Directed Evolution

[Astrid]

" The concept of evolution"? Thats not what you said,

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Think of it as descent with modification (each generation is slightly different from the previous, so you're an example of that in that you aren't a clone of your parents) and natural selection. Where the environment weeds out those who are the least well adapted and leaves those who are the best fit to pass on their genes. The fittest.

The changes can be very small indeed and if the environment doesn't change much then natural selection will be a very slow process. But it can happen very quickly as in the case of the tuskless elephants: Think humans aren't affecting evolution? Elephants are ditching their tusks to dodge poachers

Damn, that's sad!

 

[2PhiloVoid]

" The concept of evolution"? Thats not what you said,

Well, when you cite something like "the last three lines" of something I said, I'm not sure exactly what you're attempting to hone in on. So, maybe just explicitly state what it is that you are referring to.

 

[Astrid]

Well, when you cite something like "the last three lines" of something I said, I'm not sure exactly what you're attempting to hone in on. So, maybe just explicitly state what it is that you are referring to.

Its stone obvious but never mind.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Its stone obvious but never mind.

Uh, ok. ... but can I do my best Napolean Dynamite dance now, anyway?

 

[Astrid]

Uh, ok. ... but can I do my best Napolean Dynamite dance now, anyway?

Carry on

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Carry on

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

... I'm reading King's book, Evolving God, which tracks in a slightly different direction than the source you've offered, and I'm mainly reading it to attempt to suggest answers to question(s) that my non-believing son is having trouble coming to grips with in considering the Christian faith ...

Good to hear. That one's on my reading list, to fill out my patchy knowledge of current thinking on the subject.

I'm told that "Inside the Neolithic Mind: Consciousness, Cosmos, and the Realm of the Gods",
by James David Lewis-Williams & David Pearce, is a good companion book.

 

[Astrid]

Hmm. How about the booga- looga?

 

[The Barbarian]

Oh? So you don't think the concept of evolution is a done deal?

Theories are never "done deals." They are always contingent on new information. Which is why they change over time. No one overthrew Newton's theory of gravitation; they merely refined it and added to it to make it more accurate over a large range of conditions.

NASA still uses it to navigate the solar system, even though there is a need to consider relativistic effects in some cases.

Likewise the four points of Darwinian theory remain as solid as ever, even if genetics, neutral theory, and epigenetics have made the theory more precise.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Good to hear. That one's on my reading list, to fill out my patchy knowledge of current thinking on the subject.

I'm told that "Inside the Neolithic Mind: Consciousness, Cosmos, and the Realm of the Gods",
by James David Lewis-Williams & David Pearce, is a good companion book.

From what I see of that source on Amazon, it definitely looks relevant. Thanks for the ref, FB!!

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Theories are never "done deals." They are always contingent on new information. Which is why they change over time. No one overthrew Newton's theory of gravitation; they merely refined it and added to it to make it more accurate over a large range of conditions.

Yes, I agree with that.

NASA still uses it to navigate the solar system, even though there is a need to consider relativistic effects in some cases.

Yes, I agree with that.

Likewise the four points of Darwinian theory remain as solid as ever, even if genetics, neutral theory, and epigenetics have made the theory more precise.

Yeah. That too.

 

[The Barbarian]

Damn, that's sad!

That's what Stalin said. So he outlawed Darwinism for sounding too much like capitalism. And they had "socialist biology" under Lysenko.

Russian biology is still recovering from that debacle.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

That's what Stalin said. So he outlawed Darwinism for sounding too much like capitalism. And they had "socialist biology" under Lysenko.

Russian biology is still recovering from that debacle.

Yeah, I've heard (and read) about some of their Soviet era debacles in science.

Suppressed research in the Soviet Union - Wikipedia

And, when I was there, they had some of the funkiest household toilets I'd ever seen. However, I guess the design allowed for easier stool sample gathering. Minus the fact that the toilets didn't flush the shelf that sat in the middle of the toilet bowl. So, you kind of had to push off the refu.......well, you get the idea.

 

[The Barbarian]

My recall is towels with terrycloth only on one side. I guess they figured you only needed one side.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

That's what Stalin said. So he outlawed Darwinism for sounding too much like capitalism. And they had "socialist biology" under Lysenko.

Russian biology is still recovering from that debacle.

By the way, while this is an interesting aside, I'm not sure how it is relevant to what I said in response to Bradskii ...

So, help me out here. What is this supposed to imply? Is it just an extra sound bite of info for all of us to chew on? (It's one that, actually, I was already aware mildly of.)

 

[The Barbarian]

Bradskii said: ↑
Think of it as descent with modification (each generation is slightly different from the previous, so you're an example of that in that you aren't a clone of your parents) and natural selection. Where the environment weeds out those who are the least well adapted and leaves those who are the best fit to pass on their genes. The fittest.

The changes can be very small indeed and if the environment doesn't change much then natural selection will be a very slow process. But it can happen very quickly as in the case of the tuskless elephants: Think humans aren't affecting evolution? Elephants are ditching their tusks to dodge poachers

Damn, that's sad!

That's what Stalin said. So he outlawed Darwinism for sounding too much like capitalism. And they had "socialist biology" under Lysenko.

Russian biology is still recovering from that debacle.

So, help me out here. What is this supposed to imply?

Hint: Thomas Robert Malthus.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Bradskii said: ↑
Think of it as descent with modification (each generation is slightly different from the previous, so you're an example of that in that you aren't a clone of your parents) and natural selection. Where the environment weeds out those who are the least well adapted and leaves those who are the best fit to pass on their genes. The fittest.

The changes can be very small indeed and if the environment doesn't change much then natural selection will be a very slow process. But it can happen very quickly as in the case of the tuskless elephants: Think humans aren't affecting evolution? Elephants are ditching their tusks to dodge poachers



That's what Stalin said. So he outlawed Darwinism for sounding too much like capitalism. And they had "socialist biology" under Lysenko.

Russian biology is still recovering from that debacle.



Hint: Thomas Robert Malthus.

So, referring to Malthus explains why you referred to Stalin?

 

[The Barbarian]

So, referring to Malthus explains why you referred to Stalin?

Malthus was an inspiration for Darwin, with the notion of competition and inevitable losers as more are born than can survive. Darwinian, but offensive to any Marxist.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Malthus was an inspiration for Darwin, with the notion of competition and inevitable losers as more are born than can survive. Darwinian, but offensive to any Marxist.

What does Marxism (or what Stalin thought or said for that matter) have to do with anything in this thread? I don't think Bradskii is a Marxist, so your comment that my "Damn, that's sad!" exclamation regarding the tragedy of poached elephants somehow sounding like something Stalin said in the past may be a moot point with Bradskii.