Could the fall of morals from the 1960s to now have been avoided?

[Go Braves]

I do miss carhops.

I have no idea what that is, lol. But I'll look it up.

Edit
Oh like Sonic. We still have those.

 

[Hazelelponi]

Those of us born in the past are still running the nation.

What is hard for younger people in America to fully grasp is that we American Boomers were born on a different planet than you were born on, a different planet than this one.

It's hard to grasp how dominating racial segregation was in America if you weren't there. I, personally, was in middle school before I ever knew a white kid by name. Most Boomers older than I were in the working world before they ever knew someone of the other race by name...if then.

There were three movie theaters where I lived. One was for blacks only, one was for whites only, and in one blacks could sit in the balcony. We had separate swimming pools, separate schools, separate play ares in the park.

Go to YouTube and watch some television programs prior to 1964. No black people in those programs, particularly not in any children or family programming. There were no black people on The Jetsons or on The Flintstones. There were no black people in Leave it to Beaver or Ozzie and Harriet. There were no black people in The Andy Griffith Show or Bewitched or I Dream of Jeannie. There were no black people in commercials and no black people in the backgrounds of the sets.

The vast majority of white kids growing up in the late 50s and early 60s grew up in a segregated world. He didn't see black people in his daily life, he didn't interact with other black kids. He didn't even see black people on television. The idea that it was okay for black people to be around him isn't what he was taught as a child.

"As the sapling is bent, so grows the tree."

"Raise up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not depart from it."

And those kids are the adults still running America today. Those are still the people controlling industry, media, law, and politics. When John Lewis looks across the aisle, he's looking at the same individuals who were opposed to him in 1963.

Now, for sure, many of them have overcome their childhood teaching--when they have determined themselves to do it. But that's not most people.

We Boomers were the last generation raised in racial apartheid. It was inculcated into us as children. We are locked into an unending combat that began on an entirely different planet like Autobots and Decepticons. The racial situation in the US is not going to change until we Boomers are dead.

We just have to die, because clearly we haven't changed as a generation, and we're going to stay in control, influencing younger generations, until we are dead. After we are dead, there will be a chance.

There's a divisive spirit at work today, and it's working on us as a nation I think.... because even I am sick of hearing about this racism that doesn't exist except in the hearts of those trying to convince the rest of us it exists..

It's about to destroyus. They are saying fear fear, where there isn't anything to fear. It's like moving into upside down world..

And I'm sorry for losing my temper yesterday, my husband had wanted to turn on the news and I posted after hearing the latest take on the plethora of racists this country is supposed to be teaming with, and I didn't see your post in the spirit you wrote it..

I grew up side by side with blacks and whites. I DO know that the schools we went to had less black children when I was very young, but more and more were moving into the areas I grew up in by middle school and high school, and as kids none of us saw anything as weird.

It wasn't weird for all of us to grow up together. In an interview with - I'm not familiar with rap much so forgive that - but snoop dog I believe his name was (could be wrong though), once said he never experienced racism in an interview. Well, I believe him because he likely grew up in the same neighborhoods I did.

Now, he was attacked for what he said and he walked it back I think quite a bit, later on, because anyone is attacked lately for saying we don't understand this racism people speak of.. but we truly don't, our minds can't even grasp it.

If you hear a young person spouting on about racism it's more than likely he only believes he experienced racism because that was what he was told he experienced, not because that was what he actually experienced.

You speak of the time of segregation, but how much worse could it have been without God? I'm serious on that..

When you spoke of praying and Bible reading didn't help, but how do you know it doesn't help?

I don't know how many black children were ever killed, or what the population of African-Americans would be like otherwise, but doesn't appear to have been a real attempt at genocide prior to abortion such as there was with the Jews and still have a population here in such a large number.

It seems to me segregation was only segregation with the exception of a few ignorant people who were more thug and criminal than anything... I had an African-American history professor in college and he didn't dispel this notion so it's rather how I think most view the time of segregation.

Look at the countries without prayer, God, and the Bible.. here, even with segregation, is better...

And with the Bible, and God, and prayer eventually a leader can rise and all people know he's speaking the truth and go on to end things like segregation..

I'm fairly certain that it was a lot of Bible believing, praying Christians that were also essential in ending segregation - while atheism just came up with a murderous new program for controlling the population size called abortion.

I need to be off line for a few days..ttyl and God bless.

 

[Desk trauma]

Like the Westboro Baptist Church does?

They have no authority to enforce or punish.

 

[VCR-2000]

I think it was inevitable with the age of enlightenment. This has led to modernism which ironically rejected enlightenment but also religious belief. This has also led to postmodernism where people have become skeptical and everything is relative and subjective. But I think as a result religious belief is one of the big casualties because overall there is still a tendency towards atheism and materialism.

Now this is kind of unique take on it.

 

[VCR-2000]

The sixties were probably the last decade where true belief in the agape love God promoted was a driving force among youth. Certainly there were those who viewed it carnally but for the most part as the song goes, 'All You Need is love" reflected the will of God. What happened after that was decline in agape yet a rise in evangelical political aggression at the end of the 70's. The tables had turned.

Now here is the point. The concept of morals is different between secular and true Christianity. One is based on loving neighbour as self, the other is predominately about self. So Christians putting the will of God ahead of their own, would see with the demise of agape that morals were declining, while the secular world would see improvement as self serving rights and opportunities rose at the cost of responsibility. The troubling part is if the Christian community is still as large as it claims, why are they taking the secular viewpoint now and worse yet following, not the difference between Kingdom and world of man, but political division within the world of man? So many Christians, so little agape.

If morality based upon agape is to make a comeback then Christianity needs to rise above the world once again rather than join it. Christians need to unite the world (ironically against itself) and remind it that the agape of the Kingdom will overrule the self serving world one of these days, so they might as well get with the program and switch allegiance now.

One thing I don't actually agree with is that loving neighbors versus one's self isn't mutually exclusive.

 

[stevevw]

Now this is kind of unique take on it.

I think that is why so many young people are moving away from belief. If you listen to young people everything is relative, there is no right or wrong and everything can be challenged. But it is not really an open and unbiased inquiry that critically analyses things and is open to new ideas and ways of thinking. There is a skepticism and an anti establishment and authority underlying thought even to the point of hate. So modern thinking is challenging truth. In that way people can rationalize a lie into the truth or the truth into a lie, its all relative.

I think in the 60s it was sexual freedom and experimentation especially with drugs. Then came the women's liberation so people have expanded their thought and pushed boundaries to be able to create a free thinking society. Along with that technology has given people a sense of power and a belief that humans are godly. So in some ways people are believing they are gods unto themselves and we can make the rules and determine our destinies.

In western cultures people are more individualistic so there is a lot of emphasis on individual ability and self importance. With that we are challenging everything. I think to be moral you have to acknowledge a moral code that is outside yourself but many people do not want to feel bound by any set of rules especially young people.

 

[Go Braves]

I think that is why so many young people are moving away from belief. If you listen to young people everything is relative, there is no right or wrong and everything can be challenged. But it is not really an open and unbiased inquiry that critically analyses things and is open to new ideas and ways of thinking. There is a skepticism and an anti establishment and authority underlying thought even to the point of hate. So modern thinking is challenging truth. In that way people can rationalize a lie into the truth or the truth into a lie, its all relative.

I think in the 60s it was sexual freedom and experimentation especially with drugs. Then came the women's liberation so people have expanded their thought and pushed boundaries to be able to create a free thinking society. Along with that technology has given people a sense of power and a belief that humans are godly. So in some ways people are believing they are gods unto themselves and we can make the rules and determine our destinies.

In western cultures people are more individualistic so there is a lot of emphasis on individual ability and self importance. With that we are challenging everything. I think to be moral you have to acknowledge a moral code that is outside yourself but many people do not want to feel bound by any set of rules especially young people.

What is truth, in your definition? Asking on account of how Christians fight with each other all the time, arguing over this and that. I think just about the only thing we agree on as truth is that God so loved the world He gave His own begotten son.

 

[Strathos]

What fallen morality? Treatment of minorities is better. Violent crime is down. Divorce is down (so are marriage rates). Interracial marriage is accepted by the vast majority. What's the problem?

Corporate greed. Anti-environmentalism. Religion being hijacked by partisan politics.

 

[stevevw]

What is truth, in your definition? Asking on account of how Christians fight with each other all the time, arguing over this and that. I think just about the only thing we agree on as truth is that God so loved the world He gave His own begotten son.

I agree even many who claim to be Christians can go along with worldly ideas of rationalizing the truth away. Yes Gods son is the way, the truth and the life and for Christians that is the only truth that morals can be based on. But this is not based on good works alone but by being born again and becoming a new person who is able to overcome the power of sin.

 

[VCR-2000]

I think that is why so many young people are moving away from belief. If you listen to young people everything is relative, there is no right or wrong and everything can be challenged. But it is not really an open and unbiased inquiry that critically analyses things and is open to new ideas and ways of thinking. There is a skepticism and an anti establishment and authority underlying thought even to the point of hate. So modern thinking is challenging truth. In that way people can rationalize a lie into the truth or the truth into a lie, its all relative.

I think in the 60s it was sexual freedom and experimentation especially with drugs. Then came the women's liberation so people have expanded their thought and pushed boundaries to be able to create a free thinking society. Along with that technology has given people a sense of power and a belief that humans are godly. So in some ways people are believing they are gods unto themselves and we can make the rules and determine our destinies.

In western cultures people are more individualistic so there is a lot of emphasis on individual ability and self importance. With that we are challenging everything. I think to be moral you have to acknowledge a moral code that is outside yourself but many people do not want to feel bound by any set of rules especially young people.

It is because America was founded as an experiment based on the principles spawned more-or-less from the era of liberal enlightenment to begin with. So ironically, I wonder how that directly started this sort of decline that started in earnest around 60 years ago.

 

[Chesterton]

It is because America was founded as an experiment based on the principles spawned more-or-less from the era of liberal enlightenment to begin with. So ironically, I wonder how that directly started this sort of decline that started in earnest around 60 years ago.

This guy gives a broad overview of Western philosophical thought about morality from before the enlightenment through the present day, including the influence of Marxism. I think it's pretty good. It's long but I'll post it anyway in case you ever have 2 1/2 hours to kill.

 

[Rubiks]

The sexual revolution did affect Christianity. Before 1960, the view of sexuality was that its purpose is procreation: contraceptives, anal/oral sex, homosexuality, masturbation, etc. were all equally condemned as "crimes against nature." Even having a women on top during sex was occasionally seen as violating the "natural supremacy of the male."

 

[hedrick]

The sexual revolution did affect Christianity. Before 1960, the view of sexuality was that its purpose is procreation: contraceptives, anal/oral sex, homosexuality, masturbation, etc. were all equally condemned as "crimes against nature." Even having a women on top during sex was occasionally seen as violating the "natural supremacy of the male."

Yup. This is one area where morals have improved. We're now willing to admit that sex has several purposes, and we're getting away from basing it on the natural supremacy of the male. However we haven't agreed on what the new standards should be.

 

[RDKirk]

The sexual revolution did affect Christianity. Before 1960, the view of sexuality was that its purpose is procreation: contraceptives, anal/oral sex, homosexuality, masturbation, etc. were all equally condemned as "crimes against nature." Even having a women on top during sex was occasionally seen as violating the "natural supremacy of the male."

In some Christian circles, the view of sexuality was that its only purpose was procreation...but not all.

 

[KCfromNC]

It is because America was founded as an experiment based on the principles spawned more-or-less from the era of liberal enlightenment to begin with. So ironically, I wonder how that directly started this sort of decline that started in earnest around 60 years ago.

This would be a lot easier to discuss if anyone could actually identify what sort of decline they are actually talking about.

 

[Desk trauma]

This would be a lot easier to discuss if anyone could actually identify what sort of decline they are actually talking about.

They know it when they see it!

 

[stevevw]

I think morals is something that cannot be measured by statistics on crime. Immoral acts are not always illegal. Today's view on morality is subjective so it is hard to pin down what is exactly declining. So the best source of whether morals are declining I guess is to ask people themselves and it seems that most surveys show the majority of people think morals are declining.

It may be that people feel that there is not as much kindness and empathy around. There is more hate and vitriol. People like to justify their actions and today there seems to be no truth about what is right and wrong. Its not about improved standards, or crime rates as these go up and down. I think it is just a general feeling that people have about human kind and where we are at compared to previous years.

For me I think we have always had crime but things like hate is more common. People would get into a fight but know when to draw the line. Now they cross that line and go well beyond to hurt for the sake of hurting and kill and cripple people. Children are more defiant and young people will attack authority. They believe they have all the rights and cannot be told. Whereas I think in the past there would be a line that they respected.

I think the sexual revolution in the 60s changed things. I know people say that we have always had deviates and sex crimes. But this is different today with the internet and pedophiles and access to inappropriate content even for children and teens. It seems normal to now have sex as a teen and get pregnant and then have an abortion. Soon we will abort a fetus if it is the wrong sex.

I know that mental illness has increase dramatically especially with young people. Some say it is because of the way we have been bringing up children with poor parenting and too busy with life in having to make money to pay for an increasing lifestyle. More pressure and stress. Often it is poor mental health, emotional regulation and inability to cope that leads to a lack of morals. Inability to empathize with others because of a lack of emotional support when young.

I think people are more about self today especially young. Surveys on uni students show they are less empathetic. I think people use to care more about others and sacrifice themselves. Now we seem more self centered and are more hedonistic.

https://lifewayresearch.com/2017/05...-moral-decline-cant-agree-on-right-and-wrong/

 

[quatona]

I think morals is something that cannot be measured by statistics on crime. Immoral acts are not always illegal. Today's view on morality is subjective so it is hard to pin down what is exactly declining. So the best source of whether morals are declining I guess is to ask people themselves and it seems that most surveys show the majority of people think morals are declining.

I wonder if there ever was a time when people didn´t think morals were declining.
Btw. there is a difference between "declining morals" and "declining moral behavior" (in your country) - which was the keyterm of the survey.

 

[VCR-2000]

I wonder if there ever was a time when people didn´t think morals were declining.
Btw. there is a difference between "declining morals" and "declining moral behavior" (in your country) - which was the keyterm of the survey.

Sure there was always a certain group of people in previous eras that thought morals were declining, but some of it has a point. Today it's just a lot more commonplace per capita than before a certain period.

A case that sounds interesting is "Old Hollywood" celebrities stars have been having abortions decades before Roe v. Wade declared it was a right for all women.
Classic Hollywood’s Secret: Studios Wanted Their Stars to Have Abortions

 

[Speedwell]

Sure there was always a certain group of people in previous eras that thought morals were declining, but some of it has a point. Today it's just a lot more commonplace per capita than before a certain period.

A case that sounds interesting is "Old Hollywood" celebrities stars have been having abortions decades before Roe v. Wade declared it was a right for all women.
Classic Hollywood’s Secret: Studios Wanted Their Stars to Have Abortions

Safe, medically supervised abortions have always been available to the rich and well-connected and always will be. I can remember back when I was in high school, well before Roe v. Wade, the working class girl who got in trouble had to leave school and have the baby, her chance at an education ended. The rich girl took a couple of weeks off school to visit previously unmentioned relatives in, say, Sweden and her life went on as before. Make no mistake: the push for abortion laws is about the working class and no one else.