Dealing With My Fundy Parents (Help!)

Follower of Christ · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Hello everyone, I've lurked at these boards for a long time, but never posted anything. I've learned a lot of things here, I grew up in a fundamentalist home, but I see how damaging and insane those beliefs are. Right now I'm probably so liberal in my christian beliefs that some wouldn't even consider me to be christian. I don't believe in hell, I definitely don't believe in a literal bible, and I think that christians have a lot of wrong opinions about God.

Anyway, that brings me to my situation, a few days ago I was talking with my mom (a really strict fundamentalist Baptist). I don't remember exactly how it came up, but I mentioned something about evolution and she absolutely spazzed out. She was going on about how wrong and ungodly evolution is and how it can't be right because it contradicts the bible. I told her that perhaps it's just how she is interpereting it and she flipped out again, she says that you can tell when the bible is allegorical and when it's not, and that genesis was definitely not. I asked her how she knew that it had to be taken literally, and I think that kind of threw her off, so she went on a rant about how I was going to hell and I needed to pray for forgiveness...

Then, I asked her if she really thought about how silly the idea of hell was, that really seemed to rub her the wrong way. Anyway, long story short, my name is erased from the book of life and I work for satan (another thing I don't really believe in literally) now. My mom isn't talking to me now and my dad is in China on a business trip for another week, so I'm kind of lost. What should I do, just pretend that the devil had control of me then and say that I believe everything in the exact way she does, which is the only right way? Don't get me wrong, I love my mom, but I think she's a close-minded nimrod and I don't know how to deal with her at all. I know we'll have a talk with my dad when she gets home and hopefully he'll be a little more understanding. Anybody else have to deal with fundy parents like this?

I know the majority of the people here are not like my mom at all, and don't think that I'm going to hell or anything.

By the way, she's not keeping me home from school or anything, I'm there right now, study hall.

About the Genesis thing anway......Genesis is a History book....now folks will deny that till their eyes are protruding, but look it over, yoiull see.

I think your mom would have said that given that she wasnt so distraught at the time of the arguement.

Thing is, I do feel sorry for you...
She should be more inclined to talk to you about this stuff.
She should know by now that she cannot force you to believe or have faith in things you dont want to.

good luck

SavedByGrace3 · Sep 28, 2004

Good points Brimmy,
I still maintain that everyone who is alive and believes anything strongly enough to promote it is a fundy. Even if that is unpleasant to accept.
The road to understanding and living together is to see that fact. Those who think they rise above it and are somehow immune from it are on a certain path to it and the darker side of it we so often see.
It is always the folks with the grand transcendent ideas that isolate and separate.

Brimshack said:
Yes, it will help the OP to know that there is more than one side to teh story, precisely why your present attempt to reduce all of them to a single equivalent value isn't very helpful. You are not the only one who suggested moderation with respect to the mother, and your revision of "fundamentalism does nothing to advance that goal anyway. I too would be wary of telling someone to break off relations with his mother, but the soundness of that advice has NO bearing on the question of whether or not that advice or the person giving it are in any way "fundamentalist." As I said, there are others here who have given more moderate advice. If you were upset at the tone or our responses, then I can certainly understand your attempt to counter them. The *** for tat logic of your arguments just isn't the best way to do that.

WaZoO · Sep 28, 2004

didaskalos said:
But it will perhaps help the OPer see that there are more sides to the story than just a "nimrod" mother. I suspect there is more to the story when someone calls their mother a "nimrod". Where will all these people who are advocating breaking up this family relationship be in 5 years when this 18 year old or her mother (or both) have changed their minds? Which fundy will give in first?

The worse possible advice is to break with family and friends. That is worse than fundy... that is more like a cult.

Ok, didaskalos, I agree that "nimrod" was a bad choice of words, don't make a big thing out of it. I'm not planning on letting my family break up over a petty disagreement, don't worry. I suspect that in 5 years our relationship will be just fine, I'm more concerned with dealing with the immediate future now though.

I'm going to be back later on, thanks to everyone who took the time to try to help!

SavedByGrace3 · Sep 28, 2004

sparklecat said:
Sure I do. Does believing things make me a fundamentalist? Thought it just meant that I believed things.

That is what the fundies say.

Hydra009 · Sep 28, 2004

didaskalos, I don't think you are using the term "fundamentalism" the way that it is defined.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=fundamentalism

sparklecat · Sep 28, 2004

didaskalos said:
That is what the fundies say.

I give up. Annoying fundy!

Brimshack · Sep 28, 2004

didaskalos said:
Good points Brimmy,
I still maintain that everyone who is alive and believes anything strongly enough to promote it is a fundy. Even if that is unpleasant to accept.
The road to understanding and living together is to see that fact. Those who think they rise above it and are somehow immune from it are on a certain path to it and the darker side of it we so often see.
It is always the folks with the grand transcendent ideas that isolate and separate.

Alright, this is as close as we are going to get to understanding each other today. I'm inclined to save this disagreement for another thread, and let Wazoo have her thread back.

Take care Didaskalos

Annabel Lee · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Also, don't ever tell your child(ren) than they are going to hell, it makes you feel extremely uncomfortable.

It's bad enough when a stranger tells you that you're going to burn in Hell, but this statement coming from a loved one would be especially heart breaking.

Follower of Christ · Sep 28, 2004

didaskalos said:
It is always the folks with the grand transcendent ideas that isolate and separate.

A LOT of OT prophets just came to mind when I read this.

Follower of Christ · Sep 28, 2004

Annabel Lee said:
It's bad enough when a stranger tells you that you're going to burn in Hell, but this statement coming from a loved one would be especially heart breaking.

Its sad that a family member would do that.
I mean, if my kids came to me and asked me what the bible says about hell, Id be glad to share it with them, but its not in my power to know where they will go.
I can point out things in their lives that do not fit the sound teachings of scripture for them if they want as I do with my kids when they want to talk bible talk with me, but Im not about to start waving the stick and condemning anyone to hell...

I would however tell them, IF they were inquiring, as to whether or not I felt that, taking scripture into account, they were leading a life that might lead them to hell or not...

SavedByGrace3 · Sep 28, 2004

My kids were normal.
When they were good they were good.
When they were bad... they were good at it.
I never once told them they were going to hell... even when they were being especially good at being bad. What I could not impress upon them with love and reasonable toughness... a magistrate explained to them in no uncertain terms.
They are all grown, married, (except one) and working on families of their own.
I suspect if I had pushed hell and damnation on them they may have reacted like WaZ.
Hang in there WaZ.... do not be too hard on the mom. Her approach may be rough edged, but I think her heart is in the right place.
My parents kicked me out when I was 18. Been alone and without ever since. It is not fun to be alone. Try to keep things together.
Love
Dids

Zen_Woof · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Hello everyone, I've lurked at these boards for a long time, but never posted anything. I've learned a lot of things here, I grew up in a fundamentalist home, but I see how damaging and insane those beliefs are. Right now I'm probably so liberal in my christian beliefs that some wouldn't even consider me to be christian. I don't believe in hell, I definitely don't believe in a literal bible, and I think that christians have a lot of wrong opinions about God.

Anyway, that brings me to my situation, a few days ago I was talking with my mom (a really strict fundamentalist Baptist). I don't remember exactly how it came up, but I mentioned something about evolution and she absolutely spazzed out. She was going on about how wrong and ungodly evolution is and how it can't be right because it contradicts the bible. I told her that perhaps it's just how she is interpereting it and she flipped out again, she says that you can tell when the bible is allegorical and when it's not, and that genesis was definitely not. I asked her how she knew that it had to be taken literally, and I think that kind of threw her off, so she went on a rant about how I was going to hell and I needed to pray for forgiveness...

Then, I asked her if she really thought about how silly the idea of hell was, that really seemed to rub her the wrong way. Anyway, long story short, my name is erased from the book of life and I work for satan (another thing I don't really believe in literally) now. My mom isn't talking to me now and my dad is in China on a business trip for another week, so I'm kind of lost. What should I do, just pretend that the devil had control of me then and say that I believe everything in the exact way she does, which is the only right way? Don't get me wrong, I love my mom, but I think she's a close-minded nimrod and I don't know how to deal with her at all. I know we'll have a talk with my dad when she gets home and hopefully he'll be a little more understanding. Anybody else have to deal with fundy parents like this?

I know the majority of the people here are not like my mom at all, and don't think that I'm going to hell or anything.

By the way, she's not keeping me home from school or anything, I'm there right now, study hall.

It's a difficult problem, to be sure. For the sake of your relationship (assuming you want to have one), I would advise being respectful of her and her beliefs while being firm that you believe differently. I don't mean go looking for fights, but if you feel manipulated, just say "I don't believe that but I respect your right to believe that" and/or "I don't want to talk about this when you're upset." It's better to stay calm so you both don't say things you'll regret later.

It's probably a shock to your Mom that you're going down such a different path, but I'm sure she loves you. Hopefully you'll end up coming to some kind of understanding but you might end up not being able to talk about religion. The most important thing is for you to be comfortable with your decision, whatever it might ultimately be. We all change throughout life, so who knows. You could become a Christian again. Or you could become an atheist.

Does this make sense? Take care. And good luck!

With metta,
ZW

WaZoO · Sep 28, 2004

Hey everyone, thanks for the good advice. Me and my mom are fine again! I'll spare you all the details, but we've basically just agreed that it's alright to disagree about smaller things as long as we both understand what Jesus wants for us. I'm very proud of my mother, she's being more understanding than I thought she ever could, she's not all that bad, she just feels strongly about what she believes in. Another thing, I'm no longer going to hell! Yippie!

God of Love · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Hello everyone, I've lurked at these boards for a long time, but never posted anything. I've learned a lot of things here, I grew up in a fundamentalist home, but I see how damaging and insane those beliefs are. Right now I'm probably so liberal in my christian beliefs that some wouldn't even consider me to be christian. I don't believe in hell, I definitely don't believe in a literal bible, and I think that christians have a lot of wrong opinions about God.

Anyway, that brings me to my situation, a few days ago I was talking with my mom (a really strict fundamentalist Baptist). I don't remember exactly how it came up, but I mentioned something about evolution and she absolutely spazzed out. She was going on about how wrong and ungodly evolution is and how it can't be right because it contradicts the bible. I told her that perhaps it's just how she is interpereting it and she flipped out again, she says that you can tell when the bible is allegorical and when it's not, and that genesis was definitely not. I asked her how she knew that it had to be taken literally, and I think that kind of threw her off, so she went on a rant about how I was going to hell and I needed to pray for forgiveness...

Then, I asked her if she really thought about how silly the idea of hell was, that really seemed to rub her the wrong way. Anyway, long story short, my name is erased from the book of life and I work for satan (another thing I don't really believe in literally) now. My mom isn't talking to me now and my dad is in China on a business trip for another week, so I'm kind of lost.

When you say that your mother isn't talking to you, am I correct in assuming that she is giving you "the cold shoulder"?

If so, I would ask that you consider this:

When a person withholds their love from another (as a form of punishment), who is it who's being punished?

WaZoO said:
What should I do, just pretend that the devil had control of me then and say that I believe everything in the exact way she does, which is the only right way?

My humble advice, for whatever it's worth, is that you treat her with love and respect and refrain from discussing religion. Rather than act childish and controlling (by withholding your love in an attempt to control behavior), act as if nothing has happened.

I would strongly advise against denying your own religious beliefs because doing so wouldn't be doing your parents any favors. While they have a right to their beliefs, a certain amount of exposure to other beliefs systems would likely be in their best interest. Yet rather than talking (or arguing) about it, the best example might come through you actually living your beliefs, and allowing your actions to provide the message.

Through every action we do, we provide a message to others. By not falling into the "I'll withhold my love if you don't behave as I wish" trap, you are sending a tacit message.

God Bless,

God of Love

Metacrock · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Hello everyone, I've lurked at these boards for a long time, but never posted anything. I've learned a lot of things here, I grew up in a fundamentalist home, but I see how damaging and insane those beliefs are. Right now I'm probably so liberal in my christian beliefs that some wouldn't even consider me to be christian. I don't believe in hell, I definitely don't believe in a literal bible, and I think that christians have a lot of wrong opinions about God.

Anyway, that brings me to my situation, a few days ago I was talking with my mom (a really strict fundamentalist Baptist). I don't remember exactly how it came up, but I mentioned something about evolution and she absolutely spazzed out. She was going on about how wrong and ungodly evolution is and how it can't be right because it contradicts the bible. I told her that perhaps it's just how she is interpereting it and she flipped out again, she says that you can tell when the bible is allegorical and when it's not, and that genesis was definitely not. I asked her how she knew that it had to be taken literally, and I think that kind of threw her off, so she went on a rant about how I was going to hell and I needed to pray for forgiveness...

Then, I asked her if she really thought about how silly the idea of hell was, that really seemed to rub her the wrong way. Anyway, long story short, my name is erased from the book of life and I work for satan (another thing I don't really believe in literally) now. My mom isn't talking to me now and my dad is in China on a business trip for another week, so I'm kind of lost. What should I do, just pretend that the devil had control of me then and say that I believe everything in the exact way she does, which is the only right way? Don't get me wrong, I love my mom, but I think she's a close-minded nimrod and I don't know how to deal with her at all. I know we'll have a talk with my dad when she gets home and hopefully he'll be a little more understanding. Anybody else have to deal with fundy parents like this?

I know the majority of the people here are not like my mom at all, and don't think that I'm going to hell or anything.

By the way, she's not keeping me home from school or anything, I'm there right now, study hall.

Man does that take me back. I did that kind of questioning as a kid. I tried to include my parents in my search for my own identity, or at least to let them know that I had one. Not cool. They were wonderful people in many ways, but they could not handel the idea of thinking beyond the confines of our wonderful little world of Chruch of Christ in Dallas Texas.

In the bitterness that followed our blow ups I turned to atheism. I wish I had just kept my mouth shut. I really hurt them and it wasn't worth it. They weren't capable of understanding the idea of outgrowing your roots. So why inflict that upon them? Wait until you are 30 and it wil be eiaser and you will see by then to pick your battles and not cause hurt in the family when it isn't necessary.

Here's a line from an old song from my youth that comes to mind

"Teach your children well," Crosby Stills, Nash, and Young.

"Never ask them why
If they told you
You would cry
so just look at them
and sign
and know they love you."

Metacrock · Sep 28, 2004

Zen_Woof said:
It's a difficult problem, to be sure. For the sake of your relationship (assuming you want to have one), I would advise being respectful of her and her beliefs while being firm that you believe differently. I don't mean go looking for fights, but if you feel manipulated, just say "I don't believe that but I respect your right to believe that" and/or "I don't want to talk about this when you're upset." It's better to stay calm so you both don't say things you'll regret later.

It's probably a shock to your Mom that you're going down such a different path, but I'm sure she loves you. Hopefully you'll end up coming to some kind of understanding but you might end up not being able to talk about religion. The most important thing is for you to be comfortable with your decision, whatever it might ultimately be. We all change throughout life, so who knows. You could become a Christian again. Or you could become an atheist.

Does this make sense? Take care. And good luck!

With metta,
ZW

right, I agree. As I say by the time you are 30 it will all look very different. It wont seem nearly as important to get them to understand that you have changes your views, as it will to just be connected to them and to know that they know that you love them.

12volt_man · Sep 28, 2004

WaZoO said:
Hello everyone, I've lurked at these boards for a long time, but never posted anything. I've learned a lot of things here, I grew up in a fundamentalist home, but I see how damaging and insane those beliefs are. Right now I'm probably so liberal in my christian beliefs that some wouldn't even consider me to be christian. I don't believe in hell, I definitely don't believe in a literal bible, and I think that christians have a lot of wrong opinions about God.

Anyway, that brings me to my situation, a few days ago I was talking with my mom (a really strict fundamentalist Baptist). I don't remember exactly how it came up, but I mentioned something about evolution and she absolutely spazzed out. She was going on about how wrong and ungodly evolution is and how it can't be right because it contradicts the bible. I told her that perhaps it's just how she is interpereting it and she flipped out again, she says that you can tell when the bible is allegorical and when it's not, and that genesis was definitely not. I asked her how she knew that it had to be taken literally, and I think that kind of threw her off, so she went on a rant about how I was going to hell and I needed to pray for forgiveness...

Then, I asked her if she really thought about how silly the idea of hell was, that really seemed to rub her the wrong way. Anyway, long story short, my name is erased from the book of life and I work for satan (another thing I don't really believe in literally) now. My mom isn't talking to me now and my dad is in China on a business trip for another week, so I'm kind of lost. What should I do, just pretend that the devil had control of me then and say that I believe everything in the exact way she does, which is the only right way? Don't get me wrong, I love my mom, but I think she's a close-minded nimrod and I don't know how to deal with her at all. I know we'll have a talk with my dad when she gets home and hopefully he'll be a little more understanding. Anybody else have to deal with fundy parents like this?

I know the majority of the people here are not like my mom at all, and don't think that I'm going to hell or anything.

By the way, she's not keeping me home from school or anything, I'm there right now, study hall.

So, you told your mother that her most sacred beliefs are "insane" and "silly", now you're calling her names and you can't understand why she's upset?

So, if Christians are "insane", "silly" and "closed minded nimrods" (by the way, before you call someone that, maybe it would be a good idea for you to find out who Nimrod was so that you don't look any more like an idiot), then why did you come to a Christian message board to ask advice?

The only advice I have for you is to be grateful you're her kid and not mine.

Robby · Sep 28, 2004

Be nice to your mama!

12volt_man · Sep 28, 2004

silverflare said:
Be straightforward about what you believe. Tell them your beliefs do not change your love for them and that you should hope it works the other way around.

Have you read his post? I can't tell that he has any love for his mother at all.

Metacrock · Sep 28, 2004

12volt_man said:
Have you read his post? I can't tell that he has any love for his mother at all.

Not our job to make sure he loves his mother. I think he has issues with his upbrining and he's concerned that they understand him. He probably feels they don't and that is a source of bitterness.

I don't think we should presume to understand the guy's heart after one post. Just pray for him.

Dealing With My Fundy Parents (Help!)

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