"Covering"

[Peaceful Dove]

Thank you.
I think I understand. Now I will digest it.
Thanks again.

 

[KleinerApfel]

If any person wants to "cover" me they'd better do it in LOVE!

Here's the job description for any applicant wanting to to cover me:

1 Cor.13


4

Love is patient,

love is kind.

It does not envy,

it does not boast,

it is not proud.

5
It is not rude,

it is not self-seeking,

it is not easily angered,

it keeps no record of wrongs.

6
Love does not delight in evil

but rejoices with the truth.

7
It always protects,

always trusts,

always hopes,

always perseveres.

8
Love never fails.



Wow, tall order!

Hmm, let me see, Who do I know that fulfills all of that perfectly?

 

[EyezOFire]

The pop-theology doctrine of “covering” as far as I can research it began will Bill Gothard’s Institute of Basic Life Principles conferences back in the 60s-70’s and has been used ad nauseum as though it were the teaching of scripture ever since.

~Jim

Believe in miracles but don’t depend on them.​

My wife had some of that teaching growing up and the Lord set her free from alot of it because it was so legalistic.. Jim I like your quote at the bottom, "Believe in miracles but dont depend on them." Another thing that we are seeing with our current church is that it seems they are more concerned about doing signs and wonders and supernatural happenings than growing in a relationship with Christ. The Pastor has said from the pulpit using said If signs and wonders dont follow you then you should check to see if your even a Christian, so it creates this standard for going out and trying to produce signs and wonders. That's the best way I can explain it if it makes any sense at all...

 

[JimB]

For those who remember the old short-lived Shepherding Movement of the 1970s will see shades of the Gothard “covering” in the authority structure they created.

~Jim

Believe in miracles but don’t depend on them.​

 

[Peaceful Dove]

For those who remember the old short-lived Shepherding Movement of the 1970s will see shades of the Gothard “covering” in the authority structure they created.

~Jim

Believe in miracles but don’t depend on them.​

Just read this link.

That was during my time and somehow I missed this entirely.
Wow!

 

[JimB]

Just read this link.

That was during my time and somehow I missed this entirely.
Wow!

Count yourself blessed.

~Jim

Believe in miracles but don’t depend on them.​

 

[Peaceful Dove]

Count yourself blessed.

~Jim

Believe in miracles but don’t depend on them.​

Thanks but I honestly cannot count that high.

Oooops, thought you said to count my blessings.

 

[ARBITER01]

Thank you for the unsolicited advice- My wife and I are in the process of leaving, and those are some great articles. This is my first church I attended and I dont remember it being this way, but that could have been because God maybe protected me from it or I just didnt see it. Is this prevelant in alot of Charismatic Churches ?

It is just religious in nature. Control and religion sort of go hand-in-hand.

There is no one particular church type that it is at more than another.

 

[Meshavrischika]

It is just religious in nature. Control and religion sort of go hand-in-hand.

There is no one particular church type that it is at more than another.

true. I find there are elements of control in every church, be it financial, or behavioral.

 

[ARBITER01]

true. I find there are elements of control in every church, be it financial, or behavioral.

Yep.

It twists things to justify self in many respects. The flesh side in operation instead of The Holy Spirit.

 

[Meshavrischika]

Yep.

It twists things to justify self in many respects. The flesh side in operation instead of The Holy Spirit.

we be havin' pharisees among us to this day

 

[ARBITER01]

we be havin' pharisees among us to this day

And the saducees, those that denied the supernatural.

Legalism, control, religion all go hand-in-hand, and can be actually spotted if we are looking and watching. The Holy Spirit will point these things out to us.

It is very hard to find a church that isn't demonstrating some form of this.

 

[EyezOFire]

Why is Hierarchy and titles such a big deal in the church ? Why is the pastor like the CEO ? Jesus said not to seek after titles. But yet we see Prophet or Prophetess this, Bishop so and so, Elder , Pastor, etc...

 

[ARBITER01]

Why is Hierarchy and titles such a big deal in the church ? Why is the pastor like the CEO ? Jesus said not to seek after titles. But yet we see Prophet or Prophetess this, Bishop so and so, Elder , Pastor, etc...

Pride for the most part.

Some of the greats of our history moved in massive amounts of Holy Spirit power, but were never called anything more than their first or last name.

There was another thread that had a link to a person who was called "apostle" this and that, as if that person had achieved the ultimate position in Christ, but I bet he had no power like Jesus or Paul.

It is just pride for the most part.

 

[synger]

And here I thought we were going to be discussing modesty issues, and wearing veils and covers during prayer and worship.

I've been reading too much comparative doctrine lately. *chuckles*

 

[Meshavrischika]

And here I thought we were going to be discussing modesty issues, and wearing veils and covers during prayer and worship.

I've been reading too much comparative doctrine lately. *chuckles*

yeah... me and that subject are not a good mix.

I'll stick to vague topics like the whole of legalism thanks

 

[Peaceful Dove]

Why is Hierarchy and titles such a big deal in the church ? Why is the pastor like the CEO ? Jesus said not to seek after titles. But yet we see Prophet or Prophetess this, Bishop so and so, Elder , Pastor, etc...

Just out of curiosity, where did Jesus say that?
It is not a familiar scripture to me.

What about the definitions of ministries, I think it is Timothy?

No debate, just asking. I am still trying to get a grip on this whole thing.

 

[EyezOFire]

Matt 23:8-12 this is where I referenced that peaceful dove

 

[ARBITER01]

Just out of curiosity, where did Jesus say that?
It is not a familiar scripture to me.

What about the definitions of ministries, I think it is Timothy?

No debate, just asking. I am still trying to get a grip on this whole thing.

Many people are just presumptious.

I think what he is getting at is if we seek just a title, we are only uplifting ourselves in front of others, and that is something that Jesus comdemned. Quite a few people do this nowadays.

On the other hand, ministry positions are from GOD, and they are given with power to perform, but they are not just handed out unless GOD is ready to give you it.

 

[Meshavrischika]

hey! can one of you more knowledgable people start a thread on the organization of church bodies (like we've been talking about with pastors and elders, etc)