Confused

[SirKenin]

The thing is: if one is damned to hell for divorce and remarriage without cause, I am already damned.
I got married the second time when my first husband was still alive.

So if ONE ACT....one sin, will send you to hell, then there is nothing I can even do now. Because I have been married 3 times already.

So if there is no forgiveness, I'm going to hell anyway.

I don't think that's the way it works all. I don't think anyone is suggesting that.

God does forgive you once you become a believer, and you start over again. HOWEVER, if you're perpetually living in sin once you become a believer, you are testing God's grace, and the Bible warns against that.

So.. Now that you know the truth, remarriage would be the wrong answer for you I think. You can't expect to jump into yet another marriage and then say "Sorry, God, please forgive me but I'm going to stay living in sin". It doesn't work that way.

You know now. Now there is no excuse. Seek forgiveness for your past, and don't make the same mistake a fourth time.

 

[Leanna]

Well this thread has gotten more complicated and OP, I think a Christian counselor would be good. I don't believe in the idea that those who have divorced should always have to stay single. It seems one sided, aimed at women, and makes no logical sense. So if a person has remarried (especially a woman?) and is raising a family, they are forever in sin? This is absolutely ridiculous to me.

 

[SirKenin]

Leanna, like it or not, it's Biblical truth. You can't eradicate that because it does not agree with your lifestyle choice. God will hold you accountable if you have knowledge.

It's not just aimed at women either. The same is true for men, and I hold myself accountable to these criteria the way any woman should. My decision to marry will be based upon these criteria, and ultimately I would not be with the lady I'm with now if either of us failed to meet same, all her great characteristics notwithstanding. One of the first things I ask a lady is if she is divorced and if so, why. That question gives me a world of insight into who I'm planning to date.

For instance. If someone was divorced three times, as is in this case, and they were not for Biblical criteria, I would refuse to date them. If they were in Biblical criteria, but the woman blames everything on her former husbands, or the majority of it, I would refuse to date her. Every divorce is 50/50. It always takes two, and clearly the woman lacks accountability, is self-centered, refuses help, has bitterness, or several other not-so-wonderful qualities (and I'm not even so much as implying that is so in this case). If the woman had three divorces, I would probably refuse to date her until I was convinced that whatever problem existed within her had been resolved. Chances are, though, that I would just move on without confirming resolution. Much easier and less heart/headache.

If I left my wife for other than Biblical reasons, I would remain single or reconcile to my wife. There are no two ways about it. I hold myself to Biblical truths (even though I stumble on a regular basis, I try hard).

 

[Leanna]

Leanna, like it or not, it's Biblical truth. You can't eradicate that because it does not agree with your lifestyle choice. God will hold you accountable if you have knowledge.

It's not just aimed at women either. The same is true for men, and I hold myself accountable to these criteria the way any woman should. My decision to marry will be based upon these criteria, and ultimately I would not be with the lady I'm with now if either of us failed to meet same, all her great characteristics notwithstanding. One of the first things I ask a lady is if she is divorced and if so, why. That question gives me a world of insight into who I'm planning to date.

For instance. If someone was divorced three times, as is in this case, and they were not for Biblical criteria, I would refuse to date them. If they were in Biblical criteria, but the woman blames everything on her former husbands, or the majority of it, I would refuse to date her. Every divorce is 50/50. It always takes two, and clearly the woman lacks accountability, is self-centered, refuses help, has bitterness, or several other not-so-wonderful qualities (and I'm not even so much as implying that is so in this case). If the woman had three divorces, I would probably refuse to date her until I was convinced that whatever problem existed within her had been resolved. Chances are, though, that I would just move on without confirming resolution. Much easier and less heart/headache.

If I left my wife for other than Biblical reasons, I would remain single or reconcile to my wife. There are no two ways about it. I hold myself to Biblical truths (even though I stumble on a regular basis, I try hard).

My lifestyle choice? Do you just throw our random uninformed venomous comments at people? I am not divorced or remarried so this issue doesn't even apply to me personally. But if you are suggesting that the many people in the world who are remarried are now living in habitual sin and that's that, I think its cr..p.

It is aimed at women, the verse used says if a WOMAN remarries she is committing adultery. And men can divorce their wife if she committs adultery, but not women?

I think the idea is to stay with your committments. Don't get divorced, work on your marriage. If you get divorced three times, yes there is a problem. I hope it can be fixed. But the past is the past, and there are many circumstances in which the former spouse returning is not an option and never going to happen. God does forgive sin, a person who remarries is not living in sin. If a man and woman divorce and the man marries again and has children, what is he to do? He can't divorce his second wife and return to the first so that he is no longer "living in sin" because then he is doing an injustice to the second wife. Is there no hope?

Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? By no means. But if we confess our sins and move forward with the pieces of our life that we have left he gives forgiveness.

 

[oldrooster]

The bible does not have stedfast answers, just guidelines. If you go by OT principles, then we are all condemed. I am divorced, was justified in divorcing her. I just was remarried and I feel Gods blessing on my union, my new wife was divorced once before as well.

 

[charligirl]

The thing is: if one is damned to hell for divorce and remarriage without cause, I am already damned.
I got married the second time when my first husband was still alive.

So if ONE ACT....one sin, will send you to hell, then there is nothing I can even do now. Because I have been married 3 times already.

So if there is no forgiveness, I'm going to hell anyway.
.

Of course there is forgiveness!! whatever gave you the idea that there wasn't? Yes your first husband is still alive, but you know God is gracious and you can receive His forgiveness if you are repentant.

WHether you marry again or not is up to you, I have already posted earlier why I believe the bible DOES allow for remarriage, if you are committed to this next marriage and you believe it will last then great!... however, to be blunt, from what i read so far, I think you could well be walking into failure again.

You need time by yourself, you need healing and counsel. Sounds also like you and your boyf have been living as man and wife anyway?? if that is the case then that is a sin and not a good basis for a marriage. AT the very least you should be living apart during the engagement and going to some serious pre-marriage counsel.

 

[bkg]

Leanna, like it or not, it's Biblical truth. You can't eradicate that because it does not agree with your lifestyle choice. God will hold you accountable if you have knowledge.

<snip>

Great post. I agree.

Like it or not (often I DON'T like it), we cannot get around the fact that Jesus did leave us with many, many commands. Commands are not optional, as I read them. Some of those commands deal with divorce/remarriage.

Yes, we are blessed with His grace. But we are also blessed with His commands.

If we confess and repent for our sin of divorce... does that give us permission and the ability to move forward with the sin of adultry?

I'm divorced. The unbeliever left, I guess. No adultry, she just wanted out. Does that give me permission to remarry? I can remarry my ex-wife. Other than that, I honestly don't have a concrete answer for that question - I'm still searching.

 

[SirKenin]

Great post. I agree.

Like it or not (often I DON'T like it), we cannot get around the fact that Jesus did leave us with many, many commands. Commands are not optional, as I read them. Some of those commands deal with divorce/remarriage.

Yes, we are blessed with His grace. But we are also blessed with His commands.

If we confess and repent for our sin of divorce... does that give us permission and the ability to move forward with the sin of adultry?

I'm divorced. The unbeliever left, I guess. No adultry, she just wanted out. Does that give me permission to remarry? I can remarry my ex-wife. Other than that, I honestly don't have a concrete answer for that question - I'm still searching.

Thanks

Paul tells us that if the unbeliever left we should let them. I'm reasonably certain in the spirit of the passage it gives us the option of remarrying, at least that was my interpretation of it. I guess like you said, though, you'll have to search for yourself and see how God convicts you.

 

[SirKenin]

The bible does not have stedfast answers, just guidelines. If you go by OT principles, then we are all condemed. I am divorced, was justified in divorcing her. I just was remarried and I feel Gods blessing on my union, my new wife was divorced once before as well.

Yes, we were all condemned. That was the point of having the OT Law, the NT tells us. Nobody could achieve righteousness and the Kingdom of Heaven of their own accord. However, we are no longer under the OT Law, but under God's grace as we are told by Paul.

That does not give us license to live in sin and test God's grace. We are warned against that.

I have no idea what you're situation is, and don't need to know, but God does.

 

[SirKenin]

My lifestyle choice? Do you just throw our random uninformed venomous comments at people? I am not divorced or remarried so this issue doesn't even apply to me personally. But if you are suggesting that the many people in the world who are remarried are now living in habitual sin and that's that, I think its cr..p.

The "your" was a general comment. It wasn't meant that I was applying it specifically to you, but to people who would think that their lifestyle choice IS justified.

I'm suggesting that people who are remarried that weren't divorced for Biblical reasons ARE living in habitual sin. The Bible is clear on that. To say that the Bible does not give us clear answers on anything, as our friend oldrooster suggests, is undermining the authority of the Bible. I would hasten to suggest that is a dangerous thing to do.

 

[Leanna]

I'm suggesting that people who are remarried that weren't divorced for Biblical reasons ARE living in habitual sin. The Bible is clear on that. To say that the Bible does not give us clear answers on anything, as our friend oldrooster suggests, is undermining the authority of the Bible. I would hasten to suggest that is a dangerous thing to do.

So a person who is remarried, what are they to do? If they get divorced from their second wife and return to the first, then they just divorced again. If they stay where they are you say they are living in sin. Is there no hope for them? Do you have an answer for this that fits into your little box?

 

[SirKenin]

So a person who is remarried, what are they to do? If they get divorced from their second wife and return to the first, then they just divorced again. If they stay where they are you say they are living in sin. Is there no hope for them? Do you have an answer for this that fits into your little box?

I think the general idea is that you're not supposed to get into that trap in the first place. That's why Biblical guidelines are put in place. However, there needs to be some qualification to your little booby trap, as there is not enough information. You are more interested in attempting to corner me than you are discerning Biblical truths and divulging enough information to sufficiently answer your questions.

For instance... What about the example of someone who divorced when they were not a Christian and remarried, then found Christ? They discover what the Bible says about divorce and suddenly find themselves in a predicament. I believe that we are to stay in the position we were in when we were called to salvation.

However, say you callously disregarded the message of the Bible? Say you knew that the Bible said it was wrong to remarry and you did it anyways? You will be judged at the Final Judgement based upon your knowledge. Whether you inherit the Kingdom of God or not will ultimately be up to God, but certainly the Bible gives us sufficient hints as to the answer to that.

The Bible does tell us not to divorce our wives unless in the case of adultery or if the unbelieving partner leaves. If both are believers the second one doesn't qualify. However, if one or both did not divorce for Biblical reasons, one or both have committed adultery by remarrying. Therefore I would think that was sufficient justification to divorce and remain single, living your life for Christ as opposed to yourself.

See, if you were following the commands of the Bible to begin with, like you're supposed to, you wouldn't find yourself in such a bind. This is what happens when people casually disregard the Bible as not having the answers. They find themselves in a new (and in this case adulterous) bind.

Is there hope for them? I don't know. Only God holds the answer to that. The Bible tells us that the adulterous will not inherit the Kingdom of Heaven. If I had to go strictly by that, I would say therein lies your answer. I myself must be careful not to judge though, only God can do that, so I will only say turn to the Bible and prayer for your answer.

 

[ElizabethanLady]

Yes, I would like to hear that also.

Anyway, I am very upset and distraught. I have alot of shame and guilt over being married 3 times, but I think there were reasons for it, i.e., the death of my Father.

However, whatever the reasons were, I don't want to go on and commit more sin. I do care for my BF. IF we had the money, he could just get his own crib and that's that but I don't think now he would stand for that, he says this church has me "brainwashed."

My life has been a struggle since I got divorced. I have no family and no help, no one to watch my children while I work.

I don't even know what I am supposed to be doing. The model is to stay home and homeschool your children, but how can I do that? If I don't work, we are going to be living in poverty. Then they would be embarrassed.

I don't understand or know what I am supposed to do. I want to be that lady you read about, the Christian lady who homeschools her children and works for the poor, but if you are not married how on earth do you do something like that?

What do you do? I am so confused. If my ex-husband was not so hateful it would be different but he has made it as hard on me as he could.
He refused to watch the children while I worked at night and even threatened to charge me FOR WATCHING HIS OWN CHILDREN! There wasn't any real watching to do, I work third shift.
He made it impossible for me to work. I made eight thousand dollars last year. I was supposed to get 3 thousand back on my tax refune, but the government took it all.

 

[SirKenin]

You want to get married for all the wrong reasons, Elizabethan. This is what I'm reading from your posts.

Seeing as how that's the case, I give your new relationship about one chance in five thousand. Please consider your motivations and Christ's commandments before you move on. Don't jump into something for all the wrong reasons and find yourself in yet another predicament.

 

[ElizabethanLady]

For instance... What about the example of someone who divorced when they were not a Christian and remarried, then found Christ? They discover what the Bible says about divorce and suddenly find themselves in a predicament. I believe that we are to stay in the position we were in when we were called to salvation.

I agree with this.
However, my BF moved from where he lives to be with me and now claims that unless I let him live here, he is homeless.
He said he may as well get a tent and live in that!

I don't know what I am going to do but I cannot go through with another marriage, knowing that it isn't right.

I don't know what to do. I guess I could let him have this place where we live, and move out and find something else, that way he wouldn't be "homeless".

 

[ElizabethanLady]

I guess, if nothing else, I could go to where my career takes me and let the chips fall where they may.

I love him (it may not sound like it), but I cannot willfully disobey the Lord. I can't.

 

[SirKenin]

I agree with this.
However, my BF moved from where he lives to be with me and now claims that unless I let him live here, he is homeless.
He said he may as well get a tent and live in that!

I don't know what I am going to do but I cannot go through with another marriage, knowing that it isn't right.

I don't know what to do. I guess I could let him have this place where we live, and move out and find something else, that way he wouldn't be "homeless".

Grrrrrrrr

You are being manipulated, and that fills me with a feeling that could best be described as anger. You do this...else...is manipulation and there is no excuse for it.

Let him be homeless. I think if you did nothing he would find himself a home rather quick. If he doesn't, some provider he'll be. You'll probably still be living in poverty, contrary to your stated goals. You'll just have one more mouth to feed.

The more you say, the less healthy this relationship sounds. I would avoid it like the plague.

I hope this helps

 

[charligirl]

Grrrrrrrr

You are being manipulated, and that fills me with a feeling that could best be described as anger. You do this...else...is manipulation and there is no excuse for it.

Let him be homeless. I think if you did nothing he would find himself a home rather quick. If he doesn't, some provider he'll be. You'll probably still be living in poverty, contrary to your stated goals. You'll just have one more mouth to feed.

The more you say, the less healthy this relationship sounds. I would avoid it like the plague.

I hope this helps

Don't agree with all your posts on this thread but I couldn't agree more with this !

 

[ElizabethanLady]

I know, it sounds terrible, doesn't it.
This is one reason I have decided not to marry him, aside the the Biblical ones.

However, where he is coming from is that he HAD a home, which he sold to move down here to be with me. That's what I wanted him to do at the time, because we were going to get married once my divorce was final and it would've been final alot sooner if my husband had not done what he did....anyway.....he wanted me to move up there where he is from but I wouldn't, so he sold his stuff and moved down here. I didn't have "shacking up" in mind but thought it was circumstances.
Anyway, now he says that about homelessness because he sold the place he was living in and moved here to accomodate me.

However, let me ADD that his moving here was with the understanding that he find employment here, which he didn't.

Anyway, now he blames me because he has no where to go.

I don't understand him. Where is his pride? Yes it's true that I asked him to do that but he is an adult and did it of his own free will; I didn't hold a gun to his head although come to think of it I did say I would break up with him if he didn't move down here so we could be together.
At the time I didn't want to move because then the kids couldn't see their Father as much.
Although, the way he acts that would probably be a good thing. But they love him.

 

[bkg]

because we were going to get married once my divorce was final

WHOA... Despite anything else that has been written, encouraging or discouraging to your situation... If your divorce has just become final, I fear that you are not healed from that situation and not ready to jump into another marriage. I just see red flags all over the place on this one, even w/o bringing Biblical teaching into the discussion.

Question (personal - and you don't have to answer)... Have you ever been "alone"? Have you ever been w/o a husband/boyfriend for an extended period (year +) in your life?