Co-Redeemer?

[StTherese]

So says James, Jesus' brother. Not Jesus.

Are you implying that makes this a false statement? Is the Bible not the inspired word of God???

 

[Benedicta00]

So says James, Jesus' brother. Not Jesus.

what?

what?!? You just lost what ever creditbilty you had.

You think like Luther don't you? James is be seen as "the epistle of straw."

Well I ahve to ask.. on who's authority do both of you speak?

and you make little sense becuase the verse that you used to contradict James wasn't Jesus speaking either but Paul... but on the other hand I know how you all exhult Paul over even Christ's words.

"He who says, 'Lord Lord' will not enter the Kingdom, but he who deos the will of my Father... I will say depart from me, I never knew you."





.

 

[sunlover1]

Faith with out works is dead. .

Amen, faith without works is dead.

But the works have nothing to do with
our salvation.
The works are a natural fruit of our transformation.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith;
and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

 

[StTherese]

Amen, faith without works is dead.

But the works have nothing to do with
our salvation.
The works are a natural fruit of our transformation.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith;
and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Does faith have anything to do with our salvation?

 

[Benedicta00]

Amen, faith without works is dead.

But the works have nothing to do with
our salvation.
The works are a natural fruit of our transformation.

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith;
and that not of yourselves:
it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Where in that do you read that works are just a by product?

We are saved neither by works or faith but grace and our salvation is manifested through both faith and works. Not works, not faith alone but BOTH.

.

 

[StTherese]

Where in that do you read that works are just a by product?

We are saved neither by works or faith but grace and our salvation is manifested through both faith and works. Not works, not faith alone but BOTH.

.

Exactly!!!!

 

[sunlover1]

Where in that do you read that works are just a by product?

I don't.
I posted the verse because it shows
How we're saved by grace
and not by works
(lest any man boast)
God did it all.

We are saved neither by works or faith but grace and our salvation is manifested through both faith and works. Not works, not faith alone but BOTH.

No, our works don't save us.
That's what the verse said.

 

[StTherese]

The works are a natural fruit of our transformation

So how exactly are we transformed?

 

[sunlover1]

So how exactly are we transformed?

Do you have a Bible program on your
pc?

 

[Benedicta00]

I don't.
I posted the verse because it shows
How we're saved by grace
and not by works
(lest any man boast)
God did it all.


No, our works don't save us.
That's what the verse said.

You have to make the whole bible jive with itself. Unles you think like that othe poster who thinks we can just blow off what ever books contradict what we think, like Luther did.

We read in James that faith with out works is dead. We read that works alone can't save. We never read that faith alone saves, that word 'alone' was added in by none other then Luther.

So put all this togther and what do we have? That by the grace of Jesus Christ opeing the gates of mercy, we are redeemed, joined back to God and through our faith in Him and in His work AND through our good works we do unto the Lord, we will be saved in the end when we die and go on to be with the Lord.

We can't be saved with faith alone, we can't be saved with works alone but we are saved, not redeemed but saved, as in when we die we go on to be with the Lord, through both faith and works. grace is what redeems and faith and works is what saves.
.

 

[sunlover1]

You have to make the whole bible jive with itself. Unles you think like that othe poster who thinks we can just blow off what ever books contradict what we think, like Luther did.

Right, it does all jive.
Not by works like it said.
We can't change those words right?

The rest of the verses you're speaking
of are talking of the natural outcome
of our being new creations in Christ.

Once we have God in us,
we will act more like Jesus,
naturally.

It's the manifestation of the Spirit of
God in us.

 

[sunlover1]

Do you have a Bible program on your
pc?

If you have Bible software on your
pc, I will show you some searches
you can do on this.

sunlover

 

[IamAdopted]

So how exactly are we transformed?

By Power of the Holy Spirit..It is Christ at work in us.. We are to submit all we are or have unto the Lord..He is the one who declares us righteous. Our works is to be more Christ like.. Taking Gods word and walking it out here on earth. Not to be saved but because we are saved.. It is Christ who saves us.. It is us that are to read His word and conform to His word.. So that in doing this those without Christ can see our lives and glorify our Father in Heaven.. We look to Jesus the Author and finisher of our Faith. As we submit to His word He will cause growth in our life..

 

[Mobiosity]

Are you implying that makes this a false statement? Is the Bible not the inspired word of God???

I'm saying that James, Jesus' brother wrote that, Jesus didn't. The bible is the inspired word of God and our good works are inspired by our indwellng by the Holy Spirit. We do good because we want to, we have to like we have to breathe. If I were saved by my faith in Jesus Christ's sacrifice for me and did nothing else for the rest of my life, I'd be just as saved as if I went to the streets of Calcutta and gave everything I had to the poor. If I were on my death bed and received Christ there and one second later, died, I'd be just as saved; just as sure of getting into Heaven. Jesus sacrifice and my faith in God is sufficient.

 

[lionroar0]

But that's not the same as cooperating
in someone elses redemption.

Without the shedding of blood there
is no remission of sin.

No debate, but someone has to bring them the gospel.

Some elses redemption does not happen with out the delivery of the Gospel.

Jesus is the only one who shed the Blood.

No debate there but someone has to deliver the messege.

Mary was a blessed woman, but not
our redeemer.
Jesus did that by Himself.

No debate.

Peace

 

[lionroar0]

You got it !!!!!!!!!

I have no idea what you are agreeing. IF you are agreeing that the Spirit does it and that the flesh is evil then you are agreeing with the ancient heresy of gnosticism.


Peace

 

[Mobiosity]

I have no idea what you are agreeing. IF you are agreeing that the Spirit does it and that the flesh is evil then you are agreeing with the ancient heresy of gnosticism.


Peace

Actually gnostics believe that the god that created the earth wasn't God. I agree that the flesh can't earn salvation. You can't do anything on your own to earn your way into Heaven. Your faith in the Almighty God gets you into Heaven, Jesus sacrifice gets you into Heaven. Good acts are the result of your salvation, not the other way around.

 

[Benedicta00]

I'm saying that James, Jesus' brother wrote that, Jesus didn't .

So? Jesus cousin wrote it? So what?

Okay, now back to the question, are you sayig we can pick out books in the canon and just blow them off if we want? .

 

[Benedicta00]

Actually gnostics believe that the god that created the earth wasn't God. I agree that the flesh can't earn salvation. You can't do anything on your own to earn your way into Heaven. Your faith in the Almighty God gets you into Heaven, Jesus sacrifice gets you into Heaven. Good acts are the result of your salvation, not the other way around.

gnostics also believes that all material matter is evil (the world) and ppl are evil, that only what is spiritual can be good..

 

[Benedicta00]

Right, it does all jive.
Not by works like it said.
We can't change those words right?

The rest of the verses you're speaking
of are talking of the natural outcome
of our being new creations in Christ.

Once we have God in us,
we will act more like Jesus,
naturally.

It's the manifestation of the Spirit of
God in us.

But show me where it teaches a 'saved' person will be on auto poilet doing good works?

And define what you think good works are anyway?

.