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Creationism/Creation Science... approved by Arkansas house

Discussion in 'News & Current Events (Articles Required)' started by BobRyan, May 2, 2021.

  1. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    Are plants self-aware?
    Is bread mold?

    Every cell in your body is "alive," but none of them are self aware... or are they?
    Truly you would be Legion, for you would be many... trillions, in fact.
     
  2. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    I said this would be a good place to start. We're just getting started. As you have not expressed the chemical reaction that would explain self awareness; we're getting off to a very slow start.

    As I was writing that; I had predicted plants might be used to diminish the validity of the question.

    Can you explain the chemical reaction that takes place to make predictions of the future?
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2021
  3. MIDutch

    MIDutch Well-Known Member

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    So you are claiming that scientists do not have eyes with which to examine, study, measure, compare, etc. the fossil evidence that's right in front of them. Or are unable to see the changes that occur in living species because of environmental pressures occurring in real time. Or are unable to study the genetics of living species and how they are genetically related to but different from each other.

    Odd, then that you demand that everyone accept the occurence of events that no one has ever seen evidence of and are only found in a religious book.
     
  4. MIDutch

    MIDutch Well-Known Member

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    So you are admitting that creationism is therefore not science since none of it has ever been observed.
     
  5. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    As self-awareness is not a requirement for life, we're starting off in the wrong direction.

    Perhaps I should be asking if you consider plants to be "life."

    Well, it's definitely not 6CO2 + 6H2O —> C6H12O6 + 6O2... because I've yet to see a tree predict the future.
     
  6. Jimmy D

    Jimmy D Well-Known Member

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    No one’s has answered me and it’s possibly the most pertinent questions thus far (not to blow my own trumpet)..

    Specifically what scientific evidence supports creationism? What research do it’s supporters find most compelling? You need to teach something in a science class, what would such a curriculum include?

    If creationists can’t answer these questions they have no right supporting the teaching of creationism outside of the RE class. The silence is telling though, creationism is in no way scientific... and other than badmouthing science that contradicts it, it offers exactly nothing outside of the religious groups who support it.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2021
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  7. durangodawood

    durangodawood Dis Member

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    You can observe evidence from the past.

    Thats what observable means in this context. It doesnt mean you have to watch the actual event occur.

    For instance, what do scientists make of various large craters on the earths surface? The scientific understanding is that many of them are from ancient cosmic collisions. Is that all bogus because no one was there to see it happen?
     
  8. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    As self awareness is a facet of life; I think that it's an awesome place to start. Thinking is a facet of life too.

    I do.

    So in other words you don't know that the ability to predict the future is a chemical reaction?

    I'll say that it's not, until it can be demonstrated that it is.
     
  9. Whyayeman

    Whyayeman Well-Known Member

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    There is direct evidence from observation. Lots of it.

    As an example, Richard Lenski's work on bacteria, cited above, has demonstrated evolution in the laboratory. He began with cultures of E. coli and ended up 20 years later with cultures of a new bacterium, directly descended from E. coli but demonstrably a different creature.

    If direct evidence were required in science that would put the theory of creationism firmly in its place as unscientific. It cannot by Hark!'s definition be an alternative to (proper) science.
     
  10. TLK Valentine

    TLK Valentine You will be who you will be. We are our choices.

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    The plants disagree -- or at least they would, if they were capable of self-awareness and thinking.

    And yet you won't find the chemical reaction for self-awareness in them...

    And so long as the ability to predict the future is not a requirement for life (and it's not; just ask the mold), I'll say I don't care.

    So what is life, again?
     
  11. Whyayeman

    Whyayeman Well-Known Member

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    You should ask a humanist.

    (I think such a question is out of place here.)
     
  12. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    Craters are observable, repeatable, and testable. I have seen no evidence that macroevolution meets these criteria.
     
  13. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    I find it to be perfectly in place; as this belief system is a foundation of what is being taught in some of our public schools.
     
  14. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    I try to avoid presenting logical arguments to plants.
     
  15. durangodawood

    durangodawood Dis Member

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    No one has ever observed the formation of one of these craters. Yet we all readily admit scientific explanations of them. Why? Because we have observable evidence from the past.
     
  16. Whyayeman

    Whyayeman Well-Known Member

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    I didn't know this. In what part of the curriculum is humanism taught? (Our school system is more different from yours than I had appreciated.)
     
  17. DaisyDay

    DaisyDay blind squirrel

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    There is observation and direct observation - not necessarily the same thing. For instance, one cannot see a glacier's movement - it is way too slow - but that doesn't mean we can't observe the evidence of its movement. We draw conclusions of the movement even though we cannot see it in real time.
    Except in astronomy, what we see is the past. In our own present, we see light and events from the past.

    In evolution, we see evidence of what has passed and we can draw conclusions as to what is currently happening.
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2021
  18. durangodawood

    durangodawood Dis Member

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    In astronomy we only see light now. Its pure (and valid) reasoning that gets us to conclude its picture of past events.
     
  19. HARK!

    HARK! Well-Known Member Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter

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    [​IMG]

    On 15 September 2007, a chondritic meteor crashed near the village of Carancas in southeastern Peru near Lake Titicaca, leaving a water-filled hole and spewing gases across the surrounding area. Many residents became ill, apparently from the noxious gases shortly after the impact.

    Impact event - Wikipedia
     
  20. durangodawood

    durangodawood Dis Member

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