Could Theism simply be a human response to the instinctual fear of death?

[Gladius]

So Emmy, are you saying that God couldn't simply be a human response, like believing your deceased Grandfather helped you ?

I'm not challenging your belief, I would like to understand why you believe it.

Perhaps if you shared why you changed from your Grandfather to an Angel it would assist.


PS - I'm an athiest but do not think there is any thing wrong (or inconsistent) with memories of a loved one providing your conscious and/or unconscious mind their wisdom. I had a really influential Grandfather too, and I believe he continues to help me, despite passing away 20 years ago.

 

[Paul01]

Is there a theistic religion which doesn’t include an afterlife, or other method to cheat natural death (e.g. reincarnation)?
Why is the thought that this human existence on earth is the only one there is, so hard to accept?
Many believe it to be the case for every other living thing on earth. Why (if you accept evolution) are humans to be the exception?
I’ll answer my own question here, we’re the only species (accepted at present) to be able to devise supernatural mental constructs (called theologies) on how to cheat death.

Personally, I believe in heaven and hell. I also have OCD which makes it virtually impossible for me to be 100% certain about where I'm going. This makes being a theist difficult, and the idea of life after death often isn't very comforting.

 

[Gottservant]

I've thought about this a couple of times now...

...and the thing that springs to mind is "even if it was a response to Death, does that make it any less inevitable, by virtue of the Death that no one of us can avoid?"

 

[variant]

I've thought about this a couple of times now...

...and the thing that springs to mind is "even if it was a response to Death, does that make it any less inevitable, by virtue of the Death that no one of us can avoid?"

Death being unavoidable doesn't mean that wishing God, or an afterlife to exist is a more truthful endeavor.

It explains why some people do it.

 

[Gottservant]

that all depends on whether or not you are just looking for an explanation

unfortunately, the fact that you are does not preclude that someone else who is looking for more actually finds it

so in the end, you die and because you were completely at peace for whatever reason, your body just decomposes, but someone else who was expecting to see something when they die, spends their whole life enjoying sights and then on top of that transports their soul to a place where you can see everything much like a dream, you get your justice, they get theirs, the only point at which your short-sightedness negates their vision is the point at which they actually entertain being as short-sighted as you and even then you may have a really good reason for it, after all, I suppose

 

[Gladius]

that all depends on whether or not you are just looking for an explanation

unfortunately, the fact that you are does not preclude that someone else who is looking for more actually finds it

so in the end, you die and because you were completely at peace for whatever reason, your body just decomposes, but someone else who was expecting to see something when they die, spends their whole life enjoying sights and then on top of that transports their soul to a place where you can see everything much like a dream, you get your justice, they get theirs, the only point at which your short-sightedness negates their vision is the point at which they actually entertain being as short-sighted as you and even then you may have a really good reason for it, after all, I suppose

So in your scenario above, you're saying the two people choose what happens to their consciousness after death?

How is that any different to 'believing'?

Surely eternal life (like heaven) is either reality or not. Granted in my opinion plenty of people are deluded into dreaming up an alternate reality, but when the time comes, I'll find out for sure (as will you) what the reality is. What I 'believed' prior will have no effect on it.

Which brings up something that might help anyone who is inclined to cling to the 'benefits' of an eternal life, even though they realise that the religion that dreamed it up is completely without evidence or logic.

If there is no 'afterlife', immediately upon death you won't have any consciousness to realise it (or that you are dead) and hence cannot feel any pain or worry about it. The old 'you' will be in a perfectly neutral state (some call peace). You can only feel negative (or any) emotions or sensations while alive.

Sometimes people incorrectly imagine no-afterlife as the blackness of space. There is no blackness, there is just an absence of consciousness. To attain this state is actually the goal of millions of Buddhists (who believe until they achieve the goal of non-existence, they will instead keep returning to the constant suffering that is 'life').

 

[variant]

that all depends on whether or not you are just looking for an explanation

unfortunately, the fact that you are does not preclude that someone else who is looking for more actually finds it

so in the end, you die and because you were completely at peace for whatever reason, your body just decomposes, but someone else who was expecting to see something when they die, spends their whole life enjoying sights and then on top of that transports their soul to a place where you can see everything much like a dream, you get your justice, they get theirs, the only point at which your short-sightedness negates their vision is the point at which they actually entertain being as short-sighted as you and even then you may have a really good reason for it, after all, I suppose

I probably can't convince you any fantasy you might wish to believe might not be true if you really want to believe it, but it really doesn't matter that much.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

But the very fact that we are able to "construct" these theologies proves that there must be such "constructs"
We all believe in something whether it is ourselves or this or that that is what it makes us human. And we do not cheat death.... Earthly death even for scientists does not mean end of life but maybe as we know life as it is now... For example our bodies die but our spirit could live on. Our afterlife is not exactly like this life; it is life transformed as a we know it. It is not cheating but changed into a life of true living in a place that is so much different that what we experience now.

 

[DennisTate]

Is there a theistic religion which doesn’t include an afterlife, or other method to cheat natural death (e.g. reincarnation)?
Why is the thought that this human existence on earth is the only one there is, so hard to accept?
Many believe it to be the case for every other living thing on earth. Why (if you accept evolution) are humans to be the exception?
I’ll answer my own question here, we’re the only species (accepted at present) to be able to devise supernatural mental constructs (called theologies) on how to cheat death.

In my opinion it is far far far far more probable that humans were invented in order to solve a problem that G-d/HaShem was experiencing…… He had a son Lucifer who rebelled and thus G-d had to figure out some way to restore his fallen son…… eventually?!

When a person falls from his level he should know that it’s heaven-sent, because going down is needed in order to go up, therefore he fell, in order that he arouses himself more to come close to Hashem. Advice for him - Begin anew to enter into service of Hashem as if you have never yet even begun (Ibid)

Nachman of Breslov - Wikiquote


http://www.christianforums.com/t7647325/


Yom Kippur/The Rapture connection?!
This is just a theory and I may be wrong but after being highly skeptical of the idea of a rapture for most of my life I am now open to the idea that the Rapture could fit in extremely well with the ultimate fulfillment of the Fast of Yom Kippur.


I could not get my head around this idea until reading the NDE account of Dr. Richard Eby:

He paused as though the joy of that thought had overwhelmed him for the moment.

"My Father assures me that the time is yet a little while, but very little. Soon he will call those already in paradise to surround me as we descend from this third heaven to the first heaven around the Earth. The souls of all my saints will be instantly clothed in their new resurrection bodies, as will the living saints on Earth who rise to us in the glory cloud! At the sounding trumpet they all receive new bodies and rise to meet us in the air. We return as my body to my throne room with the Father. Now do you understand why I called this place a temporary abiding place? Do you grasp what it will mean to be one with me and the Father in your incorruptible bodies? My book states that I assumed mankind's sin so you "might be made the righteousness of God' in me!"

I can clearly recall how Jesus' voice paused at this moment. He was savoring an anticipation too intense and private to be revealed. Was he pre-living that moment at which he would enjoy the victory which his Father would give him as the eternal reward for his own long-suffering? His own sting of death would be swallowed up, and he would be the omniscient Head of a completed and compliant body for whom he had shed his blood on a terrible cross. He would reign as KING of the Jews after these days of grace. Then his thoughts returned to me.

"My son, when that time has come, my Father will call to me. The applause of the heavenly hosts will be deafening; they too have been awaiting that day, ever since they announced my birth to the shepherds at Bethlehem so long ago. Scoffers will gaze with fear and wonder as my angelic hosts watch me fulfill my promise to my earthly body of believers at my soon return to Earth.

….My dad, Robert Tate died on January 1, 1990. He had NOT given his heart to Rabbi Jesus/Yahushua so far as I knew.

Around that time I ran into the near death experience accounts through an article in Psychology Today. As I read several books by Dr. Raymond Moody I went into something of a philosophical/theological crisis as I encountered evidence that the "soul sleep" doctrine that I had been taught by evangelist Garner Ted Armstrong and his dad had almost certainly been terribly in error!

I had been fasting on Yom Kippur since the late 1970's and I had always wondered what this verse could possibly mean:

but the goat on which the lot fell for Aza'zel shall be presented alive before the LORD to make atonement over it, that it may be sent away into the wilderness to Aza'zel.(Leviticus 16:10 RSV)

 

[Neochristian]

Yes, but that is a little simplicistic. It is more than that.