Confessions of a Doctrine Hopper

[HephzibahBenJudah]

Doctrine Hopping: A term I made up for the sake of this thread. Which means jumping between beliefs within Christianity.

How many times have you hopped in your faith walk?

I was raised Pentecostal Holiness

I then hopped to a Charismatic / Lutheran hybrid (gifts of the Spirit coupled with saved by faith alone)

I was tempted at one point to add Christian Universalism to that growing hybrid, but in the end abandoned the notion.

I finally settled on the Assemblies of God because of their broader doctrinal interpretations and acceptance (as a whole)

The Charismatic / Pentecostal part is a make or break issue with me as well.

I agree with about 80% of their postion papers posted at their website.

The parts I don't agree with I think are negligible and really have no significant importance.

Your Turn

Basically what you refer to as doctrine hoppers are those "growing in Christ" in our journeys to following Him and coming to KNOW Him intimately, we will find "doctrines" if you will from every denomination which help us to evolve into the full stature of Christ.

However, "doctrines of men" won't get you to walking in the fullness of the gospel of Jesus Christ. A personal relationship with Him and following Him will.

That's why we need to be like the early disciples in that we preach, teach and heal...that is the full gospel.

The "simplicity" if you will of preaching Jesus; Him crucified and raised from the dead, and soon to come King.

That is what needs to be propegated. When that happens Jesus works with them performing the miracles of healing, delivering and salvation. That is the Power of God to salvation. (not the doctrines of men)

 

[CatholicFlame]

yeah I agree the doctrines made up by men will get you confused and lost.

 

[flaglady]

Sounds like you all pretty much knew what you were moving from and to in your journeys. Mine was somewhat more simplistic.

Born into a nominally CofE (Anglican) family (well that's what we would put on forms if asked!) I mooched around most of my life, calling myself a Christian but just because I knew I wasn't an atheist or Bhuddist or anything like that! I 'd bump into friends and colleagues who were Christian over the years but while I respected their views, never felt compelled to do anything about it!

During my nurse training I would sometimes go to evensong in Norwich Cathedral but generally just for something to do and because it was cheaper than going to the cinema!!

Then when I got into my late thirties, a few things happened (Dad died and I had a major op) and I began to see the futility and emptiness of my life. For the first time I began to realise that my career was not sufficient of itself and that, the biggest shock of all, Jo did not actually exist; only Sister Jo, the theatre manager, the matron, like an alter ego who had taken over my life. For the first time I began to ask "Is this all there is? What happens when I have to retire?"

Then one day God spoke to me (in my operating theatre!!!) and the next thing, I had been confirmed in my local CofE church. But still not enough. I want to learn. I was hungry for more information, more revelation and I was not getting it.

I moved to a church where a friend went. It was Baptist/Methodist (??don't ask me!) but the minister there was very Spirit-filled. I could see that though I didn't really understand what it meant. Well, he moved on and the replacement was just like the chap in my previous church. Another friend said to try her church. This was a free church with Brethren roots. BIG mistake!!

Then I heard about the Sunderland Refreshing. This move of God had just started and big conference style meetings were being held. I attended everyone and found myself opened to all sorts of wonders, not least of which was the flags. It was some time before I even heard the term Assemblies of God mentioned and had no idea what it was or meant. But God eventually had me move up here from Essex to join that church and I haven't looked back since.

To be perfectly truthful, I am still puzzled about a lot of the different doctrines. Many of them I had never heard of until I came to CF so in many respects, I have learned a lot since joining CF. But I still don't really understand why people have to be so up in arms about these things. I suppose I'm still just rather simplistic about it all.

As someone else said, 'all I know is Jesus Christ and Him crucified'.

 

[Meshavrischika]

I was raised by a baptist father and methodist mother (anyone who says interfaith marriages are not confusing for children is lieing). I have attended both of those church bodies as a child (and eventually disagreed with both on major points). I have attended Episcopal churches, 7th day Adventist, Assembly of God, Pentecostal, Catholic, Lutheran and non denoms. I am most comfortable leaning toward the more demonstrative charasmatic churches though. I'm currently in a non-denom church who's beliefs I'm probably 90% on board with.

Basically, I find validity in some aspects of all the church bodies I have attended. I think God is gracious enough to meet our individual needs with different bodies to suit different believers. He's a wonderful God.

 

[JAS4Yeshua]

I split out a number of posts regarding being saved inthe Catholic Church and the discussion associated with it to this thread:

http://christianforums.com/showthread.php?t=6745726

Also deleted a couple of posts resulting from another off-topic tangent that I accidentally started. No one did anything wrong, but do remember to try to keep things on topic.

Now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

 

[MrSnow]

I had no particular doctrinal system when I was in my early teens. I discovered a man named Arnold Murray on TV one morning when I was 15. I soaked up his stuff like a sponge. I soon also discovered Bob Enyart, who made me feel ok to not use a KJV exclusively. About a year after discovering Arnold Murray, I discovered the RCC in an effort to learn more ways to refute their teachings. In the mean time I also discovered Calvinism. After about two years of attending a PCA I considered myself more or less a Calvinist, but I also wanted to join the RCC (I had by that time given up my Arnold Murray affinities. It was also the time I was leaving home after graduating high school). I gave up on the RCC and began attending a PCA again for a few years. I "rediscovered" the RCC, but this time I discovered Thomas Aquinas as well. At that point I started making an effort to join the RCC. But as that was going on I discovered the EOC. I had known they existed, but never listened to their side of the story. After a few months, I decided to attend one of their liturgies. I ended up staying and joining them (I never actually joined the RCC). I was there for a couple years until I met my wife. We got married outside the EOC and subsequently left together. She was a catechumen at the time. It was during my time in the EOC that I began to consider myself charismatic. The EOC considers itself charismatic as well, but they say that they never needed a charismatic renewal, having never ceased operating in the gifts of the Spirit. My wife is WoF, but I have never been able to embrace it. We are currently looking for a home church. We both dislike Bible belt christianity, and we live in the Bible belt. Also, we're about to move to another part of the country soon. So we haven't found a place to call "home".

So the calvinists, the catholics, and the orthodox have all left a mark on me in their own ways. Like the calvinists, I have a huge appreciation for the sovereignty of God over all things. Like the catholics and the orthodox, I have a huge appreciation for the significance of the Incarnation, and I am highly sacramental in my outlook on all things pertaining to the christian faith. I also learned from them to accept that the Holy Spirit moves, and always has, and that there is no reason to fear it. Because of the orthodox I also reject the western understanding of original sin. I am not too keen on making explanations of how the atonement works on par with the actual atonement itself.

There are more marks that they have left on me, but I guess I'd have to consider myself some kind of a hybrid. I don't really have a "theological system" as I once did as a calvinist. I guess I am what I am.

 

[imperfectchristian]

Really interesting posts...it seems we all have this same thing in common. This search for knowing God...I have to wonder...are we ever truly going to be satisfied this side of heaven?

As for myself I think not.

 

[JimB]

Really interesting posts...it seems we all have this same thing in common. This search for knowing God...I have to wonder...are we ever truly going to be satisfied this side of heaven?

As for myself I think not.

No, I don’t think we ever will. Searching requires hunger and questions require trust (aka, faith). How boring life would be without questions to answer and problems to solve and things to wonder at. I do not want all the answers.

I believe the joy is in the searching; not in the finding.

~Jim

“Man is not the centre. God does not exist for the sake of man. “​

~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain​

 

[Christina M]

I believe the joy is in the searching; not in the finding.

I believe the joy is in the finding... or else God would not have included so much about it in the Word.

The man when he found his pearl.
The woman when she found her coin.
The prodigal's father.
The Canaan woman praying for her daughter.
The neighbor knocking and knocking for bread.
The widow and the unjust judge.
The shepherd with the one lost sheep.


Paul said the goal was to FINISH the race, not just do the race.

He also included lots of scripture instructing us to "find", not just enjoy the search:

wisdom
knowledge
hidden treasures
peace
Him
life
rest

 

[abbygirlforever]

I was raised in a fundamentalist Baptist church. When I was 8 or so we left that church and started going to a Methodist church. When I was 15, my parents started a long divorce process. As soon as I moved out of Dad's house and in with Mom at 17, I stopped going to church on a regular basis. I attended a Baptist church for a few months but quit going.

My first year of college I didn't go to church at all. I didn't renounce Christianity, but I wasn't really following the Lord, either. I had never really been around Pentecostals/Charismatics before, though I had heard of them and had a semi-favorable opinion of them. My third semester in college, a friend of mine invited me to a campus group that happened to be Full Gospel. I went and never quit. It's been a little over a year and I'm still going to the Full Gospel church.

 

[sneezingleopard]

I grew up in a strong practicing catholic family. Went to college and got involved in a bible study group under the umbrella of the assemblies of God (pentechostal/ charasmatic). Was invited to attend a non denominational church and did so. I was initially shocked that their was no eucharistic communion amongst other things( i later found out they did this once a month). I continued to go to this church with friends while I never stopped attending the catholic church. I stayed with the bible study and was eventually asked to be the leader which I did for two years. During these years I speant tons of time with the pastors and missionaires of the AOG group. I attended prayer groups, discussion groups, leaders meetings, planning meetings, conferences, retreats, etc. etc. I learned a lot about the AOG view on the gifts of the spirit and especially on speaking in tongues which was huge for this particular group (they didn't go so far as to say you must have this gift to be a real christian). At some point before becoming a leader I was also attending another denominational group based on the harvard campus (not sure what they were).

I think it was mostly in my senior year that I began to really be drawn back into full comunion with the catholic church and I really began understand and love everything that she teaches. I am still in contact with many of my friends from the bible study group and still good friends with atleast three of them. I am gratefull to everyone in that group, for all the pastors who taught to the best of their ability and to those who helped me and my friends in any way throughout my five years away from home. While their is plenty I don't agree with in the assemblies of God and non-denom, their is far more I do agree with and cherrish about these brehteren and the other denominatins I encountered in this multi-denominational group. Through there help I have been able to learn tid bits about greek orthodox, methodist, non-denom, assemblies of God, baptist, and nazareane denominations.

Also during these years I encountered many street preachers, Johovas witnesses (met with them on a regular basis to discuss the trinity for two months), budhists (two roomates claimed budhism as their religion), muslims (worked for a whole family and had one good muslim friend) and more earth based religions than I can keep track of. I even came across a couple of witches, tarrot card readers,athiests, agnostics, one self proclaimed satanist and a guy who claimed to worship his tomatoes. I think the last guy was just fooling with me because I was witnessing to him at the time. I went to an art college in Boston which should explain most of these encounters.
In Christ,
Matthew

 

[BenAdam]

I believe the joy is in the finding... or else God would not have included so much about it in the Word.

The man when he found his pearl.
The woman when she found her coin.
The prodigal's father.
The Canaan woman praying for her daughter.
The neighbor knocking and knocking for bread.
The widow and the unjust judge.
The shepherd with the one lost sheep.


Paul said the goal was to FINISH the race, not just do the race.

He also included lots of scripture instructing us to "find", not just enjoy the search:

wisdom
knowledge
hidden treasures
peace
Him
life
rest

Perhaps it is both.

Proverbs 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a matter,
But the glory of kings is to search out a matter.

 

[JimB]

I believe the joy is in the finding... or else God would not have included so much about it in the Word.

The man when he found his pearl.
The woman when she found her coin.
The prodigal's father.
The Canaan woman praying for her daughter.
The neighbor knocking and knocking for bread.
The widow and the unjust judge.
The shepherd with the one lost sheep.


Paul said the goal was to FINISH the race, not just do the race.

He also included lots of scripture instructing us to "find", not just enjoy the search:

wisdom
knowledge
hidden treasures
peace
Him
life
rest

There is some truth to this, but I do find a lot of joy in the searching.

~Jim

“Man is not the centre. God does not exist for the sake of man. “​

~C.S. Lewis, The Problem of Pain​

 

[Simon_Templar]

I was raised non-denominational charismatic from birth. I was dedicated in a non-denom charismatic Church, and was an active member of the same group until about 2-3 years ago.

My parents had been in the Lutheran Church, and then got born again and baptized in the Holy Spirit and eventually they left the Lutheran Church because of disagreement over infant baptism. They then went AOG, and eventually left that doing Church at home for a while before getting involved with a non-denom group related to Daystar ministries.

They helped found the Church that I grew up in, and in my teen years my dad who had been the head elder, replaced the pastor who retired.
After a few years there was a difference of vision in that church which lead to a small break up.

My dad continued as the pastor of the main offshoot church until about 2-3 years ago there was another break up, which resulted from a coup among the leadership.

The basic attitude that we had as a Church, including me, was that we had the truth and even when there was little to no doctrinal difference between us and other Churches, we generally viewed ourselves as a superior Church because we had better worship and more free, Spirit-filled worship.

Towards the end, I had begun to be very restless and dissatisfied for several reasons.
#1 it really began to seem to me that our Church was totally isolated and served no real purpose in the community. We viewed pretty much all the other churches as lesser and outsiders. We doubted the faith of anyone we didn't see as being on our level of spirituality and worship.
#2. Our emphasis on singing as worship seemed to me not to match up well with Scripture which talked about worship in terms of sacrifice, and helping the poor and such things.
#3. I was really dissatisfied with the lack of sacredness in our worship and really in everything we did.
#4. More and more through studying scripture and our doctrinal positions I was coming to the realizations that there were big holes and there were many scripture references that simply could not be adequetly explained by the doctrines we taught and believed.
Also, the things we said in Church and claimed to believe, often times didn't match up with the reality of our lives.

Loyalty to my dad as the pastor was pretty much the only reason I was remaining in the Church so when he was ousted, I left and started looking.
At first I started going to a larger, more pentecostal, maybe a little more WoF flavor Church in the area that was more active in the community.

But, a number of chances had occured that started me looking into the history of the Church, and what the Church really originally believed, and did.

In my church upbringing, we had always believed that we did Church as it was originally done, we often claimed to be living the new testament Church, and we believed that the Church had basically gone astray shortly after the apostles and not returned really until the last couple hundred years (and of course we were the pinnacle of that return).
I didn't know anything about the actual history of the Church, or that there even were writings from Christians at the time of the apostles and shortly after.

God lead me through a series of conversations to begin researching some of the "traditional" doctrines that I had been taught were simply later inventions. I began by studying baptism in scripture (completely from scripture itself, not from any outside source) based on the question of infant baptism.

I didn't come to any conclusion about infant baptism as there is simply no clear statement one way or the other, but I was convinced from the scriptures that the understanding of baptism that I had been given was wrong.

That was just an example, because it happened to be the first step I took. from there I began to read more and study more and eventually I found myself seriously investigating the Orthodox Church.

There were things in both the Orthodox and the Catholic Churches that I wasn't prepared to deal with, but I eventually found out that there were still conservative, orthodox Anglicans around and I found one locally and so I became an Anglican.

I have remained evangelical, and charismatic (as many Anglicans are), but I have also have some strong anglo-catholic leanings as well.

I don't remember a time in my life when I wasn't a Christian, when I didn't believe in Jesus Christ and acknowledge him as Lord. Yet honestly, the last few years have been an awakening and brought me into a new depth of faith that was beyond even my thoughts before.