Churches closing due to pandemic

[Dave-W]

Never thought the struggle to worship on Sabbath would come to this...

Indeed.

 

[Tigger45]

I'll be 60 next year. That's a very surreal thought.

 

[RDKirk]

Never thought the struggle to worship on Sabbath would come to this...

Much less of a struggle than Christians in Muslim countries face.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Well its happening...churches are closing and it is kind of jolting to say the least.

Our pastor called us and talked to those in the church board for our church over closing and then texted us of the decision. The other churches in the area also seem to closing so we are going out to one of the members solar panelled place in the woods.

Perhaps they could consider streaming the sermons on Facebook live. That’s what my church is doing.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Our city and even our county - has reported no cases of the virus so our church is open - however we have neighboring counties where SDA churches are closed.

Zoom.com has a free feature for teleconferencing up to 100 people for up to 40 min. They can do up to 100 people for unlimited time if you pay a 15$/month license fee.

Facebook live is free. I’m not sure if there’s a limit on viewers tho.

 

[Dave-W]

I'll be 60 next year. That's a very surreal thought.

LOL!!! I turn 65 this coming Shabbat.

 

[Dave-W]

Never thought the struggle to worship on Sabbath would come to this...

Here is what we did this past sabbath. Dennis our congregational leader live streamed from his home on FB. I am not a FB member nor have i ever been so i had to wait until today to hear the Audio part of it. I find his comments on the Shelter in place pandemic orders to be interesting. He said this may be the first time in our lifetimes when resting on the Sabbath was being enforced by the government.

Here is a link to the audio portion:
Encouragement and Ramblings from Dennis during the national COVID crisis | Son of David Congregation

 

[Dave-W]

What will be interesting is that i am scheduled to be the main speaker next Shabbat - my birthday. Not sure how that is going to play out. But apparently i have to do the Torah portion Drash as well as the message. That’s ok as my topic flows from the opening phrase of the Torah portion.

 

[Gary K]

What will be interesting is that i am scheduled to be the main speaker next Shabbat - my birthday. Not sure how that is going to play out. But apparently i have to do the Torah portion Drash as well as the message. That’s ok as my topic flows from the opening phrase of the Torah portion.

Dave,

What is Drash? I've never heard/read the term before?

 

[Dave-W]

Dave,
What is Drash? I've never heard/read the term before?

LOL!!! Sorry.

It is a Hebrew term for a teaching.

The Torah (5 books of Moses) is broken up into several portions and each portion has a corresponding reading from the Hebrew prophets. Us Messianics have also added New Covenant readings as well (of course). So we look for a common theme across the different readings and make a brief teaching (drash) from those readings. In our congregation it is short, in the 5-7 minute range.

 

[Gary K]

LOL!!! Sorry.

It is a Hebrew term for a teaching.

The Torah (5 books of Moses) is broken up into several portions and each portion has a corresponding reading from the Hebrew prophets. Us Messianics have also added New Covenant readings as well (of course). So we look for a common theme across the different readings and make a brief teaching (drash) from those readings. In our congregation it is short, in the 5-7 minute range.

No need to apologize. I just hadn't been exposed to the term before. Thanks for the explanation as I have now learned one more new concept today. That's always a plus.

 

[Gary K]

Our city and even our county - has reported no cases of the virus so our church is open - however we have neighboring counties where SDA churches are closed.

Zoom.com has a free feature for teleconferencing up to 100 people for up to 40 min. They can do up to 100 people for unlimited time if you pay a 15$/month license fee.

Bob,

I wouldn't trust the "no cases" data.

Remember Typhoid Mary? It's been proven that there are coronavirus carriers that never become symptomatic so therefore have a very low probability of ever being tested. Thus they can be actively spreading the disease and never counted in the statistics. On top of that the very low percentage of the population that has been tested means that only a very small percentage of actual cases have been detected.

As far as I know tests have only been available in the county where I live for about a week, and then they are only testing those who are symptomatic, and I live in a state that has one ofthe highest number of cases and fatalities.

 

[RDKirk]

I've grown dubious of the hyped value of testing.

From what I understand, most people (that is, we working-class stiffs) can't get tested unless we are already showing symptoms. That means testing will not discover those who are walking around for up to two weeks as asymptomatic carriers.

Then if a person is tested after beginning to show symptoms, it takes from one to two weeks to get the results back (apparently there are testing procedures that provide results much more quickly, but that is apparently also not for working stiffs). Well, one to two weeks after showing symptoms, the sickness will have already revealed what it is by additional symptoms.

So I'm not sure what testing is going to do for us, except for those who have the money or position to get the accelerated testing procedure.

 

[BobRyan]

Bob,

I wouldn't trust the "no cases" data.

Remember Typhoid Mary? It's been proven that there are coronavirus carriers that never become symptomatic so therefore have a very low probability of ever being tested. Thus they can be actively spreading the disease and never counted in the statistics. On top of that the very low percentage of the population that has been tested means that only a very small percentage of actual cases have been detected.

As far as I know tests have only been available in the county where I live for about a week, and then they are only testing those who are symptomatic, and I live in a state that has one ofthe highest number of cases and fatalities.

Do you see a lot of areas reporting "no cases"?

 

[Gary K]

I've grown dubious of the hyped value of testing.

From what I understand, most people (that is, we working-class stiffs) can't get tested unless we are already showing symptoms. That means testing will not discover those who are walking around for up to two weeks as asymptomatic carriers.

Then if a person is tested after beginning to show symptoms, it takes from one to two weeks to get the results back (apparently there are testing procedures that provide results much more quickly, but that is apparently also not for working stiffs). Well, one to two weeks after showing symptoms, the sickness will have already revealed what it is by additional symptoms.

So I'm not sure what testing is going to do for us, except for those who have the money or position to get the accelerated testing procedure.

I agree on the testing for the common man. In fact, that has been my experience with it. My MIL was really sick and had several of the listed coronavirus symptoms. We call the local hospital to get them to test her and they refused. Their reasoning? There were no reported cases in our county at that time. Well, how can there be any cases when they refused to test for the virus? My MIL got over whatever it was she had, but the fact that she was refused testing, and she's in her 80s, was not very reassuring.

 

[Gary K]

Do you see a lot of areas reporting "no cases"?

I've seen reports from states that had only fewer than 10 reported cases so as the average state has a lot more than 10 counties there are quite a few counties with 0 reported cases at the time of the reports I read.

Testing has been really slow in a lot of areas. Whether or not where you live that's true or not I have no idea. I just know it has been almost impossible to get tested where I live, and I've read a lot of online stories from around the country that leads me to think it is not an uncommon occurrence to be turned down when requesting testing.

I know that has been improved on some, but how much and whether that is true for most geographical areas I have no idea. All I can say is what I've seen and heard from my own and other people's experiences where I live and from what I've read online from news reports.

I do know that since testing has become more widely available the number of reported cases in the US has skyrocketed. If testing is very slow the number of cases is guaranteed to be low. And, from some of the reporting I've read when people report symptoms to the medical establishment in a lot of areas they just tell the people to go home and self-quarantine themselves without any testing. And they tell them to just quarantine themselves for 7 days. If those people have the virus that just guarantees the spread of the virus for in mild cases the symptoms may go away in that time but the patients will still be able to spread the virus. In fact, the 14 day quarantine itself is far too short. It's been proven that the coronavirus can be spread for up to 37 days after becoming infected before a person displays any symptoms. And others are communicating the disease for months and never become symptomatic.

 

[RDKirk]

I've seen reports from states that had only fewer than 10 reported cases so as the average state has a lot more than 10 counties there are quite a few counties with 0 reported cases at the time of the reports I read.

Testing has been really slow in a lot of areas. Whether or not where you live that's true or not I have no idea. I just know it has been almost impossible to get tested where I live, and I've read a lot of online stories from around the country that leads me to think it is not an uncommon occurrence to be turned down when requesting testing.

I know that has been improved on some, but how much and whether that is true for most geographical areas I have no idea. All I can say is what I've seen and heard from my own and other people's experiences where I live and from what I've read online from news reports.

I do know that since testing has become more widely available the number of reported cases in the US has skyrocketed. If testing is very slow the number of cases is guaranteed to be low. And, from some of the reporting I've read when people report symptoms to the medical establishment in a lot of areas they just tell the people to go home and self-quarantine themselves without any testing. And they tell them to just quarantine themselves for 7 days. If those people have the virus that just guarantees the spread of the virus for in mild cases the symptoms may go away in that time but the patients will still be able to spread the virus. In fact, the 14 day quarantine itself is far too short. It's been proven that the coronavirus can be spread for up to 37 days after becoming infected before a person displays any symptoms. And others are communicating the disease for months and never become symptomatic.

I think you meant to say, or perhaps it should be said in addition, that a person may be infectious for up to 37 days after a "mild" case seems to have resolved itself.

Also, btw, "mild' and "moderate" with covid-19 is relative to "severe" and "critical" for covid-19.

Compared to a cold or ordinary flu, a "moderate" case of covid-19 is equal to a severe case of the flu...people are sick as dogs with a "moderate" case of covid-19 and should be seeing a doctor. A "severe" case requires hospitalization, and a "critical" case means organs are shutting down.

 

[Gary K]

I think you meant to say, or perhaps it should be said in addition, that a person may be infectious for up to 37 days after a "mild" case seems to have resolved itself.

Also, btw, "mild' and "moderate" with covid-19 is relative to "severe" and "critical" for covid-19.

Compared to a cold or ordinary flu, a "moderate" case of covid-19 is equal to a severe case of the flu...people are sick as dogs with a "moderate" case of covid-19 and should be seeing a doctor. A "severe" case requires hospitalization, and a "critical" case means organs are shutting down.

The reports I've read say the coronavirus has an incubation period up to 37 days after first being infected without showing symptoms. So, any screening that relies on taking people's temperature and quarantining for 14 days is bound to let through a lot of infected people through.

As to people who have "had" coronavirus and gotten better it's been shown that they can become reinfected many days later. That's one reason things got out of control for the Chinese. They didn't realize that for quite a while. When they did they kept patients they thought had recovered, and brought back a lot of others and retested and quarantined them for quite a while. There was something about a secondary infection of something called Z, but my memory is kinda hazy on that.

As to the second sentence I bolded I think you meant: Also, btw, "mild' and "moderate" with covid-19 is relative to "severe" and "critical" for the flu. I'm not sure about that though as I have read reports of people who were infected and barely got sick at all. There was a story about a couple in which the man got it and his wife didn't on one of those cruise ships and he didn't get very sick at all. It was mainly a runny nose and slight cough if I remember correctly. The results of infection with the coronavirus can be anywhere from zero symptoms to death.

An Italian scientist came out within the last couple of days and said that almost 100% of the deaths in Italy have been caused by the underlying health issues and not the coronavirus.

 

[BobRyan]

I've grown dubious of the hyped value of testing.

From what I understand, most people (that is, we working-class stiffs) can't get tested unless we are already showing symptoms. That means testing will not discover those who are walking around for up to two weeks as asymptomatic carriers.

Then if a person is tested after beginning to show symptoms, it takes from one to two weeks to get the results back (apparently there are testing procedures that provide results much more quickly, but that is apparently also not for working stiffs). Well, one to two weeks after showing symptoms, the sickness will have already revealed what it is by additional symptoms.

So I'm not sure what testing is going to do for us, except for those who have the money or position to get the accelerated testing procedure.

When did we ever have a reliable system for testing people for the flu - who had no symptoms of having the flu just to see how many with the virus would later exhibit symptoms? Has that ever even been "a thing"?

 

[RDKirk]

When did we ever have a reliable system for testing people for the flu - who had no symptoms of having the flu just to see how many with the virus would later exhibit symptoms? Has that ever even been "a thing"?

When dealing with a disease that has taken down the medical systems of two industrialized nations.