Discontinue Cross as Christian Symbol?

[AceHarddrive]

Considering its history as 1) an item of pagan idolatry and 2) its use in the torture and crucifixion of countless lives, should we discontinue venerating the cross as a symbol of Christianity? Still, even if all the Christian denominations/sects/organizations could agree to discontinue, what a job that would be to remove ALL items containing crosses (paintings, steeples...). Also, what would we replace it with (if we chose to replace it)? The ICTHUS fish? A dove of peace? I know some (or all of you) are going to say what an impossible job it would be, therefore, why even consider it. As for me, no crosses of any kind.

~Tim

 

[daveleau]

IMVHO, if we removed each of our symbols each time they were misused by the pagan society, then I have no doubt that they would begin using each and every one of our symbols in a rapid and superfluous manner. ...moreso than they already do. There is no other symbol that identifies one as Christian as the Cross, other than a Bible-in-hand. I could never give up my Cross, because I know that our symbols will always be misused by non-believers and by those that believe but act inappropriately under the symbol. A better thing, IMVHO, would be for more Christians to embrace the Cross and to use our lives as testimonies to reclaim it as indelibly our own.

 

[Ave Maria]

I could never give up the cross as a Christian symbol. It has been used as a Christian symbol since very early times (probably since the time of the Apostles themselves) and I personally think it would be rediculous to quit using the symbol of the cross just because it has been misused by pagans.

 

[DailyBlessings]

Note the Ankh in my avatar.

I rather like that our cross connects us with the other religions. The more common ground we have with others, I figure, the easier it will be for them to eventually find the Light.

 

[IgnatiusOfAntioch]

Considering its history as 1) an item of pagan idolatry

An item of pagan idolatry???? Do you just make this stuff up as you go along or do you have some actual basis and evidence for the claim of the cross being a pagan idol?

 

[DailyBlessings]

An item of pagan idolatry???? Do you just make this stuff up as you go along or do you have some actual basis and evidence for the claim of the cross being a pagan idol?

Crosses have been used by many cultures to represent the four (or five) cardinal directions, or associated elements. It can also represent the union of the physical (horizontal) and divine (vertical). The Egyptian ankh, the Indian swastika, the Mesoamerican water-cross are all examples. I have come across crosses in Puebloan rock art where I live, and the shape plays important roles in the sand art of modern Puebloans and Navajos.

In Christianity, of course, the previous symbolic meanings were not the sole reason for the shape, but some of the old ideas have been assimilated into faith and practice. For instance, European cathedrals were invariably oriented exactly east-west along the longer length, and the secular-divine aspect has been used at times in Christian instruction, especially in preliterate eras.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross
If you are interested, here is an article about the cross shape and its historic variations in European cultures.

 

[AceHarddrive]

Other informative sources can be found here and here.

~Tim

 

[PaladinValer]

The entire notion of a God-man was Pagan before it was Christian too.

So why not throw away all of Christianity?

...

Let's think logically here. Just because a symbol or thought was first used by non-Christian faiths originally doesn't mean it is any less Christian when it is used by us. It is not unconceivable that God can teach us through others; the very fact that other religions have such striking similarities is a powerful tool Christians can use to help instruct those curious about our own religion. It could also be a way to even teach Truth, since obviously some Truths can be found in other religions.

There was no concept of angels in pre-Babylonian Captivity Judaism. Historically, the idea was only introduced thanks to exposure to Zoroastrian thought. Later, Jesus Himself implies that there are indeed angels. Could it be that perhaps the Jews until then were simply unaware? Could it be that God used a non-Jewish faith to promote a change in Jewish theology and thought? It is quite conceivable, since God has been depicted many times in the OT using outside, non-Hebrew sources to get the Hebrews to do what is right.

The cross is a non-Christian symbol found in many, many different religions. It is also a Christian symbol too. They have their own views, which can be anywhere from extremely similar our our concept to only similar due to the fact that it is a cross. Jesus was nailed on a cross. Jesus died on a cross. A cross that bore His Blood. A cross that bore His Body. To reject the cross as a symbol is to reject what it symbolizes. That's too high a price to pay. Let non-Christians have their concept of the cross. It shouldn't bother us. Rather, we should be thankful that they have at least some element of Truth in their belief.

 

[notanordinarygirl]

There is no way I would give up on my cross. My Jesus died in there! A cross is not only a Christian symbol, it reminds us of what Jesus had to suffer for us to reach Salvation; the price He chose to pay because He loved us. We can't deny the cross. After all, what would have happened if Jesus thought the same thing, and denied the cross as well? Surely, there must have been pagans on that time.

 

[Oblio]

For instance, European cathedrals were invariably oriented exactly east-west along the longer length, and the secular-divine aspect has been used at times in Christian instruction, especially in preliterate eras.

FTR Orthodox temples (and not just cathedrals) both in the East and West are oriented this way*. Additionally the Altar end of the temple faces East (from where the sun rises, symbolizing the coming of Christ the light of the world) The Narthex (or vestibule/foyer) is on the West side, where there is darkness and evil outside the Church. Being of usually Byzantine style (or like it) the cross shape is more symetrical about the horizontal axis as one might find in Western churches descended from the gothic style. Also, unlike many Western (Protestant) churches they always have a Cross on top and rather than a spire pointing to heaven we have a large interior dome over the center of the temple which portrays Christ ruling over His kingdom. This dome is externally evident in Greek temples and the temples stolen from them by muslims and underneath the 'onion dome' (actually a flame) in Russian temples, or the cone in Georgian temples.

Here is a photo (from the East) of a tradition Orthodox temple (Georgian style) just after our Cross was elevated.

* - If they are new construction, economy is usually granted for an existing heterodox structure that is transformed into an Orthodox temple.

 

[Dale]

AceHardDrive in OP:
<< Considering its history as 1) an item of pagan idolatry and . . . >>

I don't know anyone who would favor dropping use of the cross as a Christian symbol.

Baptists don't use a cross in the church sanctuary but they use it in other ways.

 

[johnj2]

As a Christian I cannot believe that another would even consider removing The Cross as a symbol,it is on a par with removing the 10 Commandments from public places.It is recognised by both Christians and non Christians as a symbol of Christ and to try and justify its removal by intellectual discussion is a non starter as far as I can see.I do not want to cause offence,but in todays world there are enough attacks coming from atheists on Christianity without us trying to destroy ourselves from within.I suggest reading Eph 2:16,Heb 12:2,1 Cor 1:17,18,Gal 5:11 6:12,14 and Phil3:18, to see the importance God puts on the Cross before thinking of its removal.

 

[TimRussel]

Does thename Aketous mean anything to anyone?

 

[DailyBlessings]

Does the name Aketous mean anything to anyone?

The Aketous whose name is inscribed on the floor of the oldest church in the Holy Land? That came out in the news Sunday.

 

[IgnatiusOfAntioch]

Does thename Aketous mean anything to anyone?

Yes, Aketous donated a table and a mosaic to an early church.

 

[MrPibb000]

I could never give up the cross as a Christian symbol. It has been used as a Christian symbol since very early times (probably since the time of the Apostles themselves) and I personally think it would be rediculous to quit using the symbol of the cross just because it has been misused by pagans.

I agree!
AceHarddrive, if you are going to stick with this I think you may need to change your avatar, there is a cross in it. vbmenu_register("postmenu_19579246", true);

 

[AceHarddrive]

AceHarddrive, if you are going to stick with this I think you may need to change your avatar, there is a cross in it.

Funny. No thanks. I realize now that even though the cross has had a "spotty" past, it has been used as the Christian symbol for a long time. I think I'll keep it. Thanks!

~Tim

 

[Nektaria]

Does thename Aketous mean anything to anyone?

If you are referring to the Church that was found, the article misquoted, and the line reads "akeptouV" (akeptous)...my best guess is this came from "aiguptoV" (aigyptos) meaning Egypt....which later became "keptoV" meaning coptic.

Toss into the mix that the Greeks did not always use spaces between words and it could be "akepton" (akepton)...the -on ending simply indicating that is the object of the sentence.

But I am no classic Greek scholar...just tossing out a few guesses.

~Nektaria

 

[MrPibb000]

Funny. No thanks. I realize now that even though the cross has had a "spotty" past, it has been used as the Christian symbol for a long time. I think I'll keep it. Thanks!

~Tim

I am gald to here it. Though I am not much for symbols in general, if we are going to have one I think the empty cross is the best we have.

Empty becuase it is significant that he is not still on it; he is risen!

 

[IgnatiusOfAntioch]

As for me, no crosses of any kind.

~Tim

Isn't it a bit hypocritical for you have a cross in your Avitar???