Creationist "arguments" - different karyotypes

[Speedwell]

No, he is a scientist and a theologian.

OK, so what?

 

[Sam Davis]

This is a hill you do not want to die on as you will be unceremoniously handed your hat.

On a silver tray.

Almost all experts in relevant fields: biology, genetics, palaeontology, etc believe evolution happened.

Liberal university educated atheists maybe.

 

[Sam Davis]

OK, so what?

So not all the experts agree.

 

[expos4ever]

I find it rather insulting to claim that intelligent man evolved from an ape.

And I find it insulting that my skin withers, my eyes fail, and I have to get up in the middle of the night to pee, all because I am over 60.

But these are the harsh facts of life.

And even though evolution clashes with your worldview, it (evolution) remain a fact.

 

[expos4ever]

Liberal university educated atheists maybe.

Ah yes, this ploy again.

When the facts are against you why not accept it and dispense with unsubstantiated fantasies about large -scale conspiracies?

 

[Speedwell]

I find it rather insulting to claim that intelligent man evolved from an ape.

Just to be accurate, evolution does not claim that "man evolved from an ape" but that the Hominidae (3 species of Orangutan, 2 species of Gorilla, 2 species of chimpanzee and us) all have a common ancestor.

But why would you be insulted that God made you from a primate but not insulted that he made you from a handful of dust?

 

[Speedwell]

Liberal university educated atheists maybe.

You're cruising pretty close to denying the faith of other Christians, which is a reportable offence in this forum.

 

[Sam Davis]

Ah yes, this ploy again.

When the facts are against you why not accept it and dispense with unsubstantiated fantasies about large -scale conspiracies?

Isn’t it true that liberal universities are indoctrinating their professors?

 

[miamited]

Hi expo,

You wrote:

And even though evolution clashes with your worldview, it (evolution) remain a fact.

No, it's still a theory. No one has yet been able to turn a dog into a cat or a bird into a dinosaur.

Lot's of theories about how it might come about, but as yet, no one able to actually show it coming about.

God bless,
In Christ, ted

 

[Sam Davis]

You're cruising pretty close to denying the faith of other Christians, which is a reportable offence in this forum.

How so?

 

[Speedwell]

How so?

By equating scientists who are experts in the field of evolution, a group which contains many devout Christians, with "Liberal university educated atheists"

 

[Sam Davis]

By equating scientists who are experts in the field of evolution, a group which contains many devout Christians, with "Liberal university educated atheists"

Would you consider these to believe in the Nicene Creed? That God the Father is the maker of heaven and earth? Because if they don’t believe what the Bible teaches about creation then I wouldn’t consider them Christian.

 

[Speedwell]

Would you consider these to believe in the Nicene Creed? That God the Father is the maker of heaven and earth? Because if they don’t believe what the Bible teaches about creation then I wouldn’t consider them Christian.

I expect that all of them believe the Nicene Creed. It is the general standard for being considered a Christian (in the West, anyway).

What you think the Bible teaches about creation doesn't enter into it. You don't own the Bible nor are you in a position to dictate to other Christians what they must believe about it.

 

[Sam Davis]

I expect that all of them believe the Nicene Creed. It is the general standard for being considered a Christian (in the West, anyway).

What you think the Bible teaches about creation doesn't enter into it. You don't own the Bible nor are you in a position to dictate to other Christians what they must believe about it.

However, the Nicene Creed is based upon the Bible and the Creed is clear that God created the world, this includes man.

 

[expos4ever]

Isn’t it true that liberal universities are indoctrinating their professors?

No it is not true, at least in the sense you are implying. Yes, individual scientists are biased; however, the scientific method has built-in corrections to minimize the distorting effects of such bias.

You presumably trust science in almost every other area. You will take the medicine the doctor prescribes. You will get on an airplane believing that it is safe. And so on.

So why do you pick on evolution as the one area where you distrust science?

 

[Sam Davis]

No it is not true, at least in the sense you are implying. Yes, individual scientists are biased; however, the scientific method has built-in corrections to minimize the distorting effects of such bias.

You presumably trust science in almost every other area. You will take the medicine the doctor prescribes. You will get on an airplane believing that it is safe. And so on.

So why do you pick on evolution as the one area where you distrust science?

I don’t take medication and I don’t ride on airplanes.

Planes crash, medication has side effects, and evolution is a fable.

 

[Speedwell]

However, the Nicene Creed is based upon the Bible and the Creed is clear that God created the world, this includes man.

Correct. Which does not rule out evolution.

 

[expos4ever]

Hi expo,

You wrote:


No, it's still a theory. No one has yet been able to turn a dog into a cat or a bird into a dinosaur.

Lot's of theories about how it might come about, but as yet, no one able to actually show it coming about.

God bless,
In Christ, ted

There are a number of things to say.

First, the term “theory” as used in science does NOT mean what the term means in everyday use. A scientific theory is substantiated by lots of evidence.

Second, it is not correct to imply, as you appear to do, that evolution has to be “reproducible” in order to be accorded the status of scientific fact.

 

[expos4ever]

I don’t take medication and I don’t ride on airplanes.

That’s all I needed to know.

 

[Sam Davis]

Correct. Which does not rule out evolution.

Actually it does. The credal statement is based on the Genesis account where God created man. The Nicene Creed is based on the Bible. The Creed doesn’t say that man evolved, it says the world was created.