Darwinism is a Pseudo-Science

[Loudmouth]

And you didn't provide evidence that knowledge is only knowledge if it can be demonstrated.

That is how knowledge is defined, as demonstrable fact. It is the same way that we define 2+2=4.

 

[Oncedeceived]

And sometimes, people can claim to have certain personal knowledge and be wrong.

And sometimes Scientific knowledge is wrong as well, even that which was thought objective evidence of it.

 

[bhsmte]

And you didn't provide evidence that knowledge is only knowledge if it can be demonstrated.

I didn't have to, because I gave that to you and stated; people can have what we call "personal knowledge", that does not require objective evidence to verify.

So, lets see if you can answer the straight forward question:

Another person believes in a different God than you and states they have knowledge their God exists and they know they are correct.

Would you agree this person has personal knowledge just as you claim to have? Would you agree with this person's claim of personal knowledge?

 

[bhsmte]

And sometimes Scientific knowledge is wrong as well, even that which was thought objective evidence of it.

Yep and that is why science is self correcting. Too many dudes out there peeling back the layers and examining objective evidence.

 

[Loudmouth]

And sometimes Scientific knowledge is wrong as well, even that which was thought objective evidence of it.

Compare that to beliefs which can never be wrong, no matter what the evidence is.

 

[Oncedeceived]

That is how knowledge is defined, as demonstrable fact. It is the same way that we define 2+2=4.

Acutally:

Knowledge:

1. acquaintance with facts, truths, or principles, as from study or investigation; general erudition: knowledge of many things.

2. familiarity or conversance, as with a particular subject or branch of learning: A knowledge of accounting was necessary for the job.


3. acquaintance or familiarity gained by sight, experience, or report: a knowledge of human nature.


4. the fact or state of knowing; the perception of fact or truth; clear and certain mental apprehension.

5. awareness, as of a fact or circumstance: He had knowledge of her good fortune.


6. something that is or may be known; information: He sought knowledge of her activities.


7. the body of truths or facts accumulated in the course of time.

 

[Loudmouth]

Acutally:

Knowledge:

1. acquaintance with facts, truths, or principles, as from study or investigation; general erudition: knowledge of many things.

Exactly. That is the opposite of religious beliefs which are held in the absence of facts or investigation.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Yep and that is why science is self correcting. Too many dudes out there peeling back the layers and examining objective evidence.

Which only means that knowledge is not absolute in any form.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Exactly. That is the opposite of religious beliefs which are held in the absence of facts or investigation.

This statement carries with it two assumptions:

1. That religious beliefs are held in absence of facts or investigation.
2. That religious beliefs are the same as knowledge of God.

 

[Loudmouth]

This statement carries with it two assumptions:

1. That religious beliefs are held in absence of facts or investigation.

It is backed by the observation that you can't present any facts to back your religious claims.

2. That religious beliefs are the same as knowledge of God.

You haven't demonstrated that you have knowledge of God. That's the whole point. All you have is religious belief.

 

[Oncedeceived]

I didn't have to, because I gave that to you and stated; people can have what we call "personal knowledge", that does not require objective evidence to verify.

So, lets see if you can answer the straight forward question:

Another person believes in a different God than you and states they have knowledge their God exists and they know they are correct.

Would you agree this person has personal knowledge just as you claim to have? Would you agree with this person's claim of personal knowledge?

I answered that in post #470

I will ask you again; the person who believes in a different God than you, who claims to have personal knowledge they know their God exists, they have knowledge, correct? Just as you claim to have knowledge that the God you believe in exists.

Do you believe the person who claims to have knowledge the different God they believe in exists, is correct?
​

I don't even know if someone who holds to the Christian God as God has knowledge of Him. Our base or foundation of knowing of having knowledge of something is based on the certainty and the evidence we have in our lives. We have those things we believe to be true and those things we know to be true. We exist, we know this is true with complete certainty. We believe rather than know that the sun will "rise" tomorrow. Our knowledge comes from what we see as evidence to gain that knowledge rather than something we have little or no evidence for so we believe rather than know.

 

[Oncedeceived]

Stating you know something exists before you're able to demonstrate something exists, is well, foolish.

Knowledge is simply an understanding of reality, and exists regardless of belief. Which is why theists need "faith" to believe in god/s, because it's the very thing they can't demonstrate.

IF knowledge is just an understanding of reality it does not have to be demonstrable.

We can't share that knowledge but we can know.

 

[bhsmte]

I answered that in post #470

I will ask you again; the person who believes in a different God than you, who claims to have personal knowledge they know their God exists, they have knowledge, correct? Just as you claim to have knowledge that the God you believe in exists.

Do you believe the person who claims to have knowledge the different God they believe in exists, is correct?
​

I don't even know if someone who holds to the Christian God as God has knowledge of Him. Our base or foundation of knowing of having knowledge of something is based on the certainty and the evidence we have in our lives. We have those things we believe to be true and those things we know to be true. We exist, we know this is true with complete certainty. We believe rather than know that the sun will "rise" tomorrow. Our knowledge comes from what we see as evidence to gain that knowledge rather than something we have little or no evidence for so we believe rather than know.

Maybe I missing something here, but let me try again.

You claim to have knowledge that the God you believe in exists, and you know this to be true. Is that correct?

The person who believes in another God (different than you) also claims to have knowledge their God exists and they know it to be true. Your position would be, the other person's knowledge is incorrect?

 

[Oncedeceived]

Then you admit that you believe god/s exist, but you really can't say you know god/s exist.

I'm glad you're willing to admit this. It makes you appear more reasonable now.

No, sorry to disappoint you. I know God exists.

 

[HitchSlap]

No, sorry to disappoint you. I know God exists.

Incorrect.

You believe god/s exist. Unless you can demonstrate it's existence, all you have is belief, not knowledge.

 

[bhsmte]

No, sorry to disappoint you. I know God exists.

Do you also "know" the person who believes just as strongly in a different God, is wrong about their belief?

 

[Oncedeceived]

No, sorry to disappoint you. I know God exists.

Incorrect.

You believe god/s exist. Unless you can demonstrate it's existence, all you have is belief, not knowledge.

So you do not believe in personal knowledge?

 

[bhsmte]

Incorrect.

You believe god/s exist. Unless you can demonstrate it's existence, all you have is belief, not knowledge.

At this point and really always, the exercise has been about convincing the self. For some, claiming certain knowledge, but not being able to show it to others, doesn't really matter. It may cause a bit of discomfort, but the salve is then applied; "I just know".

 

[Loudmouth]

So you do not believe in personal knowledge?

Do you believe in completely contradictory phrases?

 

[Loudmouth]

No, sorry to disappoint you. I know God exists.

Then you should be able to demonstrate that God exists. Where is that demonstration?