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I disagree. They seem to be following Martin Luther in spirit whe trying to cling to their own form of Catholicism.I find the sspx to be wonderful catholics who refuse to weaken their faith in the historical church or the power of the defined rite of the mass as if they were somehow lacking. Really good example to faithfulness for all of us
that would be more likely through Peter for everyone to accept it."no longer speak of recognizing neither the Second Vatican Council nor the legitimacy of the Novus Ordo Missae,”
"No, we cannot force you to accept the Council"
"In its conclusion, the text argues that if “God wants to come to the effective aid of His Church, which is bleeding from a thousand wounds, he has thousands of different means of doing so. One of these is the official recognition of the SSPX through the Roman authorities.”
I know many on here are not big on prophecy but it there is prophecy that the church after its hard trials will be comfortated a great ecumenical council will be held by a great pope that everyone will accept it and the church will be restored to her former glory and shine like never before... if that is through the sspx i dont know but i think we still have many long roads to walk down before then.
agreed.I disagree. They seem to be following Martin Luther in spirit while trying to cling to their own form of Catholicism.
I disagree. They seem to be following Martin Luther in spirit whe trying to cling to their own form of Catholicism.
I would be happy to see a reunion. Maybe they can open up an SSPX chapel around here, since the diocese does not provide a TLM for us.
I find the sspx to be wonderful catholics who refuse to weaken their faith in the historical church or the power of the defined rite of the mass as if they were somehow lacking. Really good example to faithfulness for all of us
I find the SSPX prefer to focus their attention on real or imaginary "wrongs" that others are doing rather than focus their efforts on loving God and neighbor. It isn't the SSPX that's leading the charge to feed the hungry, welcome refugees, and heal the sick.
I wonder how many will go along with thisPope Francis may be on the verge of deal with Traditionalists.
Leaked internal memo from Society of St. Pius X says Pope won't require acceptance of Vatican II as a prerequisite to coming back, perhaps as personal prelature.
Continued below.
http://www.cruxnow.com/church/2016/04/27/pope-francis-may-be-on-verge-of-deal-with-traditionalists/
but it did work for St. Francisif 'not being silent and pointing out the errors' didn't work for Luther, why would it work for him?
they are setting up a seminary in Virginia, not sure when that is going to be done, but that should help bolster the SSPX in AmericaI would be happy to see a reunion. Maybe they can open up an SSPX chapel around here, since the diocese does not provide a TLM for us.
yes, and the key there is working within the church, not leaving it to form another church.I wonder how many will go along with this
a number of people already left the SSPX for the PFSP (Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter) who have Latin Mass and are in communion with Rome
so while a number of SSPX might rejoin normalized relations with the Church, I am sure some will just go full Sedevacantist
but it did work for St. Francis
and St. Ignatius of Loyola
and St. John of the Cross
and St. Teresa of Avila
and many other reformers who worked within the Church
we should no buy into the hype about Luther, he did a lot of harm, but it is not like he was the greatest intellect of his time
nor did he win over droves of people by his personal piety
Lutheranism was spread by stirring up xenophobia over authority being set in Italy, Princes and Merchants wanting more freedom to exploit the poor, and taking advantage of the moral failings of members of Church hierarchy to play with the emotions of the simple folk
they are setting up a seminary in Virginia, not sure when that is going to be done, but that should help bolster the SSPX in America
yes, and the key there is working within the church, not leaving it to form another church.
technically they have not left the Church
they are just disobedient
now it is arguable if that disobedience is just or unjust
I think SSPX has gone over the line in several ways
but it is not the same as leaving the Church
The first reference you list to the Catechism of the Catholic Church using the word "grave" is on how Satan can harm people spiritually which directly pertains to mortal sin.That is demonstrably false. The Church often uses the word "grave interchangeably with "serious". Please do not resort to preaching zealous error just because you hate the messenger.
CCC 395
CCC 1401
CCC 1457
CCC 1500
CCC 1515
CCC 1583
CCC 1628
CCC 2072
CCC 2080
CCC 2117
CCC 2152
CCC 2183
CCC 2223
CCC 2243
CCC 2254
CCC 2269
CCC 2282
CCC 2291 (in the first case)
CCC 2385
CCC 2498
I didn't state that anyone in the SSPX is or is not in a state of mortal sin. I don't know their hearts. You don't know what any individual SSPXer believes or knows.
395 The power of Satan is, nonetheless, not infinite. He is only a creature, powerful from the fact that he is pure spirit, but still a creature. He cannot prevent the building up of God's reign. Although Satan may act in the world out of hatred for God and his kingdom in Christ Jesus, and although his action may cause grave injuries - of a spiritual nature and, indirectly, even of a physical nature- to each man and to society, the action is permitted by divine providence which with strength and gentleness guides human and cosmic history. It is a great mystery that providence should permit diabolical activity, but "we know that in everything God works for good with those who love him."
The first reference you list to the Catechism of the Catholic Church using the word "grave" is on how Satan can harm people spiritually which directly pertains to mortal sin.
In my post, I also said, "Perhaps you mean objectively grave matter which does not always equate to a personal mortal sin."Read them all, thank the man who shared the truth with you, and appologize for preaching error.
The term "grave" in Catholocism is not only used with regard to mortal sin. You stated otherwise and you were wrong. You're being given an opportunity to man up here, and I think you should take it.
In my post, I also said, "Perhaps you mean objectively grave matter which does not always equate to a personal mortal sin."
Okay then, I stand corrected.I meant the word grave.
You stated "The Church only uses the word "grave" when it comes to a mortal sin."
I demonstrated your statement to be false.
You're welcome.
From what I've read of the situation, it seems to me that it was Pope John Paul II that forced the SSPX into an irregular status by refusing to budge one inch with Archbishop Lefavbre. He was hoping to outlive him so that the Society would be without bishops to consecrate new priests. So that's why Lefavbre consecrated the other bishops that lead to the formal excommunication. It was an act of desperation to keep the Society alive after his own death. If JP2 had given the concessions Pope Benedict gave in allowing the TLM to be licitly celebrated, there likely would be no rift today.
No pope is perfect, and I think the handling of the SSPX is one of JP2s blemishes. Hopefully Pope Francis will be able to bring them back into a regular ministry within the Church.
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