Creationists: Please, I need to hear you say it.

[Randall McNally]

Tons? Then you shouldn't have any trouble at all providing three or four links.

You're not even serious or you'd already be looking up the links yourself.

You have to be kidding. I'm supposed to construct your argument for you? Your arrogance is showing.

Oh? I guess my principal forgot to mention that.

Then you're obviously too young to enter into a debate way beyond your immaturity else your principal would not have neglected to mention it.

Wow. Don't bother to conceal your ad hominems next time.

In any case, I fail to understand what my age or alleged maturity has to do with what my principal tells me. Not that it's remotely sane to think he would say that anyway.

In any case, humanism isn't a necessarily secular philosophy.

It's total secular humanism. even the u s supreme court years back stated so.

1) The Supreme Court stated nothing of the sort. The mention came in dicta - one of the justice's opinions which carries no force of law or jurisprudence.

2) You still haven't demonstrated that secular humanism is openly taught in public schools.

There are Christian humanists, you know.

Yeah, Satan's club has membership worldwide. You cannot mix good and evil.

There you go. Insult your brothers and sisters who are trying to make the world a better, more tolerant place for everyone. I'm sure Jesus would be so proud of you.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

I believe that creation in the Bible is a metaphor for the science that God used to create it all.

In all likelihood what you mean is, "you think that creation in the Bible is a metaphor..." as there is no proof upon which to base a belief.

Now, if, on the other hand, you do mean to use the word "believe" then you must, since there is a lack of proof, being accepting it on faith and science has thus become, for you, a religion.

"But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence."-1 Corinthians 1:27-29

Evolution and all of its constituent parts are saturated with pride.

Science is a manmade construct and God is totally outside of that. Why would God need man's science to create anything when it was the very power (ie Jesus Christ) emanating (we refer to it as, "and God said...") from God that created the cosmos.

Met'-a-phor' or, Representation [font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1]A declaration that one thing is (or represents) another: while Simile resembles it, and Hypocatastasis implies it. [/size][/font]

"I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the spectrum of this or that element. I want to know His thoughts; the rest are details."-Albert Einstein

"Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men."-1 Corinthians 1:25

 

[Pilgrim 33]

duplicate/deleted

 

[Pilgrim 33]

brothers and sisters who are trying to make the world a better, more tolerant place

the earth's population is, no doubt, inclusive in your term "brothers and sisters". That's unscriptural.

"tolerant". And, again, without doubt, your referent here is for the entire world to get along. That, too, is unscriptural.

 

[h2whoa]

Pilgrim, I can't even be bothered with you as you're clearly a conceited individual. Welcome to the ignore list. You're #2 for your own information.

Love and hugs.

h2

 

[Pilgrim 33]

In all likelihood what you mean is, "you think that creation in the Bible is a metaphor..." as there is no proof upon which to base a belief.

Now, if, on the other hand, you do mean to use the word "believe" then you must, since there is a lack of proof, being accepting it on faith and science has thus become, for you, a religion.

"But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence."-1 Corinthians 1:27-29

Evolution and all of its constituent parts are saturated with pride.

Science is a manmade construct and God is totally outside of that. Why would God need man's science to create anything when it was the very power (ie Jesus Christ) emanating (we refer to it as, "and God said...") from God that created the cosmos.

Met'-a-phor' or, Representation [font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1]A declaration that one thing is (or represents) another: while Simile resembles it, and Hypocatastasis implies it. [/size][/font]

"I want to know how God created this world. I am not interested in this or that phenomenon, in the spectrum of this or that element. I want to know His thoughts; the rest are details."-Albert Einstein

"Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men."-1 Corinthians 1:25

Pilgrim, I can't even be bothered with you as you're clearly a conceited

one finger pointing outward always results in four pointing back.

immature name calling is unnecessary, at best, it's baiting. Doubtful that is allowed. Unfortunately, immaturity is.

individual. Welcome to the ignore list. You're #2 for your own information.

Ostrich heads in the sand won't stop the world from continuing to turn or The Truth from being spread.

Love and hugs.

insincerity, also, is unnecessary

h2

I am firm in my faith, belief and convictions; I suspect, you, on the other hand, do not yet know what you believe, that you're still formulating. Sadly, you are too influenced by the constructs of your chosen discipline to allow you to come to God as a small, innocent and uneducated child.

 

[Randall McNally]

the earth's population is, no doubt, inclusive in your term "brothers and sisters". That's unscriptural.

"tolerant". And, again, without doubt, your referent here is for the entire world to get along. That, too, is unscriptural.

Well, have fun with that Old Testament justice, then. I hope you get all the smitings you want for Christmas.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

In any case, humanism isn't a necessarily secular philosophy.

It's total secular humanism. even the u s supreme court years back stated so. It's all bound together, humanism, evolution, pagan religions, all of it predates to early Babylon and Nimrod. The same basic tenets have not changed. Satan's church has always been alive and well on this earth and in many guises.

The mention came in dicta - one of the justice's opinions which carries no force of law or jurisprudence.

Bottom line: They said it.

2) You still haven't demonstrated that secular humanism is openly taught in public schools.

I've observed it for decades, it now permeates the curriculum; if this cannot be seen then they've successfully done their job with you to the point your avowed agnosticism may be irreversible.

There are Christian humanists, you know.

Yeah, Satan's club has membership worldwide. You cannot mix good and evil.

There you go. Insult your brothers and sisters who are trying to make the world a better, more tolerant place for everyone.

MY brothers and sisters? MY brothers and sisters would try to mix God and Satan together? THEY would try to blend the world and Christ together? MY Family would work to making the world one big happy world, one big benevolent government, one big happy religion? Not mine! Apparently, yours, but not mine. That would be unscriptural.

I'm sure Jesus would be so proud of you.

Patronizing and sacreligious comments are unnecessary. Still, thank you, yes, He knows me.

"But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven."-Matthew 10:33

 

[Pilgrim 33]

Well, have fun with that Old Testament justice, then. I hope you get all the smitings you want for Christmas.

You agnosticism, as do your comments above, belie any knowledge of the Bible.

 

[Randall McNally]

In any case, humanism isn't a necessarily secular philosophy.

It's total secular humanism. even the u s supreme court years back stated so. It's all bound together, humanism, evolution, pagan religions, all of it predates to early Babylon and Nimrod. The same basic tenets have not changed. Satan's church has always been alive and well on this earth and in many guises.

This is pure fabrication on your part.

The mention came in dicta - one of the justice's opinions which carries no force of law or jurisprudence.

Bottom line: They said it.

That's a spectacularly ignorant statement. Do you have any idea how Supreme Court holdings work?

2) You still haven't demonstrated that secular humanism is openly taught in public schools.

I've observed it for decades, it now permeates the curriculum; if this cannot be seen then they've successfully done their job with you to the point your avowed agnosticism may be irreversible.

Ah, yes. Everything that isn't obvious is a conspiracy.

There you go. Insult your brothers and sisters who are trying to make the world a better, more tolerant place for everyone.

MY brothers and sisters? MY brothers and sisters would try to mix God and Satan together? THEY would try to blend the world and Christ together? MY Family would work to making the world one big happy world, one big benevolent government, one big happy religion? Not mine! Apparently, yours, but not mine. That would be unscriptural.

I'm sure Jesus would be so proud of you.

Patronizing and sacreligious comments are unnecessary. Still, thank you, yes, He knows me.

Forget it. I've wasted too much time on this already.

 

[Randall McNally]

You agnosticism, as do your comments above, belie any knowledge of the Bible.

And your blind devotion to a disturbing interpretation of Scripture belies any understanding of... well, just about everything.

I guess we're even.

 

[Dmckay]

I have sort of been losing faith in humanity of late whilst reading these forums.

So please, Creationists, I have one request to make. Please just use this thread to admit that no amount of evidence will ever sway you away from a literal reading of Genesis.

You see, at least then I can hear that your position is routed in faith and not in what I perceive to be ignorance.

As the thread starter, I would like to say that there should be no attacks on Creationists in this thread. I just need to hear it said, and if there are attacks on that position, then they won't post.

h2

Interesting the way you worded your post:
You see, at least then I can hear that your position is routed in faith and not in what I perceive to be ignorance.

You see, if you do a study of the use of the word faith throughout Scripture one thing becomes clearly evident, Biblical Saving Faith is nothing more and nothing less than Biblical content in action. By this I mean that we are NEVER asked to believe or act on anything that God has not said. The opposite is also true, if God has said it we are not only to believe it, but also to act upon it. The definition of Faith found in the great faith chapter Hebrews 11:1 "Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen." to our western way of thinking is rather nebulous. But actually what it is saying is, "If God said it, you can believe it, and that should settle it for you!"

The assurance of things hoped for-Pray believing you have already received. Conviction of things not seen—I don't have to understand or see it because if God said it it is true or it will happen. If you read through chapter 11 everyone who is commended for their faith Acted upon what God said believing that it was a given that what He said He will do. We don't have to understand all we have to do is act upon whatever it is the God has said.

If God says that Genesis is the way it happened and how He did it you better believe it. Nothing that man in his "wisdom", which is foolishness to God, comes up with will ever prove God's Word wrong. Period. End of message.

 

[Euryale]

If God says that Genesis is the way it happened and how He did it you better believe it. Nothing that man in his "wisdom", which is foolishness to God, comes up with will ever prove God's Word wrong. Period. End of message.

When you can show me the tape of God saying that is the way it happened I might believe Genesis is not allegory. Until then you are speaking not from knowledge but from wishful thinking. Period. End of message.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

The Introduction to Genesis (and to the whole Bible) ascribes everything to the living God, creating, making, acting, moving, and speaking. There is no room for evolution without a flat denial of Divine revelation. One must be true, the other false. All God's works were pronounced "good" seven times. They are "great". They are "wondrous. They are "perfect.​

Man starts from nothing. He begins in helplessness, ignorance, and inexperience. All his works, therefore, proceed on the principle of evolution. This principle is seen only in human affairs: from the hut to the palace; from the canoe to the ocean liner; from the spade and ploughshare to machines for drilling, reaping, and binding, etc. But the birds build their nests today as at the beginning. The moment we pass the boundary line, and enter the Divine sphere, no trace or vestige of evolution is seen. There is growth and development within, but no passing, change, or evolution out from one into another. On the other hand, all God's works are perfect.

[font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1][font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1]Evolution is only one of several theories invented to explain the phenomena of created things. It is admitted by all scientists that no one of these theories covers all the ground; and the greatest claim made for Evolution, or Darwinism, is that "it covers more ground than any of the others."

The Word of God claims to cover all the ground: and the only way in which this claim is met, is by a denial of the inspiration of the Scriptures, in order to weaken it. This is the special work undertaken by so-called "Higher Criticism", which bases its conclusions on human assumptions and reasoning, instead of on the documentary evidence of manuscripts, as Textual Criticism does. [/size][/font]

[/size][/font]

 

[Euryale]

The Introduction to Genesis (and to the whole Bible) ascribes everything to the living God, creating, making, acting, moving, and speaking. There is no room for evolution without a flat denial of Divine revelation. One must be true, the other false. All God's works were pronounced "good" seven times. They are "great". They are "wondrous. They are "perfect.​

Man starts from nothing. He begins in helplessness, ignorance, and inexperience. All his works, therefore, proceed on the principle of evolution. This principle is seen only in human affairs: from the hut to the palace; from the canoe to the ocean liner; from the spade and ploughshare to machines for drilling, reaping, and binding, etc. But the birds build their nests today as at the beginning. The moment we pass the boundary line, and enter the Divine sphere, no trace or vestige of evolution is seen. There is growth and development within, but no passing, change, or evolution out from one into another. On the other hand, all God's works are perfect.

[font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1][font=Aldine,Kuenst,Clarendon,Times New Roman][size=+1]Evolution is only one of several theories invented to explain the phenomena of created things. It is admitted by all scientists that no one of these theories covers all the ground; and the greatest claim made for Evolution, or Darwinism, is that "it covers more ground than any of the others."

The Word of God claims to cover all the ground: and the only way in which this claim is met, is by a denial of the inspiration of the Scriptures, in order to weaken it. This is the special work undertaken by so-called "Higher Criticism", which bases its conclusions on human assumptions and reasoning, instead of on the documentary evidence of manuscripts, as Textual Criticism does. [/size][/font]

[/size][/font]

Nothing like painting yourself into a corner is there? No wonder you are terrified.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

"No wonder you are terrified"

-the sayeth the spiritually immature protestant

btw, what are you protesting? Christianity?

When you can show me the tape of God saying that is the way it happened I might believe Genesis is not allegory. Until then you are speaking not from knowledge but from wishful thinking. Period. End of message.

 

[Praxiteles]

C'mon Pilgrim, who are you really?

Own up now. The joke's over. Whose sock puppet are you?

I look forward to laughing about this later over a flat white and a Tim Tam.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

And your blind devotion to a disturbing interpretation of Scripture belies any understanding of... well, just about everything.

It's only disturbing if you don't accept it.

 

[Pilgrim 33]

C'mon Pilgrim, who are you really?

Own up now. The joke's over. Whose sock puppet are you?

I look forward to laughing about this later over a flat white and a Tim Tam.

There you have it boys and girls in the Peanut Gallery, flame bait straight from the self-proclaimed "thread derailer extraordinaire" horse's, err...uhm, mouth.

in this case, is there even any difference?

 

[Praxiteles]

Cool!

Points to me for flameage!

Seriously though, I think you gave the game away when you had a crack at Aussie4Christ. He's a creationist.