Countless different opinions....

[PeterKovac]

There are countless different opinions about what is good, bad, sin, what was ment in this Scripture passage and what in the other. I think that thats because man is making God in his own image. Probably everyone is very far from the Truth.

 

[miamited]

Hi Peter,

I don't know that I'd agree that everyone is far from the truth, but it absolutely becomes harder and harder to discern the truth without a solid foundational understanding of God's word for oneself. Too, mamy 'Christians' listen to the latest fad teacher without ever doing their own reading and studying and without personal, diligent study of God's word for oneself they are like sheep being led to the slaughter.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted.

 

[PeterKovac]

Thank you for your reply miamited. My experience is that even I do my own reading and studying, I can say that I am even more aware of that I may by far from truth. sometimes its the more I read, the more its complicated :-D

 

[SolomonVII]

Thank you for your reply miamited. My experience is that even I do my own reading and studying, I can say that I am even more aware of that I may by far from truth. sometimes its the more I read, the more its complicated :-D

It is the often the problems we encounter in the bible that focus on the meanings we are meant to struggle with.

These are the spiritual exercises that strengthen our resolve when we meet up with similar problems in everyday living

 

[Faith.Man]

Thank you for your reply miamited. My experience is that even I do my own reading and studying, I can say that I am even more aware of that I may by far from truth. sometimes its the more I read, the more its complicated :-D

May I humbly recommend you take advantage of the many free resources available on-line. Look at teachers and expositors of the word that have stood the test of time. Look at the men of the Reformation: some you'll agree with; some you won't. But it's a good starting point for building a solid foundation. Two good sites for free on-line resources are:

e-Sword - the Sword of the LORD with an electronic edge

Bible Software theWord!

Other sites you may find helpful are:

BibleGateway.com: A searchable online Bible in over 100 versions and 50 languages.

Blue Letter Bible - Home Page

Pink's Archive

There are many more but that should give you something to read and consider. I use both e-Sword and the Word. I've been using e-Sword for years and really like it. I am newer to "the Word" but like some of its features. God help you on your journey. If I can be of further help, let me know.

 

[OzSpen]

Ted,

Hi Peter,

I don't know that I'd agree that everyone is far from the truth, but it absolutely becomes harder and harder to discern the truth without a solid foundational understanding of God's word for oneself. Too, mamy 'Christians' listen to the latest fad teacher without ever doing their own reading and studying and without personal, diligent study of God's word for oneself they are like sheep being led to the slaughter.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted.

Could you imagine somebody, say, 30 years after the death of Christ who would agree that one needs to do "their own reading and studying and without personal, diligent study of God's word for oneself" (your words)?

These people, particularly Gentiles, would not have access to a copy of the OT and they certainly would not have their own copy of the NT to study.

Could it be that we in the 21st century are too committed to individualism (individual study of Scripture) that we overlook the fact that we Christians belong to the community of the King. We need the community of believers to help us with understanding the Word and teaching sound doctrine.

I'm of the view that individualism and personal Bible interpretation are detriments and not positives for building up the body of Christ.

I Thess. 5:11 states:

Therefore encourage one another and build one another up, just as you are doing (ESV).

The Christian life is a "one another" ministry. Rom. 15:14 speaks about being "able to instruct one another" (ESV).

The group nature of Christianity is sadly lacking in contemporary Western Christianity.

What's your view?

In Christ, Spencer

 

[marktheblake]

Probably everyone is very far from the Truth.

Probably.

When you are reading the bible, are you finding contradictions in your understanding?

If the answer is yes, you are interpreting something incorrectly. Go back and work it out. The Bible is completely integrated and subjects have multiple references and harmonise perfectly. The study of which and the revelations that come make for great experiences.

 

[miamited]

Hi Spencer,

Oh, I don't know that study of God's word isn't very important and essential to one's faith. Agreed, that in different times of history we have had more limited work to study than we do today. I am reminded that in Psalm 1, one of my very favorite Scriptures, we are told that the man is blessed who meditates on God's law day and night. David speaks in other places of harboring God's law in his heart. Now how do you suppose that got there if he didn't do some amount of study.

You mention one being asked, 30 years after Christ's death, to study, gosh, isn't that exactly what Paul recommended to Timothy. Oh, I probably just didn't read that right, huh. Friend, the whole, entire, complete, absolute, forthright reason that God raised up a nation of people through Abraham to be His people, according to Paul, was that they were entrusted with the very words of God. Even Jesus regularly called up the Jewish leaders of that day as being unfamiliar with the Scriptures. He was often found saying, "Have you not read...? On the road to Emmaus after his resurrection, he taught them all that had been written about him in the Scriptures.

I think that there is ample support, Scripturally, that we should encourage one another to deeper study of the written word of God. And I praise Him who created all things that today, in my life time, we have it all laid out, but then, that also means that we have no excuse.

God bless you.
In Christ, Ted.

 

[PeterKovac]

To OzSpen:
I think that if we listen to much to others, we can lack of own opinion. I mean that if somebody is wrong, we could be wrong too. Probalby going with the crowd is more detrimental than trying to understand God on your own.

To marktheblake:

I honestly dont think that Bible is "completely integrated and subjects have multiple references and harmonise perfectly." There are differences between versions of the Bible.

 

[OzSpen]

Peter,

To OzSpen:
I think that if we listen to much to others, we can lack of own opinion. I mean that if somebody is wrong, we could be wrong too. Probalby going with the crowd is more detrimental than trying to understand God on your own.

To marktheblake:

I honestly dont think that Bible is "completely integrated and subjects have multiple references and harmonise perfectly." There are differences between versions of the Bible.

What's the Bible's version on how we ought to respond to teaching that is contrary to the Scriptures?

Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect (Romans 12:2 ESV)

Christians are called to be people of discernment. What do different Bible translations of the same verse teach us? We need people who understand the original languages. I read NT Greek but am not yet proficient in Hebrew.

Two things have major influences on translations: (1) Having a knowledge of the words, grammar and culture of the original language, and (2) Knowing the translation philosophy of the translation. For example, I regard the NIV to be an excellent translation (I have a few minor objections to translation of a few verses) - as long as one understands the type of translation used. It uses dynamic equivalence, which aims to give the meaning of the text and not the word by word literal translation. However, knowing the original languages demonstrates that English word order does not coincide with Greek or Hebrew word order.

Sincerely, Spencer

 

[PeterKovac]

What's the Bible's version on how we ought to respond to teaching that is contrary to the Scriptures?

Proverbs 23:14 (New International Version © 2010)
14 Punish them with the rod
and save them from death.

Proverbs 23:14 (New King James Version)

14 You shall beat him with a rod,
And deliver his soul from hell.

I see big difference between death and hell.
Peter

 

[marktheblake]

I honestly dont think that Bible is "completely integrated and subjects have multiple references and harmonise perfectly."

Well find me the chapter on Sin. The chapter on Grace, the chapter on Forgivenes?

You cannot, because these things are mentioned throughout the bible. You can basically tear out a page from anywhere and we would not lose any doctrine.

 

[OzSpen]

Peter,

Proverbs 23:14 (New International Version © 2010)
14 Punish them with the rod
and save them from death.

Proverbs 23:14 (New King James Version)

14 You shall beat him with a rod,
And deliver his soul from hell.

I see big difference between death and hell.
Peter

What has this to do with discernment and "rightly handling the word of truth" (2 Tim. 2:15 ESV) in countering false doctrine?

In dealing with false doctrine, John exhorts us:

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world (1 John 4:1 ESV)

Sincerely, Spencer

 

[PeterKovac]

What has this to do with discernment and "rightly handling the word of truth" (2 Tim. 2:15 ESV) in countering false doctrine?

Which one is the false doctrine? Wages of sin is death, or wages of sin is eternal punishment in hell?

And anyone can tell that the others are false prophets. I can tell that you are the false prophet and you can tell that I am the false prophet. I think you see what I am telling here. Otherwise we would not have dozens of denominions. Dont you think?

Peter.

 

[OzSpen]

Peter,

Which one is the false doctrine? Wages of sin is death, or wages of sin is eternal punishment in hell?

And anyone can tell that the others are false prophets. I can tell that you are the false prophet and you can tell that I am the false prophet. I think you see what I am telling here. Otherwise we would not have dozens of denominions. Dont you think?

Peter.

So please tell me what is meant by "false prophets" in the following Scripture?

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world (1 John 4:1 ESV).

What did Jesus mean when he spoke of "false christs and false prophets"?

"False prophets and false prophets will arise and perform signs and wonders to lead astray, if possible, the elect" (Mark 13:22 ESV)

According to Galatians 2:4, there were "false brothers" in Galatia:

"Yet because of false brothers secretly brought in - who slipped in to spy out our freedom that we have in Christ, so that they might bring us into slavery (ESV)

There will be false prophets, false christs, false brothers, false apostle, etc. throughout church history, what discernment does the Lord give us to determine their falsehood?

Talking about the many denominations (ca. 38,000) is a throw-away line to divert attention away from the seriousness of identifying falsehood being taught in the ranks of the church. For example, there is a question about the deity of Christ (whether Jesus is God) being asked in this directory. This is dealing with a fundamental of the truth vs falsehood in Christian doctrine.

Sincerely, Spencer

 

[PeterKovac]

OzSpen.
I am sorry for delay..... I have read that there is no soul recently. Therefore there could not be a heaven, purgatory or hell. The word soul has different meaning in original hebrew and greek language than its in other translations. They said that soul is no such thing like immaterial part of man. That means that men who translate Bible use words which match their belief. I mean if I believe in immortal soul, I would use words in translation whose match this belief. .....sorry for my broken English.

 

[OzSpen]

Peter,

OzSpen.
I am sorry for delay..... I have read that there is no soul recently. Therefore there could not be a heaven, purgatory or hell. The word soul has different meaning in original hebrew and greek language than its in other translations. They said that soul is no such thing like immaterial part of man. That means that men who translate Bible use words which match their belief. I mean if I believe in immortal soul, I would use words in translation whose match this belief. .....sorry for my broken English.

You go off at your own tangent again. Why don't you answer my posts about "false prophets"?

Here is an exposition of the orthodox doctrine of "the immorality of the soul".

Sincerely, Spencer

 

[PeterKovac]

OzSpen.
I am sorry but I dont clearly understand what answer you want from me. I think that false prophets were, are, and will be present in world. The thing is that its hard to tell who is false prophet and who is not. Today I may believe something and tomorrow I may realize that was false teaching.

 

[OzSpen]

Peter,

OzSpen.
I am sorry but I dont clearly understand what answer you want from me. I think that false prophets were, are, and will be present in world. The thing is that its hard to tell who is false prophet and who is not. Today I may believe something and tomorrow I may realize that was false teaching.

All that is needed to discern the false is to know the truth. False prophets are self evident when we know the Scriptures. Those who disagree with the truth of God's Word are false prophets.

I'm not talking of different interpretations, but false prophets clearly prophesy what is contrary to the teachings of Scripture. What does 2 Timothy 2:15 teach?

Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who has no need to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth (ESV)

False prophets do not rightly handle the word of truth - the Scripture.

Sincerely, Spencer

 

[PeterKovac]

Do you know such false prophecy?