do you think that some start off as churches, or they are cults to begin with...they start off in a church and then get different views..then the church splits and they go there different ways and eventually become a cult... what do you think.......
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cults
- Thread starter tonysma
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InDeoHonorium2
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All of those
I guess we need to first decide on what definition of CULT we want to use here......you mean a restrictive abusive totalitairian religion, or you mean an offshoot of a movement who shares less in common with the main religion than even a sect, or do you mean someone who doesn't follow the Bible or someone who doesn't believe like you do or like I do ?
Let's decide on that first then I'll tell you some of what I know
Excellent question BTW one of my favorite topics
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I believe that a lot of them do believe in god to start off with, then they get sidetracked...i look at a lot of different churches that have split because they didn't believe the way one in the church believes...then sometimes it seems like the people in these churches are following the preacher whether for the good of god or not...hard to explain without writing several pages...
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InDeoHonorium2
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Well, it depends on the cult
There is more than ample evidence to both extremes. We know for a fact that Werner Erhard started est/forum cult with the intent of establishing a cult from the beginning. He wanted power and money & he admitted to so much before he fled the country.
There is ample evidence David Koresh did the same though he started in traditional accepted religions
No one has been able to determine as to the leadership of the Brother minister cult (Aka the garbage eaters)
Evidence strongly suggests that several leaders including the late Jim Jones truly belived themselves as prophets
So to answer the question it depends on the leadership They can start as one and end up as the other
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I think they start off with an agenda they want to make mainstream. For instance, if I want many wives, I can start a movement that shows that many wives are ok.
But I'm not sure if that's it for all of them. We are told to be cautious of being deceived. One is only deceived if they think they are doing the right thing.
But I'm not sure if that's it for all of them. We are told to be cautious of being deceived. One is only deceived if they think they are doing the right thing.
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Amisk
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I heard sometime ago that 55% of J.W.s come out of non-false cult churches, although many of them come out of what are known as Modernistic churches.
I understand but I'm not sure if I am correct, that the 7th Day Adventist's Mrs. White came out of some Evangelical movement.
Something I have often wondered about, is when does a modernist church stop being a true Christian Church and become a false cult? Some of the ones here in Canada are about as far from being scripturally right in their beliefs as are some of the false cults.
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whateveristrue
Regular Member
It is my belief that many cult leaders started off as genuine Christians... but then they were corrupted by power, money, or other things. Motives change... and so does the message.
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jehovahjira
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OUR GOD IS AN AWSOME GOD, OH YES HE IS, HE RAISED WITH WISDOM POWER AND FINALLY LOVE OH OUR GOD IS AN AWSOME GOD.MY GOD'S puninishment is so scary it deserves to be feared!!!!! someone read and post Leviticus 26 14-20, now why would i post this??? it's so simple WHEN WE PUT OUR ATTENTION OR "FOCUS" ON CULTS,DEMONS,SATAN,AND OTHER THINGS THAT ARN'T IMPORTANT THEN WHAT ARE WE REALLY DOING? WE ARE FLIRTING WITH THE ENEMY Ephesians 6:12 the war isn't physical any time we let satan enter our mind, expect to be tempted!!!!! people give satan to much attention now who here can tell me what GOD is doing on earth and how HE is moving?
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TrustingmyLord
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Well, I have read a few books on the subject, some on Jim Jones, others on the Branch Davidians.
Jim Jones was deep into the word at a very young age. Somewhere through the years it got twisted and perhaps he felt as though it gave him some sort of power, made him better than others. Later he had a mentor. Its been a while, so I do not remember the mans name, but this mentor was an obvious fraud, was good at working the people, a great showman, so it seems to me that Jim Jones began with manipulative intentions.
The Branch Davidians have a very long history, far before Vernon Howell (Koresh) was ever born. They began as 7th day Adventists. Yes, the Adventists had/have the prophet Ellen G. White, so their beliefs were a bit skewed from the beggining. In the early 1900's a group of them had a falling out with the Adventist church over some "new revelations." These people formed a compound and became the Branch Davidians. They had several wacky leaders before Koresh came around. I believe these people started off right, and through time got their beliefs all skewed, then with the help of some teachers with their own agenda, they started their downfall.
I had attended a Adventist church for about 5 months, till God showed me there was something was wrong with some of their teachings. I absolutely believe that the people at this church I attended are totally, 100% sincere. Even with their wrong teachings, these people are to this day some of the most dedicated Christians I have ever met.
I believe that if you have two parents who believe false doctrines, they have kids and these kids grow up with these teachings, knowing nothing else. Most of these people are apologetics freaks. They know how to defend their wacky beliefs and this is poured into them from a young age. They are taught that bad people will come around and say Ellen White is false. Actually, this was one of her last prophesies, that the devil would send people to try to refute her visions. They grow up hearing that their beliefs are the only true beliefs, and all others are just satans way of trying to lead them astray.
So, if you are ever trying to witness to one, the hardest ones to get through to are the ones who have been raised in it. Sadly, I believe they are very sincere, just brainwashed.
Jim Jones was deep into the word at a very young age. Somewhere through the years it got twisted and perhaps he felt as though it gave him some sort of power, made him better than others. Later he had a mentor. Its been a while, so I do not remember the mans name, but this mentor was an obvious fraud, was good at working the people, a great showman, so it seems to me that Jim Jones began with manipulative intentions.
The Branch Davidians have a very long history, far before Vernon Howell (Koresh) was ever born. They began as 7th day Adventists. Yes, the Adventists had/have the prophet Ellen G. White, so their beliefs were a bit skewed from the beggining. In the early 1900's a group of them had a falling out with the Adventist church over some "new revelations." These people formed a compound and became the Branch Davidians. They had several wacky leaders before Koresh came around. I believe these people started off right, and through time got their beliefs all skewed, then with the help of some teachers with their own agenda, they started their downfall.
I had attended a Adventist church for about 5 months, till God showed me there was something was wrong with some of their teachings. I absolutely believe that the people at this church I attended are totally, 100% sincere. Even with their wrong teachings, these people are to this day some of the most dedicated Christians I have ever met.
I believe that if you have two parents who believe false doctrines, they have kids and these kids grow up with these teachings, knowing nothing else. Most of these people are apologetics freaks. They know how to defend their wacky beliefs and this is poured into them from a young age. They are taught that bad people will come around and say Ellen White is false. Actually, this was one of her last prophesies, that the devil would send people to try to refute her visions. They grow up hearing that their beliefs are the only true beliefs, and all others are just satans way of trying to lead them astray.
So, if you are ever trying to witness to one, the hardest ones to get through to are the ones who have been raised in it. Sadly, I believe they are very sincere, just brainwashed.
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I've seen a growing cult before (not naming names), but I can feel Gods Spirit warning me, I felt it first I heard of it. It was based on a few technicalities and ideas of one man. They put their trust in him completely because he had a P.h.D and was an archaeologist. I got the feeling he claimed he knew Hebrew more than those to whom it came as a first language. He sent me logos to what his "foundation" is going to be using, seems to put his name high up there and the whole ideals and concept of it was purely based on one mans word. An example is "Elohim" meaning "God" or "gods", is a plural, we use the word "circle" for more than one thing defining what it is, same goes to this, "Elohim" is used to refer to the one true God. It was even said it means that too (check Strong's in your bible or online), seems like he was in too much of a rush to call satan a "god", yes, they do actually claim he's a god, not theirs but a god all the same.
Sorry about the long reply.
Sorry about the long reply.
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jehovahjira
Active Member
all this goes back to what i stated on the prevous page if it's not of GOD then who does that leave
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Paul was considered a cultist so we should be careful not just to condemn some group or organization because they dare to go against popular error or idolatrous traditions. Instead of worrying about cult this or that (diversionary tactics), we should be like the noble Bereans who didn't ask if Paul was some new cult leader but searched the scriptures to see if what he was saying was BIBLICAL.
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TrustingmyLord
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BeyondBabylon, I believe we are specifically talking about those whos beliefs are known to be unbiblical.
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MaidforHim
Senior Veteran
All of the above.
I think Satan grabs hold, corrupts and distorts any where he can get ahold. Some start out that way while others are lead astray in all sorts of ways.
It's sad, no matter how it starts. I feel particularly sorry for the children who are taught falsehoods from the earliest of ages.
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izarya
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At one time Christianity was considered a cult. I think it's all subjective. If I don't believe in the same thing as you, exactly as you do, then I'm in a cult (according to you). I think the mainstream church in general is a cult.
IMO.
IMO.
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