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Creationism / Evolution Survey
- Thread starter Pete Harcoff
- Start date
yes. Biomedical science is a combination of all the "Pre"-programs, so a transition into any of the graduate fields is smooth. You may have to tailor your program to your particular interest, but if you do this field you will be sufficienty ready for med school.wblastyn said:
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Gracchus
Senior Veteran
- Dec 21, 2002
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California
K-9 Catholic schools. HS, 4 years of college but no degree.
Zen Taoism
I quit believing in second grade. Original sin meant God was unfair. Atonement is just plain ridiculous.
It is beautiful. It makes sense. It feels right.
It is the delusion embraced by terrified people with weak faith.
Both were introduced to me at a young age. I recognized creationism as a fairy tale.
Reading, high school and college courses in geology, biology, philosophy and psychology.
Certainly evolution should be taught. Creationism should be used as an example of the exploitation of crack-pots by cynical con-men.
I strongly doubt it.
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Edinburgh, Scotland
MBChB MRCS PGCE(Med)
Surgeon
Consistent with the Nicene Creed
Protestant school, Catholic church.
It cannot be proved 100% correct nor 100% incorrect at present
It is a belief system held by those who have the faith to refute scientific evidence
When I was about 3 years old and first heard OT stories. I wanted answers and my Dad clued me up.
All my research has been in Medicine / Surgery
The theory of Creationism in Religious Education,
The theory of Evolution in Science Education.
Of course. There are discussions (such as those in which we participate here) because there is no 100% correct answer known to humankind at present.
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Where do you currently live (city, country, etc)? Dallas, Texas
What is your educational background and/or current occupation? BS-Biology, MA-Sociology, working on M.D. (currently in Med. School-2nd year)
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)? Something bigger than ourselves but am not sure who or what that is.
What was your religious upbringing like? Catholic
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution? It exists, without a doubt.
What are your feelings towards creationism? Very uninformed and a harm to Christianity, because they speak in the name of Christianity making others think Christianity is moronic.
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution? I first learned about evolution in my Catholic grade school. They spoke about how everything adapts and changes in order to survive (although they did not call it "evolution", until the 9th grade)
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism? I went to a church that was a creationist church; I did not realize it at the time, since I am not from Texas. I remember thinking, How could all of these people be so uninformed/undereducated? I later found out what YEC meant and that the belief was predominantly, here, in the Bible Belt-so that was my research on that. As far as Evolution-although I am not an expert on the finer points etc. nothing in Medical research, the medicines we use etc. would be possible without evolution-it is ALL based on evolution. I work with and study evolution in some manner, everyday. As far as my own research I am learning a lot more on the side via Lucaspa and his info.
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools? Evolution- since it is fact. As far as creationISM, fairy tales are good for bed time, for the kiddos-at home. Why teach a falsified science in the schools? Even the Dallas schools (that are filled with creartionists) opted for evolution and had a meeting to try to educate the parents who were up in arms over it.
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism [snip] ? Not unless I suffered some type of head injury and wiped out the logic/memory part of my brain.
What is your educational background and/or current occupation? BS-Biology, MA-Sociology, working on M.D. (currently in Med. School-2nd year)
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)? Something bigger than ourselves but am not sure who or what that is.
What was your religious upbringing like? Catholic
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution? It exists, without a doubt.
What are your feelings towards creationism? Very uninformed and a harm to Christianity, because they speak in the name of Christianity making others think Christianity is moronic.
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution? I first learned about evolution in my Catholic grade school. They spoke about how everything adapts and changes in order to survive (although they did not call it "evolution", until the 9th grade)
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism? I went to a church that was a creationist church; I did not realize it at the time, since I am not from Texas. I remember thinking, How could all of these people be so uninformed/undereducated? I later found out what YEC meant and that the belief was predominantly, here, in the Bible Belt-so that was my research on that. As far as Evolution-although I am not an expert on the finer points etc. nothing in Medical research, the medicines we use etc. would be possible without evolution-it is ALL based on evolution. I work with and study evolution in some manner, everyday. As far as my own research I am learning a lot more on the side via Lucaspa and his info.
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools? Evolution- since it is fact. As far as creationISM, fairy tales are good for bed time, for the kiddos-at home. Why teach a falsified science in the schools? Even the Dallas schools (that are filled with creartionists) opted for evolution and had a meeting to try to educate the parents who were up in arms over it.
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism [snip] ? Not unless I suffered some type of head injury and wiped out the logic/memory part of my brain.
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lucaspa
Legend
In order:Pete Harcoff said:
New York state
Ph.D. Biochemistry. Currently Associate Professor Department of Orthopaedic Surgery and secondary appointment Department of Pathology, New York Medical College. I'm now a Tissue Engineer.
Accept evolution as a currently valid theory.
Creationism is a falsified scientific theory.
1979.
Read several creationist literature. Among them are Morris' Scientific Creationism, Behe's Darwin's Black Box, Wells' Icons of Evolution, Johnson's Wedge of Truth and Darwin on Trial, Macbeth's Darwin Retried, Wilder-Smith's The Creation of Life, Baugh's Against All Odds, Dembski's No Free Lunch, Mere Creation, The Creation Hypothesis, Gish's The Fossils Say NO!
Other books on the creationism vs evolution controversy too numerous to mention.
For evolution I've read Origin of the Species, Futuyma's Evolutionary Biology, Ridley's Evolution, and most of Gould's essays.
Creationism can't be taught in public school science classes as a valid theory. It is falsified.
If the data were found that falsified evolution, of course I would change my position. Of course that does not mean I would move to creationism, because it is going to stay falsified no matter what happens to evolution.
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J
Jet Black
Guest
East GermanyPete Harcoff said:
Masters in Pure Physics, Masters in Optics and Photonics, Studying for a PhD.
I believe I am.
I went to a catholic school, but my parents are not religious. My secondary school was non-denominational, but the thought of a God was far behind me by then.
it's just a THEORY! no, not really. I think it is provisionally true besed on the evidence.
take the "a" and the "o" out and it is fine.
Evolution has been blindingly obvious to me all my life, I used to watch the open university when I was 3, because children's programs were boring. As for creationism, I probably heard it at primary school, beyond that it has been something I have been dimly aware of for a while
read stuff, watch TV, think.
well Evolution is a science and should be taught as such. Creationism is a falsified science and should be taught as such.
as to creationism, specifically biblical, probably not, since it has been falsified. Evolution, only if it gets falsified.
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NumberTenOx
Active Member
- Sep 10, 2002
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Umm, this is the Christian Forums?
Near Seattle, WA.
BS in Physics, ex-computer engineer.
Atheist. I'm still very aware of the holes in our knowledge: e.g. why is the universe seemingly so tuned to make us, what is the original cause, and what is the ultimate nature of reality? But I look forward to science eventually answering these questions.
My parents were both raised with religion, but were adult atheists. I went to a community church as a child; my parents wanted me to have an understanding of religion.
Evolution is a well supported theory, but although simple in principle very complex and difficult to understand in practice.
Creationism was a state-of-the-art explanation when it was written, but now clearly recognizable as a fable.
Sorry, I don't remember when I first understood creationism/evolution. Certainly very young, I remember having well-formed opinions by 4th grade.
I've learned about evolution in school and reading Gould, Wilson, etc. Most of my contact with creationism is from the internet, following arguments here and elsewhere and perusing the creationism websites. And I've read the Bible.
Evolution in schools, your brand of creationism in your church and in your home.
I don't *think* so I would change my opinion. However life is long and full of twists and turns, and who knows?
Near Seattle, WA.
BS in Physics, ex-computer engineer.
Atheist. I'm still very aware of the holes in our knowledge: e.g. why is the universe seemingly so tuned to make us, what is the original cause, and what is the ultimate nature of reality? But I look forward to science eventually answering these questions.
My parents were both raised with religion, but were adult atheists. I went to a community church as a child; my parents wanted me to have an understanding of religion.
Evolution is a well supported theory, but although simple in principle very complex and difficult to understand in practice.
Creationism was a state-of-the-art explanation when it was written, but now clearly recognizable as a fable.
Sorry, I don't remember when I first understood creationism/evolution. Certainly very young, I remember having well-formed opinions by 4th grade.
I've learned about evolution in school and reading Gould, Wilson, etc. Most of my contact with creationism is from the internet, following arguments here and elsewhere and perusing the creationism websites. And I've read the Bible.
Evolution in schools, your brand of creationism in your church and in your home.
I don't *think* so I would change my opinion. However life is long and full of twists and turns, and who knows?
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Where do you currently live (city, country, etc)?
Texas (USA)
What is your educational background and/or current occupation?
Doctorate & post graduate
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)?
Christian
What was your religious upbringing like?
Christian
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution?
Probably the best explanation we currently have for diversity of life on our planet, though there are some aspects of the theory that appear tenuous at best
What are your feelings towards creationism?
Note: For the purposes of this survey, I assume creationism to be the pseudo-scientific belief system propogated by ICR and the young earth creationists. It is a falsified theory apparently based upon a literal reading of an English translation of the original Hebrew (generally done while wearing blinders so that the wearer will not be distracted by more likely meanings or translations)
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution?
As a child, though I did not begin a serious study until I was doing post graduate work in college--and I did not begin a serious study of the Hebrew wording of the Bible's creation account until a few years ago
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism?
Reading numerous books, articles, and other data; discussions with scientists and theologians, etc.
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools?
Evolution should be taught as a theory in biology; creationism (and other religious or quasi-religious explanations) could be studied in a class if appropriate to the topic and balanced in its approach
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism and/or evolution?
Since I am always reading and studying, I am open to new data and evidence that could change my position.
Texas (USA)
What is your educational background and/or current occupation?
Doctorate & post graduate
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)?
Christian
What was your religious upbringing like?
Christian
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution?
Probably the best explanation we currently have for diversity of life on our planet, though there are some aspects of the theory that appear tenuous at best
What are your feelings towards creationism?
Note: For the purposes of this survey, I assume creationism to be the pseudo-scientific belief system propogated by ICR and the young earth creationists. It is a falsified theory apparently based upon a literal reading of an English translation of the original Hebrew (generally done while wearing blinders so that the wearer will not be distracted by more likely meanings or translations)
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution?
As a child, though I did not begin a serious study until I was doing post graduate work in college--and I did not begin a serious study of the Hebrew wording of the Bible's creation account until a few years ago
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism?
Reading numerous books, articles, and other data; discussions with scientists and theologians, etc.
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools?
Evolution should be taught as a theory in biology; creationism (and other religious or quasi-religious explanations) could be studied in a class if appropriate to the topic and balanced in its approach
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism and/or evolution?
Since I am always reading and studying, I am open to new data and evidence that could change my position.
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David Gould
Pearl Harbor sucked. WinAce didn't.
- May 28, 2002
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Canberra, the capital of AustraliaPete Harcoff said:
bachelor of communications
I am currently an editor with Hansard at the Australian parliament.
atheist
Generally agnostic, but I had a lot of exposure to people of different Christian faiths through school. I became a Christian early on (age 8) then by the time I was 14 I was a rebellious atheist again. Then I became a Christian again after thinking more at age 18. Then I became an atheist again at age 30.
It is the best current explanation for the facts we observe. It is extremely difficult to think of a theory that would explain those facts and not contain most of the elements of the current theory.
When you look at the data it is clear that it is nonsense.
After becoming an atheist and surfing the net for people like me.
Read a few books by Dawkins and Gould, read a lot on the net. Best source found: lucaspa.
Creationism, no way. Evolution, of course.
I cannot see how. Creationism is falsified.
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Have any creationists (YEC) posted? I did not see them, if they have I was hoping to see NapaJohn, USAF, DCtalkexp and the gang. Rats!
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Yes, We hear how knowledgable and educated they are but when it comes time to spill the goods, they are no where to be foundlucaspa said:
.I can almost say for sure that their reading on evolution comes from AiG and Hovind, of course, there was the one gentlman who said he had been reading the "nonsense" in his son's high school, Biology book and was using a black marker to cross out the untruths, he figured the whole book we be marked out soon (something to that effect)...
I myself was hoping to see the educational background of some of our Creationist friends. I thought for sure we would have a few proud Patriot U grads (Hovinds online diploma mill alma-mater) Now do they compete in NCAA Division I football?
calling: NapaJohn, Calvin, Truthtraveler, DCtalkexp where areee yooouuuuu? (sound of echo)
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J
Jet Black
Guest
pishtosh, everyone knows that London, is the capital of Australia, as a result of it being the capital of the British Empire.David Gould said:
hey, we had one of your rugby players wandering down oxford street in London the other day. something about Rugby. I thought I might remind you about Rugby, in case you are a fan
I hear your team is the 2nd best!
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Tasmania
BSc(hons) geology
anostic
Anglican--alter boy
The evidence for, is overpowering
Can't believe biblical literalism
Evolution was taught in primary school.Creationism I came across about 1990
Studied alot on evolution through geology courses. Read books by Plimmer, Gould.
Evolution should be taught as a science subject. Creationism should be left to comparitive religioun courses
Not without divine intervention
Oh, occupation. Retired by a speeding car
BSc(hons) geology
anostic
Anglican--alter boy
The evidence for, is overpowering
Can't believe biblical literalism
Evolution was taught in primary school.Creationism I came across about 1990
Studied alot on evolution through geology courses. Read books by Plimmer, Gould.
Evolution should be taught as a science subject. Creationism should be left to comparitive religioun courses
Not without divine intervention
Oh, occupation. Retired by a speeding car
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Where do you currently live (city, country, etc)?
Las Vegas
What is your educational background and/or current occupation?
VP Customer Relations for a small telecommunications firm
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)?
Weak atheist
What was your religious upbringing like?
Agnostic, scientifically minded father. Lapsed Southern Baptist, ACLU card carrying mother (she was always a Liberal first!). Mom decided to try a non denominational church when I was 10 and I went with her...Bible Study, baptism, Sunday School, choir, etc. None of it really made sense though and I stopped going to church when I was 15 or so.
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution?
It best explains the diversity of life today and the fossil record
What are your feelings towards creationism?
Fringe extremists, ridiculous position
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution?
Never knew there was such a thing as creationism until I started posting at debate boards about 3 years ago. "God created the laws of physics" was all I had heard before that
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism?
I have read all of the major creationist literature, all of talkorigins and had discussions with evolutionary biologists and other scientists in relevant fields to this discussion
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools?
Evolution should be taught in school since it is tied with biology and backed with hard evidence
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism and/or evolution? No, creationism is completely ludicrous
Las Vegas
What is your educational background and/or current occupation?
VP Customer Relations for a small telecommunications firm
What are you current religious beliefs (if any)?
Weak atheist
What was your religious upbringing like?
Agnostic, scientifically minded father. Lapsed Southern Baptist, ACLU card carrying mother (she was always a Liberal first!). Mom decided to try a non denominational church when I was 10 and I went with her...Bible Study, baptism, Sunday School, choir, etc. None of it really made sense though and I stopped going to church when I was 15 or so.
What are your feelings towards the theory of evolution?
It best explains the diversity of life today and the fossil record
What are your feelings towards creationism?
Fringe extremists, ridiculous position
When did you first learn about the creationism and evolution?
Never knew there was such a thing as creationism until I started posting at debate boards about 3 years ago. "God created the laws of physics" was all I had heard before that
What sort of research have you done with respect to evolution and creationism?
I have read all of the major creationist literature, all of talkorigins and had discussions with evolutionary biologists and other scientists in relevant fields to this discussion
Do you think creationism and/or evolution should be taught in schools?
Evolution should be taught in school since it is tied with biology and backed with hard evidence
Do you think that you would ever change your position with respect to creationism and/or evolution? No, creationism is completely ludicrous
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JET I thought my gentle reminder about ASH would get a response about the record of oz wins over the old country;the ashes. We could include the Davis Cup, womens hockey 5-0 win v england, squash world champions even real (Royal ) tennis. The list is almost endless. The rugby was an aberration.
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