Criteria for determining design

[AV1611VET]

You know that the Bible is wrong when it comes to the various stories in Genesis.

-- I do?

By trying to claim that they are true you lower all of Christianity.

Like claiming Jesus walked on wa...

Oh, you said, "Genesis" -- nevermind.

Well, for the record, Ghandi said we all lower Christianity.

'I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.'

You just haven't caught up with him yet.

 

[dad]

Actually lchm seems to have the correct approach. When it comes to science the Bible is of no use.

When it comes to the future the far past, or the spiritual science is of no use. That is why the bible is the big kid on the block in the creation debate.

It's value lies in its being a moral guide for people. Not a science or history book.

It is promoting morals that are very different from society today. The value there is..?

If a Muslim declared that because the Koran said 2 + 2 = 10 would that weaken or strengthen his religion in your viewpoint?

Since they declare Gabriel got the ball rolling for them, and it was not Gabriel of God from Scripture, the religion could not get any weaker.

 

[Subduction Zone]

When it comes to the future the far past, or the spiritual science is of no use. That is why the bible is the big kid on the block in the creation debate.
It is promoting morals that are very different from society today. The value there is..?
Since they declare Gabriel got the ball rolling for them, and it was not Gabriel of God from Scripture, the religion could not get any weaker.

dad, you continually spew the same nonsense that you cannot even support biblically. And no, the Bible will never be the big kid on the block in these debates. You must substantiate your claims by some means and you can't even use the Bible to do that. All you can claim is that if scientists are right then the Bible is wrong so scientists have to be wrong. That will not convince any thinking person.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

You know that the Bible is wrong when it comes to the various stories in Genesis. By trying to claim that they are true you lower all of Christianity.

No one here takes his comments seriously, as they lack any real substance and when cornered he announces that it is 'over my head'

He loves this sort of things as it feeds on it. If he cannot get his daily dose, he revives any old thread and continues seeking attention.

I think the only reason he's not been banned forever, is that the Moderators know that he is psychologically dependent on the attention he gets here. (perhaps only here)

A lonely fellow, indeedy-do.

 

[AV1611VET]

I don't enjoy you comments to my threads,

I wouldn't either, if I were you.

 

[Subduction Zone]

-- I do?

Like claiming Jesus walked on wa...

Oh, you said, "Genesis" -- nevermind.

Well, for the record, Ghandi said we all lower Christianity.
You just haven't caught up with him yet.

Yes, even the supposed miracles of Jesus probably did not happen. That does not mean that his message has no meaning. Why do you feel a need to believe all of the magical tales of the Bible? Isn't the message it tries to deliver enough on its own?

 

[Subduction Zone]

No one here takes his comments seriously, as they lack any real substance and when cornered he announces that it is 'over my head'
He loves this sort of things as it feeds on it. If he cannot get his daily does, he revives any old thread and continues seeking attention.
I think the only reason he's not been banned forever, is that the Moderators know that he is psychologically dependent on attention.
A lonely fellow, indeedy-do.

That is quite true. People try to help him here, but he actively resist it.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes, even the supposed miracles of Jesus probably did not happen.

I believe they did, so does your previous comment apply here as well?

 

[Mr Strawberry]

Yes, even the supposed miracles of Jesus probably did not happen.

You're too nice. Just be blunt about it: they didn't happen.

That does not mean that his message has no meaning. Why do you feel a need to believe all of the magical tales of the Bible? Isn't the message it tries to deliver enough on its own?

Interesting. I think if he suspects it will risk his promised prize of an afterlife of eternal bliss then it doesn't matter what the message is, he will no longer care. The message is a long way second to the prize. That's my take on it.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

That is quite true. People try to help him here, but he actively resist it.

I have a tendency to want to help, but have also encountered this and so try to ignore the comments. The problem is that whenever I get a good topic, he'll set to ruining the thread. I wish he'd write his own, though I am pretty sure no-one would comment and then he'd get no attention. So, he just goes around ruining thread after thread. I have often considered leaving, simply because of his antics, but the truth is he stays out of the complex dialogue (as it's as he says, 'over my head') -- which is relief.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I believe they did, so does your previous comment apply here as well?

Less so than before, but still yes.

To believe in various stories in Genesis one has to believe in a dishonest God. Even back when I was a Christian I did not believe that God was dishonest.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

I wouldn't either, if I were you.

Why don't at least try to find something else to do with you life -- surely you have friends in the real world?

 

[AV1611VET]

Less so than before, but still yes.

Well, if believing the miracles of Jesus makes me, in your words, 'lower all of Christianity,' then I guess Christianity, in your eyes, is easy to lower, eh?

Is there any Christian here who doesn't, in your opinion?

In fact, did Matthew 'lower Christianity' by writing about Jesus' miracles?

Mark? Luke? John? Paul? Peter? Jude? James?

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

Less so than before, but still yes.

To believe in various stories in Genesis one has to believe in a dishonest God. Even back when I was a Christian I did not believe that God was dishonest.

If one is comparing it to something else, then one has that rather awkward moment. If one accepts that first and foremost, it's a book written by men who are trying to intuit the divine -- it's more like fireside gypsy tales, which were never meant to be dissected -- they're meant to set your heart alight with compassion. It's sort of like when we used to go to school camps in vacation and everyone was around the fire singing songs, and we were moved in so many ways. (perhaps not a good metaphor -- for some orchestrations were perhaps -- oh whatever, romance is good!)

 

[Subduction Zone]

Well, if believing the miracles of Jesus makes me, in your words, 'lower all of Christianity,' then I guess Christianity, in your eyes, is easy to lower, eh?

Is there any Christian here who doesn't, in your opinion?

In fact, did Matthew 'lower Christianity' by writing about Jesus' miracles?

Mark? Luke? John? Paul? Peter? Jude? James?

He did in some ways. Luke did as well. The failed nativity story has harmed Christianity more than it has helped it.

 

[AV1611VET]

He did in some ways. Luke did as well. The failed nativity story has harmed Christianity more than it has helped it.

Then I feel honored that you think I harm Christianity.

Thank you for putting me in the same league with Luke, but I don't consider myself as holy as he was.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

I don't consider myself as holy as he was.

That's right.

 

[lewiscalledhimmaster]

This thread is for those who believe in Intelligent Design and also for those who believe in Evolution.

If there was a so-called intelligent designer, would that designer have gone about it the way that evolution explains it? I don't think so.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Then I feel honored that you think I harm Christianity.

Thank you for putting me in the same league with Luke, but I don't consider myself as holy as he was.

Really? You think that it is a good thing if you drive people away from your God?

ETA: My point is that there are parts of the Bible where it is clearly giving stories for instruction but not for history. Mistaking one for the other will have negative results. Many of Jesus' parables were obviously exactly that. Trying to claim that a parable had to happen because it is in the Bible will not yield positive results.

 

[AV1611VET]

Trying to claim that a parable had to happen because it is in the Bible will not yield positive results.

I believe the parables Jesus told were actual events that occurred.