Depression and Work

[Penumbra]

you sound like me, but my problem was studying. i couldn;t focus on anything.
finally i went and got some help. i;m on meds now and they have made a huge difference.
i recommend teh same. meds, therapy, or both.

I've had a problem with studying as well, but it's not as much of a concern for me. I study when I can, though I'm never satisfied with my ability to care or concentrate. I view it as a chore because my major does not interest me (though neither does any other major really).

Luckily I have a knack for academics, and can go into a test with only basic knowledge and come out with a good grade. I'm good at tests, and can concentrate on those because it's only for an hour or two and I know how much it counts. So I end up getting above average, though not stellar, grades.

At work though I can't concentrate, and there are no tests, so the work is what matters.

What medication did you receive? Is it for depression or something for concentration?

-Lyn

 

[rahmiyn]

I don't think anything in particular triggered it. I started being sad all the way back in middle school and it's just been a slow decline ever since, gradually changing from mild sadness to relatively severe depression over the course of 7-8 years. So it's not so much out of the blue.

-Lyn

I'm sorry for you, Lyn. It does sound like the kind of brain-chemical issue that will require medical intervention. I have a family member who has gone through this, and she has responded best to the right kind of medicine along with some counseling, but tbh, the right medication helped her most.

I will keep you in my prayers that you will find a good doctor and that you will find the best medication with little trial-and-error. Bless your heart. Everything will be all right, but it may take some time.

 

[jsimms615]

Penumbra,

I can relate to what your saying to a degree because I feel like I have been dealing with depression most of my life. I am wondering if you have ever visited a psychiatrist to see if there is some medication that can help you concentrate. There is a variety of medications out there. Sometimes you may need more than one kind because of the different chemicals it effects in the brain. I take Lexapro and Wellbutrin for example.

I think probably the fear of being fired or someone finding out that I was not doing my best would motivate me to work harder. As bad as the economy is, I know I am fortunate to have a job in the first place, when many people are out of work.

 

[Everlasting33]

Probably both, as well as my environment.

I mean, I acknowledge that in many cases, depression is an illness. Many of my symptoms line up with those of this illness. And this illness can and does cause changes in thoughts, so it's not like the two concepts of thoughts and biochemicals are completely independent. As far as thoughts go, I don't see how I can change thoughts. Some of my thoughts change over time (usually for the worse), but I don't think I have the ability to just change my thinking patterns. When I try to think optimistically I just feel like I'm covering up my real thoughts with fake surface thoughts.


I don't think anything in particular triggered it. I started being sad all the way back in middle school and it's just been a slow decline ever since, gradually changing from mild sadness to relatively severe depression over the course of 7-8 years. So it's not so much out of the blue.

-Lyn

For the sake of not overwhelming you with analysis, I will just say that we can change our thoughts and with time and effort, thinking optimistically can feel genuine. And I 100% believe there was something that sparked this sadness, whether it be biological or environmental.

Remember that it can be tiring and downright annoying to analyze so much. Give yourself time to relax and have fun. It sounds simple but it can be a challenge for those suffering from depression. Deep breathing and meditation have helped me, although I really have to work hard at the concentration part! Meditation (I just meditate on my breathing and heart rate) can help increase a sense of mastery over yourself and environment.

Sit back and enjoy a good movie or engage in your favorite hobby. Really enjoy the time of fun and relaxation.

 

[Everlasting33]

Probably both, as well as my environment.

When I try to think optimistically I just feel like I'm covering up my real thoughts with fake surface thoughts.
-Lyn

I saw this quote from another site and I wanted to pass it along:

"Personally, I've abandoned positive thinking altogether. I haven't given myself to nihilism, either. What's commonly known as positive thinking is little more than self-lobotomization. It's unlikely that you're going to be happy all the time and if you are it'll wear on your sanity. (Or you'll get really, really bored.)

The point in positive thinking is to claim your power over your existence. That's what I'd suggest: a paradigm shift wherein you always acknowledge your power over your circumstances no matter how you feel. This in turn results in a much more optimistic outlook that isn't so prone to naivete.

The truth is that you don't become more positive by never thinking anything "bad," you do it by learning to navigate your inner landscape and accepting it for what it is. Acceptance is the precursor to change."

 

[Penumbra]

I saw this quote from another site and I wanted to pass it along:

"Personally, I've abandoned positive thinking altogether. I haven't given myself to nihilism, either. What's commonly known as positive thinking is little more than self-lobotomization. It's unlikely that you're going to be happy all the time and if you are it'll wear on your sanity. (Or you'll get really, really bored.)

The point in positive thinking is to claim your power over your existence. That's what I'd suggest: a paradigm shift wherein you always acknowledge your power over your circumstances no matter how you feel. This in turn results in a much more optimistic outlook that isn't so prone to naivete.

The truth is that you don't become more positive by never thinking anything "bad," you do it by learning to navigate your inner landscape and accepting it for what it is. Acceptance is the precursor to change."

I'm not sure I understand. Your italicized part talks about acknowledging power over circumstances, but your last part talks about accepting your inner landscape for what it is.

I've long since come to grips with how I feel about myself in the world, but that doesn't seem to provide a solid platform for working from. I feel I have power over some things, yet am completely powerless over other things.

-Lyn

 

[Everlasting33]

I'm not sure I understand. Your italicized part talks about acknowledging power over circumstances, but your last part talks about accepting your inner landscape for what it is.

I've long since come to grips with how I feel about myself in the world, but that doesn't seem to provide a solid platform for working from. I feel I have power over some things, yet am completely powerless over other things.

-Lyn

The quote was geared toward your self-confessed difficulties with positive thinking.

What does it mean to you to accept?

 

[Penumbra]

The quote was geared toward your self-confessed difficulties with positive thinking.

I see that, but am confused as to how he relates acceptance and power over circumstances.

What does it mean to you to accept?

To take notice of as objectively as possible. For instance, if an alcoholic concludes that she or he has a drinking problem, then they have accepted their problem as being real. If a depressed person accepts that they are seriously depressed, then they have accepted their problem as being real.

The only way I can think of interpreting the quote is by both accepting and then not-accepting the same thing. For instance, an alcoholic accepts that she or he has a drinking problem, but then decides that this situation is not acceptable, and decides to fix it.

For a depressed person, it would be accepting that they have a very negative mental landscape, but then deciding that they have power over their circumstances. I don't see how that's possible, though, because what some people say is that depression has a serious clinical side to it, and try as one might, they are not able to change the chemical makeup of their brain. Similarly, a person does not have power over all external circumstances.

-Lyn

 

[Everlasting33]

I see that, but am confused as to how he relates acceptance and power over circumstances. -Lyn

Acceptance means to receive willingly or give admittance.

There is a level of self-condemnation when acceptance is not given free reign. For me, I have disliked my introverted nature since I was a child and I never really accepted that is how I am. Finally, through time and effort, I have accepted. I do not feel resistance and condemnation.

With acceptance, I felt more free to change or modify my thoughts and behaviors.

For a depressed person, it would be accepting that they have a very negative mental landscape, but then deciding that they have power over their circumstances.

I agree.

I don't see how that's possible, though, because what some people say is that depression has a serious clinical side to it,

For some people this may be true but many others it is not. You can also have power over your circumstances through taking medication. Pro- activity.

and try as one might, they are not able to change the chemical makeup of their brain. Similarly, a person does not have power over all external circumstances.

Do you believe this about yourself? (Your depression is biological)

It is really about the power of our response to the circumstances that is so important. There will always be circumstances out of our control or power but the cliche is true: it is how we respond that makes a difference.

 

[Penumbra]

Acceptance means to receive willingly or give admittance.

There is a level of self-condemnation when acceptance is not given free reign. For me, I have disliked my introverted nature since I was a child and I never really accepted that is how I am. Finally, through time and effort, I have accepted. I do not feel resistance and condemnation.

With acceptance, I felt more free to change or modify my thoughts and behaviors.

So you've accepted that you're an introvert and are trying to change/modify into an extrovert, or you've accepted that you're an introvert and are trying to change/modify your thoughts and behaviors so that you are happy with yourself as an introvert?

For some people this may be true but many others it is not. You can also have power over your circumstances through taking medication. Pro- activity.

Taking medication doesn't seem like much control. We take a pill for which the chemical makeup we know virtually nothing about (besides chemists or related professional people, that is. The rest of us just read a little brochure or something and see a little chart and picture with dots between two neurons or something.) because it was prescribed, and then we hope that it works. Some people then have to cycle through taking many different types of medications, or even combining types, over a number of years, to see if anything works. Meanwhile, they have to deal with the side-effects of those medications which range from eating disorders to increased thoughts of suicide. That doesn't sound like control to me.

You've even got a thread on how you've gone through 10 different medications and doubt their effectiveness, so surely you don't disagree that much.
http://www.christianforums.com/t7338229/

Do you believe this about yourself? (Your depression is biological)

I don't know for sure. I've read the symptoms online to see if I do. (For instance, it gives a short list and says you must have at least one of these symptoms, and then gives a larger list and says you must have at least three of these symptoms, and if you do, then you probably have clinical depression). I have most symptoms from lists I read like that. Only a doctor can really diagnose someone, though, so I can't know for sure. (And depression diagnosis is more of an art than a science anyway.) Though I feel like if I went to a doctor, they'd diagnose me with it and then give me medication which I still am not convinced that I actually want.

It may be a combination of biochemical influences as well as emotional/intellectual depression, or it may just be emotional/intellectual depression.

It is really about the power of our response to the circumstances that is so important. There will always be circumstances out of our control or power but the cliche is true: it is how we respond that makes a difference.

Respond how? I can read self-help books about positive thinking, take generic depression drugs for $4 from Wal-Mart pharmacy, pay money that I don't have so someone can sit down with me and try to figure out why I'm sad, and so forth. (Sorry I'm a little jaded today.)

-Lyn

 

[Love233]

Ok I know this might not sound the best but, it helped me emensely. You can write a story in your off time at home about shear off the wall fantasy or whatever you'ld like. You don't have to show anyone. You can steer the story in the direction You want it to go. You can make an adventure, sad or happy, suspenseful, non-eventful, love story. It's kind of like a cool video game. It's really given me a release if only for a short time out of the day. It gave me Something To Look Forward To. So far mine 30 pages. I squeeze time in were I can. I usually don't write too close to bed time though because it's like watching a movie in your mind. How am I going to get these people there? back? you don't even have to make a plot though. Try not to spen too much time in lala land but, enough to bring you back to life. I find if I spend too long at it in a given day, my mind will get foggy and I might get a head ache.

Don't forget to pray too for healing

 

[Penumbra]

Ok I know this might not sound the best but, it helped me emensely. You can write a story in your off time at home about shear off the wall fantasy or whatever you'ld like. You don't have to show anyone. You can steer the story in the direction You want it to go. You can make an adventure, sad or happy, suspenseful, non-eventful, love story. It's kind of like a cool video game. It's really given me a release if only for a short time out of the day. It gave me Something To Look Forward To. So far mine 30 pages. I squeeze time in were I can. I usually don't write too close to bed time though because it's like watching a movie in your mind. How am I going to get these people there? back? you don't even have to make a plot though.

I gave you some reps for the good advice and because I can relate so much to what you say. I've been writing and illustrating stories for a long time. I'm better at illustrating than writing so I tend to go for more of a graphic novel sort of approach than a narrative, but it's the same basic idea. My username is actually a name of one of my characters (though it's also an actual word).

I feel that over time, though, my stories have developed the same way my personality and depression has. I mean, when I was 12 or so my stories were about love and adventure, but now they are about darker themes like war and conflict. I replaced black and white concepts with much more complex themes such as ethically questionable main characters that are difficult to identify as protagonists or antagonists, what is ideal vs what is practical, whether pacifism can be realistic and what if it causes more harm than it solves, self sacrifice, love vs duty, extremism, and antagonist characters with redeeming qualities and detailed sad back-stories as to why they are the way that they are. Plus most of the characters are depressed and depressing because it's hard for me to figure out how to write a happy character.

Try not to spen too much time in lala land but, enough to bring you back to life. I find if I spend too long at it in a given day, my mind will get foggy and I might get a head ache.

Sometimes I feel that I spend too much time thinking about story arcs or the characters and it can be a kind of trap sometimes. The imaginary worlds I make up are sometimes more appealing to me than what I perceive as dullness in this world, and so sometimes I can spend too much time in them and grow more apathetic about this one.

-Lyn

 

[chundemer]

My experience....

When I am in my difficult season I often hyper-focus on work (not necessarly a good thing) but it does help me refocus. I am blessed to have a chapel where I work and on those days, I go before work, during lunch and after work. Yes..How do I get though the work day...PRAYER, PRAYER, and PRAYER.

*When things are getting really difficult, I will take a few minutes and just pray in the cube *

I also put one some head phones and go to a site called oneplace and listen.. has helped MANY TIMES

 

[Everlasting33]

So you've accepted that you're an introvert and are trying to change/modify into an extrovert, or you've accepted that you're an introvert and are trying to change/modify your thoughts and behaviors so that you are happy with yourself as an introvert?

I began rereading some sections of a favorite book of mine (Soul without Shame) and the author believes acceptance is allowing the experience of being without judgment. You got to read the book to understand this idea (heavy reading) However, I have accepted that I can be introverted and that is fine. My inner critic finds fault with everything about me and around me wants to define my worth by many things, one of which is introversion.

My inner critic will always try to get me to doubt my abilities or personality and self-rejection comes easy.

Instead of focusing on my introversion, I focus more on security and intimacy since both can be inhibited through varying degrees of introversion.

Taking medication doesn't seem like much control. We take a pill for which the chemical makeup we know virtually nothing about (besides chemists or related professional people, that is. The rest of us just read a little brochure or something and see a little chart and picture with dots between two neurons or something.) because it was prescribed, and then we hope that it works. Some people then have to cycle through taking many different types of medications, or even combining types, over a number of years, to see if anything works. Meanwhile, they have to deal with the side-effects of those medications which range from eating disorders to increased thoughts of suicide. That doesn't sound like control to me.

My sister-in-law's mother has severe depression and medication helps her tremendously. Some people may have to look around for a medication that works for them. To be pro-active, taking medication, is having control although control in this context is healthy since it is not motivated by fear or insecurity.

You've even got a thread on how you've gone through 10 different medications and doubt their effectiveness, so surely you don't disagree that much.
http://www.christianforums.com/t7338229/

http://www.christianforums.com/t7338229/

Medication was not for me since most of my depression stemmed from environment and low self-esteem. But for some people it relieves their pain and gives me the chance at recovery.

I don't know for sure. I've read the symptoms online to see if I do. (For instance, it gives a short list and says you must have at least one of these symptoms, and then gives a larger list and says you must have at least three of these symptoms, and if you do, then you probably have clinical depression). I have most symptoms from lists I read like that. Only a doctor can really diagnose someone, though, so I can't know for sure. (And depression diagnosis is more of an art than a science anyway.) Though I feel like if I went to a doctor, they'd diagnose me with it and then give me medication which I still am not convinced that I actually want.

Medication could help, you never know. However, you mentioned you engaged in healthy cardio exercise for several times a week. It would seem that if you had mild or even moderate depression, exercise would relieve it somewhat. It may stem more from your thoughts than anything.

Respond how? I can read self-help books about positive thinking, take generic depression drugs for $4 from Wal-Mart pharmacy, pay money that I don't have so someone can sit down with me and try to figure out why I'm sad, and so forth. (Sorry I'm a little jaded today.)

-Lyn

I understand. I have done the same thing and I know I just wish it were more simple and/or I could figure out what I needed and be satisfied.

And as much progress was made through therapy and self-help books, I still have a long way to go...a lifetime of inner work!

I don't know about you but I need to be a little more kind, gentle, caring, tender, and compassionate toward myself. We all could use a little more compassion. And sometimes I just need the strength of it to get through the day.

As the Nike slogan goes: Just do it

 

[Vale Tudo]

Penumbra,

Perhaps you should try to focus on the things you are good at and what you have, instead of the opposite.

If what you are doing isn't working, try something different.

 

[Everlasting33]

I would also like to add that chronic self-focus seems to only make me feel worse: it can be intimidating, exhausting, difficult, and the feeling of running around in circles.

I have to make an effort to think outside myself and do things for other people; letting go of my need to constantly self-analyze and investigate. I have found it hard to balance both self-focus and selflessness but both are necessary, in my opinion, for a healthy functioning life.

If you find yourself focusing too much on your problems and your feelings/thoughts, take a break by doing something fun/engaging your senses, and doing something that you know the other person (friend or family) would really like.

I am trying to do the same right now

 

[rahmiyn]

I would also like to add that chronic self-focus seems to only make me feel worse: it can be intimidating, exhausting, difficult, and the feeling of running around in circles.

I have to make an effort to think outside myself and do things for other people; letting go of my need to constantly self-analyze and investigate. I have found it hard to balance both self-focus and selflessness but both are necessary, in my opinion, for a healthy functioning life.

If you find yourself focusing too much on your problems and your feelings/thoughts, take a break by doing something fun/engaging your senses, and doing something that you know the other person (friend or family) would really like.

I am trying to do the same right now

This is a very good post with advice I'm so many of us can benefit from! Thanks.

 

[Penumbra]

I would also like to add that chronic self-focus seems to only make me feel worse: it can be intimidating, exhausting, difficult, and the feeling of running around in circles.

I have to make an effort to think outside myself and do things for other people; letting go of my need to constantly self-analyze and investigate. I have found it hard to balance both self-focus and selflessness but both are necessary, in my opinion, for a healthy functioning life.

If you find yourself focusing too much on your problems and your feelings/thoughts, take a break by doing something fun/engaging your senses, and doing something that you know the other person (friend or family) would really like.

I am trying to do the same right now

Thanks.

The pictures with you and Vale Tudo look beautiful, btw.

-Lyn

 

[JoshSHill]

Hi. I'm new here, so I'm obviously coming into this relatively late. But your concerns, Penumbra, match up a lot with mine a few years ago and, let's be honest here, probably now too.

Just a couple of things that I thought of.

- I've only recently discovered (I'm 25) that it's ok to have a problem. I've only just found out that going to a counselor does not mean you are committing to changing who you are. Instead, it's about finding a way to deal with who you are. We're perfectly allowed to be introverts (or extroverts). Often, especially with depression that isn't limited to a single stimuli, the only way to deal is to accept, and then with people you trust and who are wise, consider ways to manage.

- Similarly, it was only until I went to see a good doctor that I was informed that it was ok to have medication. That it wasn't some flaw in our faith or selves that said we were weak and couldn't deal with it on our own. It was a revelation, because I figured that I was the problem, not that I had a problem.

- And sometimes, managing and medicine have to go hand in hand. For me, I'm not on anything strong. It just keeps me more or less stable. Doesn't mean I don't drop, but it means I'm less likely to drop as often and as far. And for those times, I have another little pill that helps me level out again.

However, there are things that people around me - my mum, my girlfriend - do to help me. Holding my hand for instance. Getting me out of a crowded situation. For me personally, if I'm alone, I grab a book (if I can) (escaping is perfectly allowed) and if I'm at work, then memory verses and prayer.

Sometimes praying in times like that is trying to talk to someone in a thick fog. You can't see them, don't even know if they're there. But they said they would be there. Said they'd always be around if you needed a hand. So you just have to push through the fog; cry out, scream out, and know that that person can see you just fine.

By geez it's hard. Satan (do we talk about Satan here?) will really go to battle for us sometimes. Really keep pouring that fog in around us so that its as if our prayers haven't been heard. But they are. Keep reaching out.

Does any of that help? Was I on the right track?

 

[Love233]

I gave you some reps for the good advice and because I can relate so much to what you say. I've been writing and illustrating stories for a long time. I'm better at illustrating than writing so I tend to go for more of a graphic novel sort of approach than a narrative, but it's the same basic idea. My username is actually a name of one of my characters (though it's also an actual word).

I feel that over time, though, my stories have developed the same way my personality and depression has. I mean, when I was 12 or so my stories were about love and adventure, but now they are about darker themes like war and conflict. I replaced black and white concepts with much more complex themes such as ethically questionable main characters that are difficult to identify as protagonists or antagonists, what is ideal vs what is practical, whether pacifism can be realistic and what if it causes more harm than it solves, self sacrifice, love vs duty, extremism, and antagonist characters with redeeming qualities and detailed sad back-stories as to why they are the way that they are. Plus most of the characters are depressed and depressing because it's hard for me to figure out how to write a happy character.


Sometimes I feel that I spend too much time thinking about story arcs or the characters and it can be a kind of trap sometimes.

The imaginary worlds I make up are sometimes more appealing to me than what I perceive as dullness in this world, and so sometimes I can spend too much time in them and grow more apathetic about this one.

-Lyn

You certaintly have a point about that. Have you published anything? I like your character by the way. I would Love to see your work... Anything that helps us "get by" is a good thing too. It's one escape that will always be there when we need it. We have to cling to whatever drives us.