Another misrepresentation/straw man fallacy from the pro-Calvinist side. Jimmyjimmy tried the exact same thing. Denying YOUR VIEW of God's sovereignty doesn't mean I believe man is sovereign over God. If we have a choice on something, it's because God ALLOWS us to have that choice, leaving His sovereignty quite intact.
Show proof from Scripture.
Interesting thought. At first glance people don't have the free will to raise themselves back to this life, so could it not be classified as an area where man's free will doesn't exist? Basically we know of people who freely choose death through suicide but we do not see people resurrecting themselves at will.Did Lazarus ask Jesus to raise him from the dead?
And man's choice is limited by his nature. So the unregenerate man will not choose God because he has no ability to.
John 6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
And man's choice is limited by his nature. So the unregenerate man will not choose God because he has no ability to.
John 6:44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.
Jesus said that it is because men's deeds are evil ... that they prefer the dark to the light.
Are your deeds evil? Were your deeds ever evil?
We should note that that passage goes on to say ...
But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God. John 3:21
I came to CHrist as a child, ... and there is no doubt that I performed some evil deeds, ... but also, that I performed some true deeds (as I was enabled by God).
There is no question that I have missed the mark at points, ... but also that my life has not been overwhelmed by evil (by the grace of God).
I believe that the question is ... "Is this same grace of God ... not made available to all other men ?"
For instance ... when I am confronted with the choice to work for my living ... or to steal what belongs to my neighbor, ... is it your view that SOME who perform such evils ARE NOT AWARE that God disapproves of those acts ?
So, prior to becoming a Christian, your deeds were righteous, and you wanted then brought into the light. Is that correct?
And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw ALL men unto me. John 12:32
Now, without getting into a discussion about how comprehensive that word "ALL" is ... I think that most christians can agree that there are SOME people/men who experience the drawing of God ... per the lifting up of Jesus, ... who resist that drawing.
The enlightenment of ALL men's hearts is of God (John 1:9)
yet ALL men do not respond positively to that enlightenment (John 3:19-20).
It is undeniable that those who come to God ... are enabled by God to do so.
It is a harder argument that those that do not come to God, ... have NOT been enlightened by God to do so
You have not established that every single human being who has ever existed resists the drawing of God, you have only asserted it.
A_Thinker said: ↑
It is undeniable that those who come to God ... are enabled by God to do so.
You have asserted this but you have not demonstrated this from the exegesis of the text. And this thought promotes that if God "enables" someone to be saved, but they still end up in Hell, that God fails in what He wills, because man's will is sovereign to God.
It is also a complete denial of the sufficiency and efficacy of the cross to saved dead sinners to new life.
Romans 1:18-20 again. No one will be in Hell that can say, "I wanted to be saved, but God did not enlighten me enough to know how to be saved."
Who is it that asserts that ANY who come to God ... do so without His enabling ? ALL good things come from God.
Pauls's letter to Timothy declares that it is God's will ... that "ALL men be saved".
citing Jesus' declaration that God desired that Jerusalem would find shelter under His wings
It is not a ding to God's SOVEREIGNTY that He SOVEREIGNLY allows men to determine their spiritual destiny. To grant freedom is, indeed, ... an ACT of SOVREIGNTY ...
You are thinking too much ... and, in doing so, going BEYOND what the scriptures declare.
Nowhere in scipture is it declared that Jesus's death was effacacious for ANY beyond "those who believe".
Romans 3:10-12 as it is written: "None is righteous, no, not one; (11) no one understands; no one seeks for God. (12) All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one."
I believe that what Paul is descibing here is as pertains to the "natural/fallen man".
But which of us is wholly natural (i.e. not at all enlightened of God) ?
All mankind is born in Adam (i.e. with an Adamic nature).
For the rest of your comment, none of those mentioned were righteous before God because of something that they, as individual, in and of themselves, conjured up something within themselves to be God seekers. It was the work that God did within those individuals to grant them a regenerate heart, such that they would seek the things of God, solely because of God, and based in God.
Genesis 25:29-34 Once when Jacob was cooking stew, Esau came in from the field, and he was exhausted. (30) And Esau said to Jacob, "Let me eat some of that red stew, for I am exhausted!" (Therefore his name was called Edom.) (31) Jacob said, "Sell me your birthright now." (32) Esau said, "I am about to die; of what use is a birthright to me?" (33) Jacob said, "Swear to me now." So he swore to him and sold his birthright to Jacob. (34) Then Jacob gave Esau bread and lentil stew, and he ate and drank and rose and went his way. Thus Esau despised his birthright.
In those days, when you gave up your birthright, you gave up all claims to rank in the family as well as any claims to inheritance from your father. So by patriarchal standards, Esau denied his right to be ranked higher than Jacob, thus Jacob ruled over him.
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