Did Augustine retraction concerning Peter and the Rock?

ivebeenshown · Oct 7, 2010

City Smurf said:
When your understanding on a verse in the Scriptures is different from a Lutheran pastor's for example, how do you know which one God has taken by the hand and brought to the right conclusion outside of your own judgment? You have no visible authority but yourself after all.

Matthew 7:16
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Mark 12
29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

OrthodoxyUSA · Oct 7, 2010

LittleLambofJesus said:
Did Augustine retract/change his view of Peter and the Rock?
Is this also the view of the EOs and a lot of other non-RCs concerning the confession of Jesus being the rock?
I am just a tad confused on this. Thanks

http://www.christianforums.com/t7344034/#post51145085

Augustine explains that his view that Peter is the rock of Matthew 16 was later replaced by the view that Christ is the rock. Notice that he refers to his former view being *replaced*, not just adding a second interpretation to it. He says that the reader can decide for himself which interpretation is more likely. He expects the reader to choose between the two, not accept both. Thus, Augustine advocated the *rejection* of the view that Peter is the rock, and he said that others could do the same, here it is...

............... But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable." (The Retractions, 1:20:1)

Blessed Augustine recanted many things before his death.

Why the confusion?

Forgive me...

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 8, 2010

OrthodoxyUSA said:
Blessed Augustine recanted many things before his death.

Why the confusion?

Forgive me...

I am not really sure bro.

LittleLambofJesus · Nov 22, 2010

interesting thread!

LittleLambofJesus · Jan 30, 2011

ivebeenshown said:
Matthew 7:16
Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Mark 12
29And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
31And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

2 Timothy 2:15
Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

Good Scriptures

Gregory Thompson · Jan 30, 2011

I thought the will of God was the rock .

racer · Jan 31, 2011

lionroar0 said:
It's not the retractions it's the retractations.

Hmm . . . wondered how long it was going to take for someone to point that out!

LittleLambofJesus · Jan 31, 2011

Originally Posted by lionroar0

It's not the retractions it's the retractations.

racer said:
Hmm . . . wondered how long it was going to take for someone to point that out!

Ah well......

Strong's Concordance with Hebrew and Greek Lexicon

Search Multiple Dictionaries (including Easton's Bible Dictionary) :

Retractations | Define Retractations at Dictionary.com
retractations - 3 dictionary results

–verb (used with object)
1. to withdraw (a statement, opinion, etc.) as inaccurate or unjustified, esp. formally or explicitly; take back.

2. to withdraw or revoke (a decree, promise, etc.).

–verb (used without object)
3. to draw or shrink back.

4. to withdraw a promise, vow, etc.

5. to make a disavowal of a statement, opinion, etc.; recant.

—Synonyms
1, 2. deny, renounce, recant, abrogate, nullify, annul.

LittleLambofJesus · Jan 31, 2011

Michael Collum said:
I thought the will of God was the rock .

How is that?

Gregory Thompson · Jan 31, 2011

LittleLambofJesus said:
How is that?

It is by the will of the Father that Jesus was revealed to Peter as the Christ, the Son of the Living God. and to all .

LittleLambofJesus · Mar 17, 2012

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus

How is that?

Michael Collum said:
It is by the will of the Father that Jesus was revealed to Peter as the Christ, the Son of the Living God. and to all .

Can't argue wit dat!

LittleLambofJesus · Apr 23, 2013

LittleLambofJesus said:
Did Augustine retract/change his view of Peter and the Rock?
Is this also the view of the EOs and a lot of other non-RCs concerning the confession of Jesus being the rock?
I am just a tad confused on this. Thanks

http://www.christianforums.com/t7344034/#post51145085
St. Augustines "The Retractions"

Augustine explains that his view that Peter is the rock of Matthew 16 was later replaced by the view that Christ is the rock. Notice that he refers to his former view being *replaced*, not just adding a second interpretation to it. He says that the reader can decide for himself which interpretation is more likely. He expects the reader to choose between the two, not accept both. Thus, Augustine advocated the *rejection* of the view that Peter is the rock, and he said that others could do the same, here it is...

............... But 'the rock was Christ,' in confessing whom, as also the whole Church confesses, Simon was called Peter. But let the reader decide which of these two opinions is the more probable." (The Retractions, 1:20:1)

Originally Posted by GreekGrl

I have read in varying Orthodox writting that St. Augustines "The Retractions" have stated that he had given too much creedence to Peter as a "rock". This statement gives depth to the Orthodox teaching of equallity amongst all apostles...thus equallity amongt Bishops.
Yet, The Catholic church utilizes St. Augustine in it's own quest for supreme rulership.
How can this be?

Any more views on this?

.

LittleLambofJesus · Apr 23, 2013

OrthodoxyUSA said:
Blessed Augustine recanted many things before his death.

Why the confusion?

Forgive me...

Like what?

,

LittleLambofJesus · Sep 20, 2014

Originally Posted by OrthodoxyUSA

Blessed Augustine recanted many things before his death.

Why the confusion?

Forgive me...

LittleLambofJesus said:
Like what?

,

Interesting thread.....bump for more discussion

.

Restoresmysoul · Sep 20, 2014

Very edifying, thank you OP. I always considered Christ the Rock because this is what the Scriptures say. But i was confused by the RCC view on this. I have never read the scripture the way that Augustine seems to teach it, but now i seem to see it clearly. Peter says "you are the Christ" and Jesus says "You are Peter but on this Rock (Me, the Christ) i will build my Church"

BobRyan · Sep 20, 2014

no other PETRA can anyone lay than the one that was laid for us -- 1Cor 3 -- Christ.

"And that PETRA was Christ" -- 1Cor 10

So ... I can see how that is the Biblical solution.

in Christ,

Bob

Did Augustine retraction concerning Peter and the Rock?

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