Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Like all sects you are majoring..
I like that phrase "the obligation to perform the act passed away."The prediction they made was fulfilled so the obligation to perform the act passed away.
"He TAKES AWAY the first to establish the second" Heb 10.
Agreed and fulfilling animal-sacrifice predictions - takes away the obligation to keep performing them... and does not delete/abolish prescriptive commands like "do not take God's name in vain".
Only predictive laws can be fulfilled - by doing that which they predict.
So notice that Adam and Eve are given the Sabbath in Eden but are NOT given animal sacrifices because sinless perfect beings are not looking for future redemption from the penalty of sins. They don't have that need - just as sinless angels in heaven do not need animal sacrifice.
I like that phrase "the obligation to perform the act passed away."
So, the list we're working on. It's basically a list of those laws you feel the obligation to perform the act has not passed away:
After Genesis 9:4 then, what is the next law that we come to that we are "obligated to perform the act"?
This groups I am working on -- are those categories of Law that forwhatever reason are no longer active.
The the ones we have so far are:
1. Laws regarding animal sacrifices and offerings
2. Civil laws that are commands "to the government" of a theocracy. So when that theocracy (government) no longer exists - they continue to 'not apply' at the individual level just as before.
As you note - these are beyond question in any case but our job is not to define "the universe of what exists" -- rather those things that end :
The Ten Commandments
Eat only clean animals -- and don't eat a diseased animal even if it is clean
Don't eat meat with blood in it
Lev 19:18 Love your neighbor as yourself
Deut 6:5 Love God with all your heart
Tithe
And all that pertains to morally right living.
I have a bigger question -- how are you doing with the list that falls in the "easy part" above??
Do you accept or reject what you have posted?
And of course "the big question" when it comes to this thread - what did you answer regarding the "3 points" as listed?
Sure, we can talk about catagories of the Law that you see as no longer active. After we have a list of the catagories,
So, the list we're working on. It's basically a list of those laws you feel the obligation to perform the act has not passed away:
The Ten Commandments
Don't murder (included in the Ten)
Eat only clean animals -- and don't eat a diseased animal even if it is clean
Don't eat meat with blood in it
Lev 19:18 Love your neighbor as yourself
Deut 6:5 Love God with all your heart
Tithe
And all that pertains to morally right living.
If you look at the details in the sources I give regarding the topic of the TEN Commandments
1. they all affirm the SDA interpretation as to what the Bible said about the TEN... every one of them. Agree on the TEN as "God gave them" and their application to all mankind from Eden to the Cross -- full agreement.
2.There is also full agreement that the Ten continue to be written on heart and mind under the New Covenant and continue to apply to all mankind
3. Where the differences come in is when those groups claim that church tradition edited the Sabbath commandment to re-point it to week-day-1 -- SDAs and many others - say that tradition was in error whereas the groups I listed , choose tradition at that dividing point.
The OP survey is unclear, imo. When you ask "I agree with point 1" you asking for me to agree that "they all affirm the SDA interpretation" or are you asking me to agree with them and "affirm the SDA interpretation"?
1. Moral laws -- define what sin is
2. Ceremonial laws - with animal sacrifice and that require a priesthood that no longer exists Heb 7.
3. Civil laws - that are commands given to the civil government of a theocracy regarding penalties for law breaking - that end when that theocratic government no longer exists.
So the question remains - can you really say something of the form "I refuse to accept the command to not take God's name in vain until I have divided the entire Bible into lists"?
And how do you "feel" about laws that apply to moral living?
Laws that define what sin is according to Paul in Rom 7 and Rom 3:19-20 or are we just trying to find out if I believe the Ten Commandments are the ones having "honor your father and mother" as the "First commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2??
If we are trying to find what I believe on that point we can just read the first two posts on this thread.
Are you still not sure if Paul and James were correct in pointing to 'the TEN' in James 2 and Eph 6:1-2?
I'm not sure what you mean by "moral living".
"Moral" is usually used to talk about Right and Wrong, Good and Evil, imo.
Are you still not sure if Paul and James were correct in pointing to 'the TEN' in James 2 and Eph 6:1-2?
Are you asking if I agree that Paul and James were pointing to the Ten only?
Or are you assuming they were pointing to the Ten only and asking if I then agree with them?
Rom 7 and Rom 3:19-20 are referring to the entire law, imo.
I assume you believe there are more Active laws than just the Ten
1. I am asking if you see them agreeing to the basic Bible detail.
2. I am glad to you have you state why you think all Bible scholarship is wrong for having that agreement if you wish.
BobRyan said: ↑
1. I am asking if you see them agreeing to the basic Bible detail.
2. I am glad to have you state why you think all Bible scholarship is wrong for having that agreement if you wish.
I see. Looking at the two that I saw details about, the Baptist Confession of Faith, the Westminster Confession of Faith,
Yes, they agree with what you wrote on all three points.
It was a term in your list where you listed the ten commandments ...
Did you see your list?
Paul says it defines what sin is - Rom 3:19-20
John says it defines what sin is - 1 John 3:4
All those Bible scholars mentioned in post #1, and #2, agree.
Paul says it includes the TEN where "the first commandment with a promise" is the one that says "honor your father and mother".
Is this "still" pretty difficult?
Are you still not sure if Paul and James were correct in pointing to 'the TEN' in James 2 and Eph 6:1-2?
Should we not let God define when His Sabbath day is?
But this I admit to you, that according to the Way which they call a sect
I think they are pointing to the entire law which includes the Ten. Does that answer your question?I am asking if you agree that "whatever else they may be thinking of" it is pretty obvious they have the TEN as the distinct unit of law that has "as the first commandment with a promise" the command to honor parents.
I keep calling this - the super easy part.
Did you already forget what you agreed to in Heb 10:4-12 regarding animal sacrifices and "He takes AWAY the first to establish the second"?
Did you already forget what you agreed to in 1 Cor 7:19 where Paul contrasts circumcision to the "Commandments of God"?
Is that now - no longer clear?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?