Current Teaching on Purgatory?

[ByzantineDixie]

Could you help me understand what the Catholic church teaches today regarding Purgatory?

I was brought up in the Catholic church and was taught that Purgatory was the place we went to before we entered heaven. Purgatory was just as bad as Hell but there was an end to it, as opposed to Hell being eternal. Further, the time one spent in Purgatory was directly proportional to the sin in the person's life...an extremely sinful person (but not so sinful as to merit Hell) would spend a longer time in Purgatory than a less sinful person.

How does this teaching by the Precious Blood nuns in my little parochial school in the 1960's square with what is taught today?

Thank you!

Peace

Rose

 

[Dream]

It's basically a purifying state. A soul needs to be cleansed before it can enter the kingdom of God.

As far as time in Purgatory, I don't think there is any specific teachings of the Catholic Church.

 

[Carrye]

I was brought up in the Catholic church and was taught that Purgatory was the place we went to before we entered heaven.

Whether Purgatory is a place or a state of being is still up for discussion.

Purgatory was just as bad as Hell but there was an end to it, as opposed to Hell being eternal.

My sense is that it's not as bad for the very reason you point out - it's not hopeless. But that's just from the little I've read.

Further, the time one spent in Purgatory was directly proportional to the sin in the person's life...an extremely sinful person (but not so sinful as to merit Hell) would spend a longer time in Purgatory than a less sinful person.

It is proportional to the amount of sin, yes. "Amen I say to you, you will not be released until you have paid the last penny" (Mt 5:26).

Here's what the Catechism says:

1030 All who die in God's grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation; but after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven.


1031 The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification of the elect, which is entirely different from the punishment of the damned. The Church formulated her doctrine of faith on Purgatory especially at the Councils of Florence and Trent. The tradition of the Church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire:

As for certain lesser faults, we must believe that, before the Final Judgment, there is a purifying fire. He who is truth says that whoever utters blasphemy against the Holy Spirit will be pardoned neither in this age nor in the age to come. From this sentence we understand that certain offenses can be forgiven in this age, but certain others in the age to come.

 

[bigsierra]

I don't think a time frame has been put on it. It could be instant or it could take time. Even non Catholics believe they will be "changed" before entering Heaven. What happens in this process, exactly no one knows.

 

[ByzantineDixie]

So if I understand correctly, Purgatory is not fully defined as a place or a state.

But regarding "time"...I recall holy cards and certain prayers being labeled with indulgence time...for example if you said a certain prayer on the back of a holy card it might give a 5 year indulgance...essentially, remove 5 years from purgatory.

Is this no longer practiced?

Thanks much!

Rose

 

[AMDG]

I recall holy cards and certain prayers being labeled with indulgence time...for example if you said a certain prayer on the back of a holy card it might give a 5 year indulgance...essentially, remove 5 years from purgatory.

Is this no longer practiced?

Perhaps this part of your question deserves a post of its own. You see, indulgences are certainly practiced today, yet a certain "time" is not attached to the prayers on the backs of holy cards, etc. IMO it is because of a misunderstanding that these indulgences refer to time in purgatory. As far as I know, they do not. They refer to a certain amount of time removed from a penance--as in those long public penances that used to be done quite a long time ago.

Others can address this far better.

 

[ps139]

But regarding "time"...I recall holy cards and certain prayers being labeled with indulgence time...for example if you said a certain prayer on the back of a holy card it might give a 5 year indulgance...essentially, remove 5 years from purgatory.

Is this no longer practiced?

I'm not too sure, but I think these are devotionals, which are not official teaching. They're not banned, but not required. And they might work, they might not. I dont know. Like I said I'm not too sure .

 

[Carrye]

Here's a link from New Advent that treats both subjects.

 

[Y_Cathol]

Time in Purgatory can also be shortened by the prayes of the people here on earth. So it is also up to us to pray for those in Purgatory, that their purification may be hastened, and they may enter into the fullness of joy.

Especially today, on All Souls Day!!!!

 

[Paul S]

Indulgences are still around, and they're found in a book called Enchiridion Indulgentiarum, or Handbook of Indulgences. Indulgences can be gained for oneself or for those in purgatory When an indulgenced prayer is said and the indulgence earned, it removes some of the time in purgatory.

Today, indulgences are either plenary or partial. A plenary indulgence (from the Latin word plena, meaning full,is basically a "get out of purgatory free" card. It removes all of one's time in purgatory - of course, if applied to oneself, it only removes past time earned. One can still earn more time in purgatory by continuing to sin. Plenary indulgences are difficult to earn, since one of the requirements is no attachment to sin whatsoever, even venial sin.

Partial indulgences remove part of the time in purgatory. How much is up to God; we don't know. Before Vatican II, and in prayerbooks printed before then, you see "indulgence of one years" or "indulgence of 300 days". This is not one years or 300 days off from one's time in purgatory. In the early church, penances were much harsher. They might be "live on bread and water for a year" or "wear sackcloth and ashes and do penance outside the church for 300 days". Instead, the same amount of time in purgatory would be erased by the bread and water for a year or the prayer with an indulgence of one year. The times refer to these penances, not the time in purgatory.

 

[ps139]

The logic behind all of this is that if we are not fully sanctified when we die, purgatory completes the process.
One can gain an indulgence by reading Scripture. Why? Because this sanctifies. When we read God's word, we are drawn closer to Him.
Now if you read the Bible, and ignore it all, do you get the indulgence? No, I do not think so. Its like going to confession but not repenting... you're not forgiven.
Without knowing this basic principle, indulgences seem like some ridiculous buy and sell scheme. But they have a real effect. And it makes perfect sense. The more holy we become, the less purification we will need. It is part of a call to holiness, or sanctification.

 

[Dominus Fidelis]

Luther's Rose-

Peace be with you.

Yes, there is a time attached to Purgatory. It may not be time in the exact way that we understand it, because it is probably another dimension, but indulgences due remit some of the time (punishment) that a person suffers in Purgatory.

You were taught correctly.

We do not _sell_ indulgences, as that was an abuse of the Church's power which Luther rightfully rejected, but the essential _doctrine_ is the same and we believe it is correct.

Thanks for your question!

 

[frettr00]

Thought this might help, it's an excerpt on Purgatory from the Diary of Saint Faustina Kolowska.

Diary No. 20

(Vision of Purgatory)

"One day I asked the Lord, ‘Lord, who else should I pray for?’ Jesus said that on the following night He would let me know for whom I should always pray for.

The following night, I saw my Guardian Angel who asked me to follow him. In a moment I was in a misty place full of fire in which there was a great crowd of suffering souls. They were praying fervently, but to no avail, for themselves; only we can come to their aid. The flames which were burning them did not touch me at all. My Guardian Angel did not leave me for an instant. I asked these souls what their greatest suffering was. They answered me in one voice that their greatest torment was longing for God. I saw Our Lady visiting the souls in Purgatory. The souls call her ‘The Star of the Sea.’ She brings them refreshment. I wanted to talk with them some more, but my Guardian Angel beckoned me to leave. We went out of the prison of suffering. [I heard an interior voice] which said, My mercy does not want this, but justice demands it. Since that time, I am in closer communion with the suffering souls."

Justice demands that we cannot enter heaven unless we have fully paid our debts. That is why, while still here on earth, let us begin to pay for our debts. When we go to confession, we are asked to say penance, and that’s it. That is not enough. We have to make reparation. It is not enough to pray three Our Fathers and then no more. The goodness of God cannot be satisfied just like that. That’s why the need for us to offer daily our sufferings, offer daily our trials for the poor souls and, especially, for our own souls to shorten our stay in Purgatory.

"Since that time I am always in closer communion with the suffering souls."




Diary No. 58

"One night, a sister who had died two months previously came to me. She was a sister of the first choir. I saw her in a terrible condition, all in flames with her face painfully distorted. This lasted only a short time, and then she disappeared. A shudder went through my soul because I did not know whether she was suffering in purgatory or in hell. Nevertheless, I redoubled my prayers for her. The next night she came again, but I saw her in an even more horrible state, in the midst of flames which were even more intense, and despair was written all over her face. I was astonished to see her in a worse condition after the prayers I had offered for her, and I asked, ‘Haven’t my prayers helped you?’ She answered that my prayers had not helped her and that nothing would help her. I said to her, ‘And the prayers which the whole community has offered for you, have they not been any help to you?’ She said no, that these prayers have helped some other souls. I replied, ‘If my prayers are not helping you, Sister, please stop coming to me.’ She disappeared at once. Despite this, I kept on praying.

"After some time she came back again to me during the night, but already her appearance had changed. There were no longer any flames, as there had been before, and her face was radiant, her eyes beaming with joy. She told me that I had a true love for my neighbor and that many other souls had profited from my prayers. She urged me not to cease praying for the souls in purgatory, and she added that she herself would not remain there much longer. How astounding are the decrees of God!"

Diary No. 314

"When I went to the garden one afternoon, my Guardian Angel said to me, ‘Pray for the dying.’ So I began at once to pray the Rosary with the gardeners for the dying. After the Rosary, we said different prayers for the dying. After the prayers, the wards began to talk among themselves. In spite of that noise, I heard these words in my soul, ‘Pray for me.’ But as I could not understand these words very well, I moved a few steps away trying to think who it could be was asking me to pray. Then I heard the words, ‘I am Sis. (blank). The sister was in Warsaw while I was at the time in Vilnius. The sister said, ‘Pray for me until I tell you to stop. I am dying at this moment.’ Immediately, I began to pray fervently for her to the Expiring Heart of Jesus. I kept praying from 3 o’clock until 5. At five I heard the words, ‘Thank you, sister’, and I understood that she had died. During the holy mass on the following day, I continued to pray fervently for her soul. In the afternoon, a postcard came saying that Sister had died at such and such a time. I understood that it was at that same hour when she had said to me, ‘Pray for me.’"

Diary No. 412



"There was no one in the chapel so I got up, picked up the pieces of the flower pot, repotted the flower, and tried to do all these before anyone came in. But I did not manage to do so, a Mother Superior came in at that moment, together with the sister sacristan and several other sisters. Mother Superior was surprised that I had been touching something at the altar and thus caused the flower to fall. Sister Sacristan showed her displeasure and I did my best not to explain or excuse myself. But, towards evening, I was exhausted and could not make my holy hour, so I asked Mother Superior to allow me to go to bed early. I fell asleep as soon as I laid down, but at about eleven o’clock Satan shook my bed. I awoke instantly and I started to pray peacefully to my Guardian Angel. Then I saw the souls who are doing penance in Purgatory. They appeared like shadows and among them I saw many demons. One of these tried to vex me, taking the form of a cat. He kept pawing on to my bed and on my feet and he was quite heavy, as if weighing a ton. I kept praying the Rosary all the while and, toward dawn, these beings vanished. And I was able to get some sleep.

When I entered the chapel in the morning, I heard a voice in my soul, You are united to me, fear nothing. But know, my child, that Satan hates you. He hates every soul, but he burns with a particular hatred for you, because you have snatched so many souls from his dominion."

 

[Y_Cathol]

Thought this might help, it's an excerpt on Purgatory from the Diary of Saint Faustina Kolowska.

Diary No. 20

(Vision of Purgatory)

"One day I asked the Lord, ‘Lord, who else should I pray for?’ Jesus said that on the following night He would let me know for whom I should always pray for.

The following night, I saw my Guardian Angel who asked me to follow him. In a moment I was in a misty place full of fire in which there was a great crowd of suffering souls. They were praying fervently, but to no avail, for themselves; only we can come to their aid. The flames which were burning them did not touch me at all. My Guardian Angel did not leave me for an instant. I asked these souls what their greatest suffering was. They answered me in one voice that their greatest torment was longing for God. I saw Our Lady visiting the souls in Purgatory. The souls call her ‘The Star of the Sea.’ She brings them refreshment. I wanted to talk with them some more, but my Guardian Angel beckoned me to leave. We went out of the prison of suffering. [I heard an interior voice] which said, My mercy does not want this, but justice demands it. Since that time, I am in closer communion with the suffering souls."

Justice demands that we cannot enter heaven unless we have fully paid our debts. That is why, while still here on earth, let us begin to pay for our debts. When we go to confession, we are asked to say penance, and that’s it. That is not enough. We have to make reparation. It is not enough to pray three Our Fathers and then no more. The goodness of God cannot be satisfied just like that. That’s why the need for us to offer daily our sufferings, offer daily our trials for the poor souls and, especially, for our own souls to shorten our stay in Purgatory.

"Since that time I am always in closer communion with the suffering souls."




Diary No. 58

"One night, a sister who had died two months previously came to me. She was a sister of the first choir. I saw her in a terrible condition, all in flames with her face painfully distorted. This lasted only a short time, and then she disappeared. A shudder went through my soul because I did not know whether she was suffering in purgatory or in hell. Nevertheless, I redoubled my prayers for her. The next night she came again, but I saw her in an even more horrible state, in the midst of flames which were even more intense, and despair was written all over her face. I was astonished to see her in a worse condition after the prayers I had offered for her, and I asked, ‘Haven’t my prayers helped you?’ She answered that my prayers had not helped her and that nothing would help her. I said to her, ‘And the prayers which the whole community has offered for you, have they not been any help to you?’ She said no, that these prayers have helped some other souls. I replied, ‘If my prayers are not helping you, Sister, please stop coming to me.’ She disappeared at once. Despite this, I kept on praying.

"After some time she came back again to me during the night, but already her appearance had changed. There were no longer any flames, as there had been before, and her face was radiant, her eyes beaming with joy. She told me that I had a true love for my neighbor and that many other souls had profited from my prayers. She urged me not to cease praying for the souls in purgatory, and she added that she herself would not remain there much longer. How astounding are the decrees of God!"

Diary No. 314

"When I went to the garden one afternoon, my Guardian Angel said to me, ‘Pray for the dying.’ So I began at once to pray the Rosary with the gardeners for the dying. After the Rosary, we said different prayers for the dying. After the prayers, the wards began to talk among themselves. In spite of that noise, I heard these words in my soul, ‘Pray for me.’ But as I could not understand these words very well, I moved a few steps away trying to think who it could be was asking me to pray. Then I heard the words, ‘I am Sis. (blank). The sister was in Warsaw while I was at the time in Vilnius. The sister said, ‘Pray for me until I tell you to stop. I am dying at this moment.’ Immediately, I began to pray fervently for her to the Expiring Heart of Jesus. I kept praying from 3 o’clock until 5. At five I heard the words, ‘Thank you, sister’, and I understood that she had died. During the holy mass on the following day, I continued to pray fervently for her soul. In the afternoon, a postcard came saying that Sister had died at such and such a time. I understood that it was at that same hour when she had said to me, ‘Pray for me.’"

Diary No. 412



"There was no one in the chapel so I got up, picked up the pieces of the flower pot, repotted the flower, and tried to do all these before anyone came in. But I did not manage to do so, a Mother Superior came in at that moment, together with the sister sacristan and several other sisters. Mother Superior was surprised that I had been touching something at the altar and thus caused the flower to fall. Sister Sacristan showed her displeasure and I did my best not to explain or excuse myself. But, towards evening, I was exhausted and could not make my holy hour, so I asked Mother Superior to allow me to go to bed early. I fell asleep as soon as I laid down, but at about eleven o’clock Satan shook my bed. I awoke instantly and I started to pray peacefully to my Guardian Angel. Then I saw the souls who are doing penance in Purgatory. They appeared like shadows and among them I saw many demons. One of these tried to vex me, taking the form of a cat. He kept pawing on to my bed and on my feet and he was quite heavy, as if weighing a ton. I kept praying the Rosary all the while and, toward dawn, these beings vanished. And I was able to get some sleep.

When I entered the chapel in the morning, I heard a voice in my soul, You are united to me, fear nothing. But know, my child, that Satan hates you. He hates every soul, but he burns with a particular hatred for you, because you have snatched so many souls from his dominion."

Very Cool... I didn't know that anyone else here had read her diary!

 

[ByzantineDixie]

Thank y'all very much for answering my questions.

Have a GREAT day in HIM!

Rose

 

[Epiphanygirl]

Have a GREAT day in HIM!

Through Him, With Him, In Him, In the unity of the Holy Spirit...