Daniel 9:27

[Straightshot]

"Actually, the gospels do record the start date of the 70th week in John."


Show me and I will assist you with a correct interpretation

 

[StephanieSomer]

So from 583bc (daily sacrifice ceased) 1290yrs we come to 688 AD. Whats 688AD? Its the dome of the Rock built on the temple mount. And indeed when this happened 1 million Jews/Christians were killed and they fled Jerusalem from the invading Arab armies, (Matthew 24v15-16, Mark 13v13). They thought they built it on the Holy of holy but they built it on the Court of the Gentiles

Your math is off by 20 years. There is 1270 years from 583 B.C. to 688 A.D. not 1290.

 

[StephanieSomer]

The Lord has stated that know one can know the date of his RETURN - not his first coming.

Actually, no He didn't. He stated that no man DID know the date of His return AT THE TIME HE SPOKE THAT WORD. He never said that that knowledge would remain unknown. In reality, at the time He spoke that word, it included even Himself, as He added, "not even the Son of Man". But, that doesn't mean He didn't LATER receive that knowledge. Truly, it appears that He DID receive more knowledge later, since He appeared to John and gave him the Revelation, which btw, is correctly called, "The Revelation of Jesus Christ".

 

[StephanieSomer]

I Daniel 7 its the 1st year of Belshazzar reign in 552bc. Daniel is given the visions of the 4 Gentile beasts/kingdoms that would occupy the Holy Land Israel and the middle east. And also its mainly concerning the Jews, and in verse 25 we come to the first time, times, and half or 2500 years. In 1948 Israel became a nation for the first time in 2500 years. 1948-2500=552BC.

This is another miscalculation. There is no year "0". So, the time span from 552 B.C to 1948 A.D. is 2499, not 2500.

 

[Douggg]

The passage in Deuteronomy which you reference is one I was not aware of. Quite interesting. It agrees exactly with the timeline of Christ's return that I have long held. For, if this IS the covenant being referenced, and I believe your argument is solid enough to support that, then not only does the 7 years begin with the Feast of Tabernacles, it also ends with the Feast of Tabernacles. I have long held that the Lord will return during the Feast of Tabernacles, based on the prophecy of Zechariah which announces that all nations during the Millennium shall send an emissary to Jerusalem each year to honor the King at the Feast of Tabernacles. Any nation which fails to do so shall receive no rain for the following year. The only logical reason for the nations to commemorate the Feast of Tabernacles would be to celebrate the King's rule. Similar to the US holiday of 4th of July, the world's nations shall commemorate the rule of the new King. So, it would appear from Zechariah that the King's rule begins at the Feast of Tabernacles. One other significant prophetic mirror which appears in the Feasts is the command for all males to present themselves to the Lord in Jerusalem at three specific Feasts: Passover, Pentecost, and the Feast of Tabernacles. Of all Church history, three specific events stand out as pre-eminent before the rest: the Crucifixion, the coming of the Holy Spirit, and the return of Christ. The first two coincided with two of the Feasts that God had already designated as one of the most important. The remaining one shall coincide with the last of the three.

imo, the first coming/spring feasts - second coming/fall feasts is a solid theory. It may not turn out like that, but it seems rationale.

 

[StephanieSomer]

So no one can know this dating that will trigger the 70th week .... the Lord will intervene as a thief .... no signs, no warning

1 Thess 5:1 - 4
Now, brothers and sisters, about times and dates we do not need to write to you, for you know very well that the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night. While people are saying, “Peace and safety,” destruction will come on them suddenly, as labor pains on a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.

But you, brothers and sisters, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief.

Paul seemed to disagree with your assessment.

 

[BABerean2]

Mat_21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.


The Lord is speaking to an unbelieving Israel that has rejected Him .... but this condition of Israel's blindness is going to change [Romans 11:25-36]

You left out the most important verse, necessary for what you have posted to become true.


Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

.

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[Straightshot]

"Paul seemed to disagree with your assessment."

1 Thessalonians 5:1-9 must also be congruent with the Lord's telling that no one can know

The believer in Jesus Christ doe not have to be concerned about the dating because we are not in darkness as are those of the world .... and the Lord has not revealed the dating [Acts 1:6-7] ....we know that He will come as a thief does .... no warning, no signs

There are no contradictions in the Lord's taught word

 

[Straightshot]

"You left out the most important verse, necessary for what you have posted to become true."

I don't leave things out son


And you don't want to suggest the one you pick ..... this one actually refutes your view

In fact the entire chapter speaks of a future believing remnant of Israel that will form the core of the Lord's future millennial kingdom upon the earth [Micah 4; 5]

.... after the fullness of the Gentiles is added

Do not boast against the branches

 

[BABerean2]

"You left out the most important verse, necessary for what you have posted to become true."

I don't leave things out son


And you don't want to suggest the one you pick ..... this one actually refutes your view

In fact the entire chapter speaks of a future believing remnant of Israel that will form the core of the Lord's future millennial kingdom upon the earth [Micah 4; 5]

.... after the fullness of the Gentiles is added

Do not boast against the branches

Will Christians have any part in this future millennial kingdom?

.

 

[Straightshot]

No it does not refute .... this is what you think


Of course immortal Christians will have a part

And the mortals who choose Him will populate the kingdom

 

[BABerean2]

No it does not refute .... this is what you think


Of course immortal Christians will have a part

And the mortals who choose Him will populate the kingdom

Based on your statement below, I was trying to understand the part the Church plays in the millennium.
Are we involved in the core of the kingdom?

"...a future believing remnant of Israel that will form the core of the Lord's future millennial kingdom upon the earth [Micah 4; 5]"

.

 

[StephanieSomer]

"Paul seemed to disagree with your assessment."

1 Thessalonians 5:1-9 must also be congruent with the Lord's telling that no one can know

The believer in Jesus Christ doe not have to be concerned about the dating because we are not in darkness as are those of the world .... and the Lord has not revealed the dating [Acts 1:6-7] ....we know that He will come as a thief does .... no warning, no signs

There are no contradictions in the Lord's taught word

Christ never said that no man can know. He said that no man did know. At the time He spoke, He spoke the truth. That doesn't preclude further revelation. And, I am not espousing being preoccupied with dating. That's a waste of precious time. However, He would never had given clues to the time if we are not meant to recognize it when it is coming. Your stance leaves His whole church in eternal ignorance of what the Lord is doing. He's not like that.

 

[Straightshot]

What is the Lord doing now in your opinion?

You cannot know when He will next intervene .... many have attempted to predict, but are always wrong

And this behavior has done much damage to the Christian cause

You say that what I post on this forum leaves the church in total ignorance .... have you ever read?

Take a look sometime and then tell me that I post in ignorance

.... but you cannot know the time [the dating]

He could tarry longer ..... or He could break in before this day is over

He will give no signs before the break in .... no warning .... all of the signs will come just after and leading up to His visible appearance at the end of His coming judgment upon the earth

And if you are living on the earth at the time you will experience the real signs that He speaks of

I am curious, what things have lead you to believe that His intervention is near, and what signs do you see?

 

[StephanieSomer]

What is the Lord doing now in your opinion?

You cannot know when He will next intervene .... many have attempted to predict, but are always wrong

And this behavior has done much damage to the Christian cause

You say that what I post on this forum leaves the church in total ignorance .... have you ever read?

Take a look sometime and then tell me that I post in ignorance

.... but you cannot know the time [the dating]

He could tarry longer ..... or He could break in before this day is over

He will give no signs before the break in .... no warning .... all of the signs will come just after and leading up to His visible appearance at the end of His coming judgment upon the earth

And if you are living on the earth at the time you will experience the real signs that He speaks of

I am curious, what things have lead you to believe that His intervention is near, and what signs do you see?

THAT is highly doubtful. Scripture is pretty explicit in Thessalonians that He isn't coming, nor are we being raptured, until AFTER the man of sin is revealed. That hasn't happened yet.

 

[Straightshot]

"THAT is highly doubtful. Scripture is pretty explicit in Thessalonians that He isn't coming, nor are we being raptured, until AFTER the man of sin is revealed. That hasn't happened yet."


True, Satan's beast has not been revealed in the open yet

.... but this one will rise during the coming tribulation of the Lord's judgment .... and I can assure that it is the Lord who will be waiting for him .... to cut his rant short, and will even use him to destroy the "great city" of MBG [Revelation 13:1-4; 17:16-18]

And I don't know who "we" is, but I would suggest that you go for this gathering [2 Thessalonians 2:1; Revelation 3:10] .... do not wait

Paul explains to those of this gathering the false teaching of the day .... that the day of the Lord had already come .... he tells them no, don't believe it .... not true .... and know that we will be gathered by the Lord first ....before

 

[gospelfer]

Clemenslee is on the right track! He correctly identifies Daniel's primary theme: gentile trampling of the Land -- the Mosaic curse. Daniel's prophecies are a series of different lenses through which we can look at this period.

There is no gap in the 70 heptads. The prince's heptad is a separate one using the same heptad measure used in the rest of Daniel's prophecies.

This heptad is approximate, but we are given its exact duration in Dan 12, where it is broken into two halves:
1290 and 1335 years.

The first 1/2 heptad starts with Nebucadnezzars 597 destruction of the city, and ends with the 692+ construction of the abomination of desolation (the Dome of the Rock).

The second 1/2 heptad picks up there.

Note how well this mates with Revelation: The first beast (the first 6 heads) last 1260 years from the 1/2 heptad's start. The sixth head has a dead period during which the world thinks the beast has ceased as a threatening force; This sixth head ends around 1950, marking the time when the ME was returned to Muslim autonomy. Thus the dead period is that leading up to 1950. This has an uncanny coherence with history.

Note that this satisfied a number of things: Daniel's theme is maintained; it starts with Nebuchadnezzars sack of Jerusalem (the starting of the trampling), and sticks to the land throughout. There are no gaps. And dates line up amazingly well. Furthermore it explains the sequence of the beasts 6 heads as the succession of Muslim powers to control Jeruslam: Rashidun, Umayyad, Abbasid, Fatimid, Mamalukes, Ottomans. Of course, now we are in the the 7th head (2nd beast), which Daniel describes as being fragmented, and in conflict.

It also explains why Daniel 2's feet are iron welded by clay, and it also explains why Daniel 11 describes the last human trampling power as a monotheistic religious one whose principle is war. Thus, chunks of iron are the 7 heads, and the welding clay is Islam. It also explains the repeated assertion of its success and its wearing out belief. The problems this solves are too numerous to list.

"Primary Prophecy" contains a detailed explanation of all this (and much more besides) -- its on Amazon.

 

[Straightshot]

"There is no gap in the 70 heptads"


Oh but there is a period of silence in the visions of the prophets about 2000 years as we speak

This period is between the end of the 69th and the beginning of the 70th

There is not one event upon the earth in the record of the prophets visions between

If you can find one, show me .... all of the prophets see it, because they do not see it

All fulfilled prophecy lies on the other side of the line .... and the unfulfilled balance is yet to come

If you cannot see this .... you are not looking

If you do discover it this will greatly enhance your interpretive ability and many kinks will straighten

There is another that the Evolutionists hate [Genesis 1:1 ............ 1.2], but this is another subject for study