Did Paul consider himself a "sinner", are we supposed to think of ourselves as sinners...?

JIMINZ said:

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All I have to say then is "Get Thee Behind Me Satan"
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Because you even want to lead him.... Show him how its done.

SO, I guess that's a NO, and your not going to, or you can't elaborate.

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Why should you care? ...You are sinless. What could you have to learn? You can do no wrong.

You can do no wrong. Amazing!

Neogaia777 said:

Did Paul consider himself a "sinner"?, How many of which disciples/apostles think of themselves as sinners...? Are we supposed to think of ourselves or consider ourselves as sinners...? Even after we say we are saved...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

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Paul was speaking of himself before he met Jesus. Was he a sinner when he wrote this? No. Did he consider himself a sinner when he wrote this? No. He did say tha

Neogaia777 said:

Did Paul consider himself a "sinner"?, How many of which disciples/apostles think of themselves as sinners...? Are we supposed to think of ourselves or consider ourselves as sinners...? Even after we say we are saved...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

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Paul was speaking of himself before he met Jesus. Was he a sinner when he wrote this? No. Did he consider himself a sinner when he wrote this? No. He did say that he was a sinner before he met Jesus though.
Should we consider ourselves sinners? No....Let's use me as an example. I was a sinner to rival Paul. I was a sinner until I died...Then I was born again. I was born a brand new creation. Part me, and part God. I was as pure as the proverbial driven snow. I am now the righteousness of God in the anointing of Jesus....I cannot be a sinner and the righteousness of God. Neither can you.

JIMINZ said:

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In your post #788 below, you stated you could elaborate.

"Scripture says, IF they are born of God, they can no longer Sin, they can not Sin.
Yet some men claim, they are born of God, and continue to Sin."

I claim that believers are still "able" to sin. Not, that they will continue to sin.

When you get that much, maybe I can elaborate.



In my post #878 below, I stated "I'm willing to listen if you are still inclined."
Does this now mean, your not going to elaborate?

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If you read that post that preceded you saying that I said nothing? You would see it was one aspect of elaboration.


I will cite the post location and edit a bit to better clarify what I was telling you.

in post Did Paul consider himself a "sinner", are we supposed to think of ourselves as sinners...? - I said the following...

I can sin... and need to name my sins if and when I do.. Instantly! So, I do not waste anytime grieving the Holy Spirit who wants me to walk with Him in unison!

Why do I need to name my sins if the sins are forgiven?

Because God can have no union, with even sins that have been forgiven! Its true that they can not be counted against us now, because of the Cross of Christ. But He must withdraw from being one with what amounts to unrighteousness when we fall into a sin.

So why do we need to name them? (1 John 1

To get back in union with the Holy Spirit! How?

When we recognize our sins, and agree that they are sins? We agree with God. God and I agree that what I slipped into is a sin! Meaning?


To walk together you must be in one accord.... So, naming your sins is to agree with God. For you are calling sin, what God calls sin. And... the blood of Jesus purifies... and you once more can walk together.

To deny sin? You walk alone... walking only in the energy of your emotions, not the Spirit.

HARK! said:

I quoted from the CLV. The KJV paints a much more intense picture

1 John 3:9 King James Version (KJV) 9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

My knowledge of Greek isn't strong enough to proclaim which one of these two interpretations is more accurate; but I will say that one doesn't need to be a scholar of Greek to see that the CLV is very often more accurate than the KJV. I have yet to see one case where this doesn't hold true.

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Yes the KJV is not he most accurate and does miss on some important points. A very good example is when Jesus is talking to Peter and asks him if he loves him. The very important distinctions between the types of love that are mentioned, but the KJV misses those distinctions. It's still my favorite version over all but I understand it's not the most accurate.

JIMINZ said:

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This belief is the exact point of your misunderstanding.

You have a misconception that the Old Man Remains.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Rom. 6:11
Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

The Old Man is the Flesh, that is where sin resides in man, not in his fleshly body, but in his Human Nature, that is the flesh spoken of, not the physical flesh which covers our bones.

Rom. 8:3
For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

Rom. 8:10
And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Gal. 5:24
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

Rom. 6:6
Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Eph. 4:22

That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;

Col. 3:9 Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;

Therefore Paul says.

Eph. 4:24
And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

Col. 3:10
And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:

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Note where the power lies in these verses. Paul is telling the believers to be the ones to perform the action. He did not say we cannot serve sin. He tells us not not. He tells us to out on the new man. He says Lie not, which is stating we can lie despite the fact we have put on the new man. He tells us to out off the old man. That is in our power.

All this is talking about the power of sin. We are no longer under it's control. It holds no power over us. We do not have to sin. Thus sin becomes a choice for us as believers. We out in the new man and put off the old. When we commit a sin we have given into the old man. It's not that we can't sin. It's that we have the new man which gives us the power to choose not to sin. But sometimes as Paul states often and John also says we do sin. We give in. He even does it. But that's ok because as a believer we don't have to live in it or wollow in it. We are the righteousness of Christ and we can be forgiven and made right again as John states. We make the choices to out on the new man and take off the old.

JIMINZ said:

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Gal 5:26
Be not desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

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Thinking you can no longer sin is vain glory!

When as asking someone about which part of the Law are we to still be under if we are being led of the Spirit?

I was told...

There was the Rabbinical law, those laws imposed by the power hungry Rabbis. To control and dominate the people. Also there was the law given by God. Which one are we free of? Though if you didn't know this, how could you know which law we are free of? I think you should guess.

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What the rabbis gave was not called the Law (Torah). What the rabbis imposed was called Halakhah. We only see the word for Torah (Law of Moses) being used.

You keep the Sabbath? You only eat kosher?

SBC said:

Okay....Relevance clear. Your scriptures applied to yourself.



1 John 1
[9] Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Apostle John's facts, differ from your facts.

1 John 1
[1] That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

Some men are stubborn and stiffnecked.

1 Sam 15
[23] For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD,

Jer 17
[23] But they obeyed not, neither inclined their ear, but made their neck stiff, that they might not hear, nor receive instruction.

God Bless,
SBC

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Please explain how a born again Christian can not sin, in light of this scripture.

If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9

We and us refer to John as well as those who are Christ's.

Are you saying born again Christians do not need to confess their sin because they can not sin ?


JLB

JLB777 said:

Please explain how a born again Christian can not sin, in light of this scripture.

If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9

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IF is the KEY WORD. (we are ALL born sin, sinful , we, us, them, people, humans).....

SO? DID YOU, accomplish the IF? DID YOU, confess your SINS?

AND? Was God Faithful and FORGIVE your SINS?
AND? Was God Faithful and CLEANSE YOU from ALL UNRIGHTEOUS?
AND?

WAS that ALL God did?

Are you saying born again Christians do not need to confess their sin because they can not sin ?

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Actually Scripture says, a man born of God can not sin. And I agree with the Word of God.

Why? Are you saying, a man cleansed from ALL unrighteousness, remains
unrighteous? Gods forgiveness and cleansing FAILED?

God Bless,
SBC

SBC said:

Why? Are you saying, a man cleansed from ALL unrighteousness, remains
unrighteous? Gods forgiveness and cleansing FAILED?

God Bless,
SBC

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Do you still have a body of flesh?
If so, you sin.
You break the Torah written by Moses and dictated by God himself.
Sabbath
Clean and unclean
anger
envy
malice
lust
jealousy
greed

To say you have no sin, is the sin of boasting.

pat34lee said:

Do you still have a body of flesh?
If so, you sin.
You break the Torah written by Moses and dictated by God himself.
Sabbath
Clean and unclean
anger
envy
malice
lust
jealousy
greed

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Are you born of God?
If so, you can not sin.

God Bless,
SBC

Neogaia777 said:

What do you mean by "can not sin"...?

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All men born of the earth, begin their natural life Standing Against God.
All men born of the earth, WHO crucified their body, become dead to sin.
All men born of the earth, WHO become crucified, are thus prepared to be born of God.
All men born of God, are born of a pure Seed, Gods Seed, transforming the man, to a spiritual life, living in Christ's pure body, thus are in Standing with God.
It is by Gods Power, (His indwelling Holy Spirit), that KEEPS a man freed from Sin;
Incapable of EVER again, Standing Against God.

Can not ever again Stand Against God.

Matt 12
[30] He that is not with me is against me;

1 Cor 12
[27] Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.

Men want to discuss Spiritual things, from the perspective of Carnal understanding.
They say the words of Scripture, yet want to cling to their dead crucified bodies, by trying to explain Scripture out of the Mind of their dead crucified bodies.

They can say, Jesus Son of God, never having sin.
But then, say, man sinned, was forgiven his sins, receiving Gods Seed, being born of God, continues to sin? huh?

Jesus was born of God, called Son of God....and did not commit sin.
But yet a man born of God, called son of God....does commit sin?

God Bless,
SBC

Neogaia777 said:

What do you mean by "can not sin"...?

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That's been his ultra-ambiguous, yet dogmatically taken stand.

And, then when someone reacts to what he says? He acts like what he said should be universally understood.

He's evasive. But, blames you for not comprehending.

I would say that what he does is ironically a pattern of the sin nature. But? He can not sin.

Its a game... Heads I win, tails you lose.

genez said:

That's been his ultra-ambiguous, yet dogmatically taken stand.

And, then when someone reacts to what he says? He acts like what he said should be universally understood.

He's evasive. But, blames you for not comprehending.

I would say that what he does is ironically a pattern of the sin nature. But? He can not sin.

Its a game... Heads I win, tails you lose.

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LOL -
ultra ambiguous?
Evasive?
Blames for not comprehending?

Geeze, if you are going to make accusations, using the truth to do so would be the right thing to do.

Irony...uh huh!

genez said:

To say you have no sin, is the sin of boasting.

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Funny. You keep quoting the very scripture that says that.

SBC said:

IF is the KEY WORD. (we are ALL born sin, sinful , we, us, them, people, humans).....

SO? DID YOU, accomplish the IF? DID YOU, confess your SINS?

AND? Was God Faithful and FORGIVE your SINS?
AND? Was God Faithful and CLEANSE YOU from ALL UNRIGHTEOUS?
AND?

WAS that ALL God did?



Actually Scripture says, a man born of God can not sin. And I agree with the Word of God.

Why? Are you saying, a man cleansed from ALL unrighteousness, remains
unrighteous? Gods forgiveness and cleansing FAILED?

God Bless,
SBC

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Is t there a difference between cannot sin and being cleansed froM sin through forgiveness?

They sound like two different things to me

Acts 2:37-38...

What did Peter promise these Jews when he evangelized them right after the resurrection? Keep in mind.. these Jews had just committed the terrible sin of having Jesus murdered!

What did Peter tell them?




We are to receive forgiveness for our sins when we enter into regeneration!

We entered into having access to the covering of always having our sacrifice for our sins. Its now always before us! The blood of Jesus was the once and for all sacrifice for sins. The sacrifice that never ends! Unlike a sacrificial animal that needed to be offered over and over again for each time believers sin. Now the blood of the Cross is always before us! Wherever we are! Wherever we go! And, we will always be forgiven if we would only simply admit to God the sin we recognize we have committed.

To receive the forgiveness of our sins is not the same as having our sin nature eradicated!

Forgiveness is having the ever present provision having a constant companion-atonement be with us wherever we are, and whenever we may find ourselves falling into temptation, and sinning. No need to go to the Temple to offer a sacrifice!

We still can sin!





That death that James 1:15, speaks of? Is called spiritual death!

For when we sin? We instantly become cut off from fellowship with God! Until we name our sin and admit to it? We remain dead to God's power of grace. Death! That is why we have been given the provision for the forgiveness of our sins as found in 1 John 1:9.


We must become saved first to enter into the privilege of having our sins forgiven.
An unbeliever can not receive that forgiveness for his sins by naming them! Only the child of God has been given that right, and now can name his sins for instant guaranteed forgiveness!

Well? Look at Pharaoh! He confessed his sins, yet was never forgiven, nor saved by it!




The Bible says that some believers love death! For they love walking according to their flesh! They prefer it! They may also be filled with all sorts of self approving religious concepts as they do.



And, the self righteous take pleasure in their egotistical sense of perfection. Though they are alive (physically).. they are dead in their walk with God (spiritually). We all must recover fellowship when we sin.

Those who think they can not sin? These are the walking dead amongst believers.

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