Contraception

[JacktheCatholic]

Interesting article about the RCC and contraception:

Catholic hospitals bar contraception, abortion and sterilization.

12.5% of all U.S. community-based hospitals are Catholic.

Amednews.com: amednews: Doctors at religious hospitals face ethical conflicts over care :: May 3, 2010 ... American Medical News

Catholic hospitals are required to follow the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops' religious directives on medical care that bar contraception, abortion and sterilization and, in many instances, rule out ending artificial hydration and nutrition.

When conflicts arise, 86% of surveyed physicians said they would encourage patients to seek the recommended care at another hospital. Ten percent said they would offer an alternative treatment that could be delivered at the religious hospital, and 4% endorsed violating the hospital's policy to provide the care.

Referring patients to another hospital may not be in the patient's best interests, said Dr. Stulberg, particularly for time-sensitive interventions such as emergency contraception. Referrals also can impede access to care for patients who live in underserved rural areas or lack access to transportation, she said.

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops are under the authority of the Pope and Magisterium. This article is evidence that the RCC is against contraceptives and does not endorse them.

 

[bbbbbbb]

Interesting article about the RCC and contraception:





Amednews.com: amednews: Doctors at religious hospitals face ethical conflicts over care :: May 3, 2010 ... American Medical News




The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops are under the authority of the Pope and Magisterium. This article is evidence that the RCC is against contraceptives and does not endorse them.

I doubt anyone on this thread would disagree with these articles. The issue at hand is not that the Catholic church is against contraceptives, but that it supports and encourages couples to practice contraception, albeit without using the contraceptive devices it condemns.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

I doubt anyone on this thread would disagree with these articles. The issue at hand is not that the Catholic church is against contraceptives, but that it supports and encourages couples to practice contraception, albeit without using the contraceptive devices it condemns.

That is funny... I see the RCC teaching to use chastity and not contraception. I have only heard of contraception being allowed in the case of a rape victim that we know has not conceived. Otherwise, I am not aware of another case where contraception is allowed.

But one has to understand the reasons for contraception to be a sin in the RCC for married couples before they can lay claims that the RCC supports or encourages contraception. Maybe it is ignorance to think that? I suspect it is a lack of knowledge and understanding. I hope it has nothing to do with prejudice and hate mongering.

 

[sunlover1]

That is funny... I see the RCC teaching to use chastity and not contraception. I have only heard of contraception being allowed in the case of a rape victim that we know has not conceived. Otherwise, I am not aware of another case where contraception is allowed.

You need to read the thread then.
Contraception is promoted through Natural methods.

But one has to understand the reasons for contraception to be a sin in the RCC for married couples before they can lay claims that the RCC supports or encourages contraception. Maybe it is ignorance to think that? I suspect it is a lack of knowledge and understanding. I hope it has nothing to do with prejudice and hate mongering.

Huh? Hate mongering?
You really need to read the thread Jack.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

You need to read the thread then.
Contraception is promoted through Natural methods.

If I am practicing chastity it is contraception to you? That makes no sense.

 

[Thekla]

I do think I may understand - correct me if I'm wrong !
"Natural birth control" requires self -control; artificial or mechanical methods of birth control do not require self- control.
Is that sort of it ?

 

[sunlover1]

If I am practicing chastity it is contraception to you? That makes no sense.

Who said that? Surely not me.
I said you really should read the thread...

He's saying to deny each other sex while fertile..

I'm saying that's not scriptural. and so, not a good idea.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

I do think I may understand - correct me if I'm wrong !
"Natural birth control" requires self -control; artificial or mechanical methods of birth control do not require self- control.
Is that sort of it ?

In marriage the church teaches the spouses to grow in love and faith through the conjugal act and chastity. It allows chastity to be used. But contraception creates a contraceptive mentality and harms the marriage. It also can lead to abortion which is always a grave sin. Contraceptives that are abortive can never be used even in the case of rape.

 

[Thekla]

In marriage the church teaches the spouses to grow in love and faith through the conjugal act and chastity. It allows chastity to be used. But contraception creates a contraceptive mentality and harms the marriage. It also can lead to abortion which is always a grave sin. Contraceptives that are abortive can never be used even in the case of rape.

To continue the thought, I do understand that self control (chastity) is an important aspect of developing the ability to engage and continue in right-relationship. It is an essential ability in any relationship - including being a parent. So in this sense, the mutual practice of self-control (avoiding coitus during fertile periods) actually does have a relationship-building (through self-denial) aspect.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

"Natural birth control"

... is birth control.

It means controlling births, which means controlling conceptions.

There are two possibilities: a desire to DO something to increase conception, birth - perhaps to have as many and much as biologically possible (the official, documented record is 69 children). The other possibility is to desire to DO something to decrease conception, to counter it, do practice birth control to decrease it, to do something contraceptive.

requires self -control

Birth control probably does imply controlling things - mainly births.
Family Planning probably implies planning - mainly births.






.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

Who said that? Surely not me.
I said you really should read the thread...

He's saying to deny each other sex while fertile..

I'm saying that's not scriptural. and so, not a good idea.

If I want to know the RCC teaching then I should read the CCC and Apostolic Letters. I fail to see how rereading parts of this thread and reading parts I have not of this thread will change what the RCC teaches???

 

[JacktheCatholic]

To continue the thought, I do understand that self control (chastity) is an important aspect of developing the ability to engage and continue in right-relationship. It is an essential ability in any relationship - including being a parent. So in this sense, the mutual practice of self-control (avoiding coitus during fertile periods) actually does have a relationship-building (through self-denial) aspect.

Yes, the RCC has a report on such studies and this has shown to improve marital relationships and make couples happier in their marriages.

 

[Thekla]

... is birth control.

It means controlling births, which means controlling conceptions.

There are two possibilities: a desire to DO something to increase conception, birth - perhaps to have as many and much as biologically possible (the official, documented record is 69 children). The other possibility is to desire to DO something to decrease conception, to counter it, do practice birth control to decrease it, to do something contraceptive.

Birth control probably does imply controlling things - mainly births.
Family Planning probably implies planning - mainly births.

Yes, but the kind of human effort involved differs - profoundly.

One involves battling desire, the other involves a schedule or the use of a mechanical device less effort, and one does not in the use of these actually "overcome oneself". The ability to battle desire, to overcome oneself is an essential component in building relationship.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

If I am practicing chastity it is contraception to you? That makes no sense.

If one is sexless, that would prevent births - but would not be contraceptive sex, it would be a sexless marriage. My Catholic teachers taught me that was ONCE the typical (but unofficial) Catholic counsel: "No kids? No sex!" But that changed in the sexual revolution of the 1960's when the RCC took the position that couples may have LOTS of sex, plenty of sex - at least as much sex as the frisky Baptist couple next door or the LDS couple with 18 kids, but if kids are to be avoided - they may have it CONTRACEPTIVELY. The RCC is now the leading religious promoter and teacher of contraceptive sex in the world. Catholic Birth Control. Catholic Family Planning.







.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

Yes, but the kind of human effort involved differs - profoundly.

The intent does not.

As I understand it, the typical married couple does not have sex at least once daily (about 12 times per month is often noted as "typical"). If natural, sex is typically shared as hearts mutually desire. In unnatural sex, it may be "rescheduled" or redirected to days when the female is likely infertile - for one reason: to not conceive. The means and end is singular: contraception. It is not about having no sex, it's not about natural sex, it's about having sex contraceptively. The RCC will teach you how. They may require that you learn now.





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[sunlover1]

Yes, but the kind of human effort involved differs - profoundly.

One involves battling desire, the other involves a schedule or the use of a mechanical device less effort, and one does not in the use of these actually "overcome oneself". The ability to battle desire, to overcome oneself is an essential component in building relationship.

WHY would you "battle " the desire for your spouse?
God is the author of that desire,
if not for it, the human race ends...

 

[Thekla]

The intent does not.

As I understand it, the typical married couple does not have sex at least once daily. If natural, sex is typically shared as hearts mutually desire. In unnatural sex, it may be "rescheduled" or redirected to days when the female is likely infertile - for one reason: to not conceive. It is not about having no sex, it's not about being natural, it's about having sex contraceptively. The RCC will teach you how. They may require that you learn now.

I think you're really missing my point. The inability or refusal to practice self-control is part of the Fall; in order to engage in true and deepening relationship one must be able to practice self control, self-denial.

Acting on mutual desire and also practicing self denial are aspects of the marital relationship. It seems the argument is that using artificial birth control allows ones desires to reign (is anti-relational at its core), whereas natural contraception may be aimed at not having offspring but is still pro-relationship.

 

[Thekla]

WHY would you "battle " the desire for your spouse?
God is the author of that desire,
if not for it, the human race ends...

Not all desire is good, post fall.

What if my spouse is feeling ill ?
What if my spouse is tired ?
What if it isn't my spouse who awoke my desire ?

And I did not say "desire for your spouse", but desire.

 

[JacktheCatholic]

If one is sexless, that would prevent births - but would not be contraceptive sex, it would be a sexless marriage. My Catholic teachers taught me that was ONCE the typical (but unofficial) Catholic counsel: "No kids? No sex!" But that changed in the sexual revolution of the 1960's when the RCC took the position that couples may have LOTS of sex, plenty of sex - at least as much sex as the frisky Baptist couple next door or the LDS couple with 18 kids, but if kids are to be avoided - they may have it CONTRACEPTIVELY. The RCC is now the leading religious promoter and teacher of contraceptive sex in the world. Catholic Birth Control. Catholic Family Planning.







.

Your Catholic teachers are not the Pope and Magisterium. This is the RCC and not a Protestant church, we are not a democracy. I know that is hard for some to fathom but the RCC has a moral shepherd to guide us in these matters and contraception for a married couple is intrinsically evil.

It sounds like you received a poor catechizing from your teachers. As a catechism teacher myself I have seen this with some and know of a church that has a director of education that knowingly teaches contrary to the RCC. Wolves in sheep's clothing they are.

 

[MamaZ]

If I am practicing chastity it is contraception to you? That makes no sense.

It is when it is being practiced so that one does not conceive. And why would you practice chasity in a marraige? If not for the fact it is the fertile time of the month?