims that Jesus alone is able to save in the the word of God. By me making the claim of this to be true is not the same as making the claim itself. I am only affirming God's claim in His scripture. If you wanted to refute this claim, you would have to refute God. Not me, because I'm only in agreement with God's claim.

 

[LostMarbels]

What part are you calling speculative there?

Belief whether a choice or not (it isn't) is still a thought. If you are in favour of punishing someone for what they believe then you are in favour of thought-crime.

Your statement is untrue in accordance to the word of God. Since this is a discussion about God, I will not be bound by unbiblical definitions in order to explain the bible. The word is sufficient to explain it's self. I will not stray.

This would be like using the definition of gravity to explain thermal dynamics.

 

[TillICollapse]

I'm make no claims, I only attest to what I know to be true in the word of God.

Act 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
Act 4:11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
This is one of many claims that Jesus alone is able to save in the the word of God. By me making the claim of this to be true is not the same as making the claim itself. I am only affirming God's claim in His scripture. If you wanted to refute this claim, you would have to refute God. Not me, because I'm only in agreement with God's claim.

Then you didn't understand my analogy with the Chupacabra and all those who claim they knew what the truth about the Chupacabra was.

Many claim to know what is true according to the words of God, in any number of ways, throughout a variety of religions. What is it you are calling the word of God which you are attesting to ?

I'm on my way out, I'll be back ...

 

[Skavau]

Your statement is untrue in accordance to the word of God. Since this is a discussion about God, I will not be bound by unbiblical definitions in order to explain the bible. The word is sufficient to explain it's self. I will not stray.

This would be like using the definition of gravity to explain thermal dynamics.

Whether or not belief is a choice is irrelevant to the point there actually: Belief is still a thought (a conclusion of a thought(s)).

 

[LostMarbels]

Then you didn't understand my analogy with the Chupacabra and all those who claim they knew what the truth about the Chupacabra was.

I understand completely. An accretion, an analogy, an explanation or what have you does not change the fact that I make none of the claims. I only am in agreement with the claims God has made.

Many claim to know what is true according to the words of God, in any number of ways, throughout a variety of religions. What is it you are calling the word of God which you are attesting to ?

I'm on my way out, I'll be back ...

The bible as reviled by the holy spirit.

 

[LostMarbels]

Whether or not belief is a choice is irrelevant to the point there actually: Belief is still a thought (a conclusion of a thought(s)).

And that is irrelevant to the biblical definition in a conversation concerning the bible.

 

[Davian]

There can't be any. You can't use a prybar on air.

Or the imaginary.

You can't use physical tools to measure a Spirit.

You have to use spiritual measurements.

How do you use imaginary measurements?

A new survey shows that 51 percent of people in the world believe in God. Only 18 percent don’t and 17 percent are undecided.

Are we to put reality to a popular vote? I going to lobby for a change in the speed of light.

 

[Skavau]

And that is irrelevant to the biblical definition in a conversation concerning the bible.

How exactly does the bible define belief? Does it somehow distinguish it from a thought?

 

[Davian]

If you would stop trying to prove a point, you might be able to see this "unverifiable" evidence.

What evidence?

The whole problem here is you have to actually do action to find this prof. Research, study, observance. You cant just pop on a forum and demand it.

Yet you can pop into a forum and say that.

The other thing is your going about it the wrong way. Quite simply, your asking individuals that know about this field of study and are telling them their wrong.

I am asking them to demonstrate that they are right.

If all you have is an ascertain that God is not real, than all you have is you have is your own personal opinion, based on your own personal experience.

I have experienced that religionists have been unable to substantiate the claims of their religion.

There is evidence, but you have to personally look for it.

That not really evidence, then. How could I be sure that I have not simply deceived myself?

That being said, it is safe to say that these truths are only reviled to those who want to find them. To think you have to somehow accept Jesus Christ in-order to get prof of him is ridiculous.

I am not asking for proof.

How would any one that ever doubted and got saved, be saved if the unbeliever could not find truth? You would first have to be willing to find the truth. Then you have to seek it.

How circular. I would have to think that your religion is the truth, to look in that direction, to find it.