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And this is the one thing lacking by most in this whole argument - STEWARDSHIP, which is also a command of God.
Redhead11, are you who I think you are (nine kids gives away some of that)? I think we know each other from other boards and FB.
Howdy and welcome here.... from a really old codger
I'm not pre-Sem or in Sem. I did study philosophy in undergrad and was exposed to alot of theology by way of course (Augustine, Aquinas, Luther came up once in a while), not always Lutheran ones (public college).
I would love to see where a Lutheran theologian says to balance Law and Gospel. Walther explicitly says when constructing a sermon to have the Gospel predominate.
The Apology, V.I
As the distinction between the Law and the Gospel is a special brilliant light, which serves to the end that God's Word may be rightly divided, and the Scriptures of the holy prophets and apostles may be properly explained and understood, we must guard it with especial care, in order that these two doctrines may not be mingled with one another, or a law be made out of the Gospel, whereby the merit of Christ is obscured and troubled consciences are robbed of their comfort, which they otherwise have in the holy Gospel when it is preached genuinely and in its purity, and by which they can support themselves in their most grievous trials against the terrors of the Law.
Just an outsiders perspective (in more than one way). I have many thoughts regarding this topic, but will not share them here.
This thread makes me sad for several reasons. I always wanted 12 kids. Didnt happen. As it turned out, we couldnt have any biological children. Yes, we adopted older children from Korea. They are now 43 and 40 years old.
But we have borne the brunt of many offhand comments from family members and friends that our children are not really ours, and not really part of the family. Another close relative has four boys by three different husbands. She could get pregnant by sneezing. Those children (now adults) are often considered on that side of the family as real family members.
We have been blessed with five grandchildren and one great-grandchild. But they live 2500 miles away. And we delight in them whenever we can see them (about once every two years).
Ministry to people in all of these kinds of situations (mentioned throughout the thread) requires patience, love, and understanding. Unfortunately Christians often dont exhibit any of those characteristics. And from first-hand experience, I know how that can hurt when the person desires to faithfully serve God.
Okay, so now I bow out.
Just an outsiders perspective (in more than one way). I have many thoughts regarding this topic, but will not share them here.
This thread makes me sad for several reasons. I always wanted 12 kids. Didnt happen. As it turned out, we couldnt have any biological children. Yes, we adopted older children from Korea. They are now 43 and 40 years old.
But we have borne the brunt of many offhand comments from family members and friends that our children are not really ours, and not really part of the family. Another close relative has four boys by three different husbands. She could get pregnant by sneezing. Those children (now adults) are often considered on that side of the family as real family members.
We have been blessed with five grandchildren and one great-grandchild. But they live 2500 miles away. And we delight in them whenever we can see them (about once every two years).
Ministry to people in all of these kinds of situations (mentioned throughout the thread) requires patience, love, and understanding. Unfortunately Christians often dont exhibit any of those characteristics. And from first-hand experience, I know how that can hurt when the person desires to faithfully serve God.
Okay, so now I bow out.
No one is talking about "mingling" them together.
When we speak about our faith, we don't pound people with just the law. The Baptists do that well enough
We balance the message with an the Gospel.
GOOD EXAMPLE:
We are sinner (the Law), Christ died for those sins (the Gospel).
BAD EXAMPLE:
Those who even lust in their minds sin. Do not even look at women whose breasts are virtually hanging out. Love your wife. (all Law, no Gospel)
I wish there were more Bible quotes in this thread to show that/why birth control is allowed. So far I've mostly seen personal opinions based on one's own life experiences.
Somewhere in this discussion someone said to bach90 that it's easy for him to say x,y,z and to come back later on when he's been married for 30 years. I really don't agree with that comment--Bach is only trying to say something he believes he sees in the Bible. That is really the attitude all of us should have, we should base our opinion first and foremost on the Bible and not on what we have been through in life. As long as Bach uses the Bible as ground for his opinion it won't change even 30 years later when he's an exhausted poor Dad with 8 kids....
*I* said that, cerette - did you read what i read, the post above yours? yes, we should absolutely use the bible as our base for everything. the thing is, that life throws curve balls, and sometimes we have to make decisions that others might not necessarily make.
if you were in the situation i was in, would you have gone ahead and just kept having kids???
I don't know what I would have done in that situation, sounds like a very hard one. I just know that I used to be one of those who chose not to have kids 'yet' as I "knew" the timing was bad and money was tight. Then when the timing seemed 'right' and I "knew" I could afford to have kids, they didn't come that easily. It was a whole lot of heartache, crying, sadness and prayer before I was blessed with the one child I now have. (It took almost two years of trying like crazy and the same week I had given up the idea of ever having any biological kids I learnt that I was pregnant.) If I could turn back time I would have started trying to have kids on my wedding night!!!
I will say that my husband also mentioned, although he treads carefully when counseling on the matter. Like I mentioned above there really is no perfect time to bring a child into the world.
ok - then - see, nobody should look down on anybody for the decisions they make. you chose to wait because timing was bad, and then it was hard to get pregnant. so it's almost like you feel guilty about that. don't feel guilty about that. there's a reason for everything.
Redhead11,
Both law and gospel is found in both the Old and the New Testament.
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