Christians Have an Image Problem

[Gregory Thompson]

You know, if you say your God is the true God of Creation and everyone else is worshiping demons, this can't help but come off as arrogant and hateful.

People nowadays are so sensitive that even if you don't say it bluntly, they pull out the meaning of what is implied.

Being lukewarm people pleasers just weakens the church. However, hardening the heart and becoming prideful harms the church even more.

The church is pretty divided, so the solution is probably something else. Creating an image for all Christians is impossible when there are too many independent voices speaking for it.

 

[stevevw]

I don't think anyone would care what we believed if we embodied the fruit of the Spirit. Our greatest witness is not our words but our way. If that is right, then there's no good reason why the fruit of the Spirit would fail to secure the good will of most people.

I agree that our greatest witness is our way and not our words. I think the discrepancy between the words and the way is the problem that has become hard to tell what is the way.

Because there is no clear destinction today between words and lived examples or lived reality. Its sort of like white noise with many different words and narratives all competing for the true way.

The culture around Christ thought He was bringing a new way. A new earthly Kingdom not too dissimilar to modern ideas of a new earthly social justice utopia.

I think it can be hard to tell what are the fruits of the spirit or not. It cannot be good works alone as even a Godless world can do good works.

 

[public hermit]

I agree that our greatest witness is our way and not our words. I think the discrepancy between the words and the way is the problem that has become hard to tell what is the way.

Because there is no clear destinction today between words and lived examples or lived reality. Its sort of like white noise with many different words and narratives all competing for the true way.

The culture around Christ thought He was bringing a new way. A new earthly Kingdom not too dissimilar to modern ideas of a new earthly social justice utopia.

I think it can be hard to tell what are the fruits of the spirit or not. It cannot be good works alone as even a Godless world can do good works.

Well, it's still worth a try. I don't think it's as hard as people seem to think. It is hard, but love is not impossible. It is who we are if everything else falls away. The only thing in our way is our own feelings.

 

[stevevw]

You know, if you say your God is the true God of Creation and everyone else is worshiping demons, this can't help but come off as arrogant and hateful.

People nowadays are so sensitive that even if you don't say it bluntly, they pull out the meaning of what is implied.

I think there has been an evolution of thought over recent decades that coincides with the transition for a worldview that at least held to some biblical ideas and welcomed God as a factor in how we ordered ourselves and the world. To a more secular one.

We can see the evolution where the Christian God became just one of many beliefs and worldviews under a more inclusive and diverse world. Then as biblical teachings conflicted with the growing secular worldview and norms it was seen as a threat and even hateful to this new worldview and order.

No longer could we say the biblical God was the God of our world and alternative ideas and beliefs were made equal. Sort of opening the door for a spiritual battle.

This has coincided with the idea of the political becoming the personal. Now its not just about someones opinion or belief but the opposing worldviews are a personal threat. Which is more or less making this a battle of world orders and who is God of that order or metaphysical reality.

Which I think as you say fundementally makes it a spiritual battle as well.

 

[stevevw]

Well, it's still worth a try. I don't think it's as hard as people seem to think. It is hard, but love is not impossible. It is who we are if everything else falls away. The only thing in our way is our own feelings.

Yes I think so. Anything done or said is nothing without that love as Christ exampled. I think that is the destinguishing factor. I think its a radical but hard idea to implement today.

To love your enemies and even be willing to sacrifice your own life for them. But I think it is this disposition that we can aim for that will shine and expose evil and turn people to God.

But it is also one that will be a thorn in the side of those who oppose God. So I think its a double edged sword that can cut both ways. It will turn people to God seeing Christs love and purity. But also be hated because this also means repenting and submitting to God and letting go of the self as god.

 

[timothyu]

The more people pursue self- interest the further from God they get no matter how people try to justify it

 

[Richard T]

I have to admit that there is an image problem. Too much focus on money by many ministers/churches. Some are like a modern replica of Eli's sons. Overcharging for services, being immoral, and even having a no discipline of their own children. God has been working to fix this.

There are differences in hate too. If the church is doing to the things of God in love and compassion, standing up against the world then that is biblical and the church is going great. However, if the hate and contempt is because of hypocrisy and poor conduct, then who can argue with that?
The more recent political challenge that the church faces is based on their support for Trump. Here it is a mixed bag. Sometimes Trump accomplishes Godly things, but often the means, methods and policies are not seen as Christian by many. So this sort of political perception of Trump and others puts the church on a path of dissension with very the people it seeks to win over. So a tough world out there for America.

Worldwide, I think the amount of contempt for the church varies. Some nations are far more supportive of their churches, others have no place for Christianity at all.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

"People who identified as Christians described Christians as:

1. Giving — 57 percent
2. Compassionate — 56 percent
3. Loving — 55 percent
4. Respectful — 50 percent
5. Friendly — 49 percent
6. Honest — 45 percent
7. Humble — 42 percent
8. Sharing — 42 percent
9. Truthful — 40 percent
10. Judgemental — 19 percent

Humble? Truthful? Loving? Compassionate? Of course there are many such Christian but my experience, even as one of them, is pretty light on at least these four.

 

[ViaCrucis]

The idea that if a non-Christian doesn't like me or doesn't like something I do, then I must be doing the right thing; or the inverse (if a non-Christian likes me or likes something I do, then I must be doing the wrong thing) is pretty bad. That's a pretty bad mindset to have. There's no sugar-coating it, that's what people do when they don't want to take accountability for themselves but still pat themselves on the back.

That's pretty gross, and pretty anti-Christian behavior. That's worldliness.

Christ said to be light and salt, and that our good works should shine before men so that they might see them and praise God.

Being a jerk isn't being light or salt, it's not good work. And patting oneself on the back after being a complete jerk to people and then saying "The unbelievers don't like me, so I must be holy" is just so incredibly gross and wrong.

Be honest.
Be kind.
Love your neighbor.
Love your enemy.
If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn and offer the left.
If someone curses you, bless them.
If someone persecutes you, pray for them.

This is Christianity 101.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[DragonFox91]

I think it's fair we don't want to listen to everything they say about us, but one I've learned is not to be so offended when you hear "A real Christian wouldn't act like that." Take that to heart when you hear that.

But usually what they mean when they say don't like the Christian image is how we vote

 

[timothyu]

A “real”Christian does not follow.religion but a way of life (that is of course Christian is defined as a follower of the Will of Jesus rather than some church)

 

[PloverWing]

A “real”Christian does not follow.religion but a way of life (that is of course Christian is defined as a follower of the Will of Jesus rather than some church)

A religion is a way of life. What distinction do you have in mind?

 

[Aaron112]

To love your enemies and even be willing to sacrifice your own life for them. But I think it is this disposition that we can aim for that will shine and expose evil and turn people to God.

God's Word says His children are light(s) in the world; but the world hates the light because it's actions-deeds-works are evil and they do not want to be exposed. Thus cannot expect the light to turn people to God.

 

[Aaron112]

I think this disparity between how we see ourselves and how others see us must pose a barrier to drawing other people to the faith. I think this is worthy of discussion here. Thoughts?

Refresh my memory - as far as I've read in the past, it is not permitted here (on any forum perhaps) to try to get anyone closer to God ?

 

[Daniel Carlton]

This has probably been the church leaderships biggest error: trying to “look good” to those who are in darkness and abandoning faithfully obeying Gods word.

Trying to keep one foot in the bible and one foot in the world. And has brought on an expected spiritual catastrophe. Instead we should renounce the world and walk after Christ with no reservations.

 

[timothyu]

A religion is a way of life. What distinction do you have in mind?

God’s Will is we serve each other in need. Man’s will is we serve the religion, as the Sanhedrin also did

 

[Aaron112]

This has probably been the church leaderships biggest error: trying to “look good” to those who are in darkness and abandoning faithfully obeying Gods word.

Is there any known person or group that did recently faithfully obey God's Word , even partly , without any guile or deception or worldly purpose (of gain or popularity) ?

 

[Aaron112]

I think it can be hard to tell what are the fruits of the spirit or not. It cannot be good works alone as even a Godless world can do good works.

It seems on the internet/in life/media/ it is "easy" to say "fruit(/s) of the spirit" and use that as an argument for or against something/anything.
It seems it is rare though, to see and understand the fruit of the spirit in truth. Something else is wrongly used instead, to seem to represent something good or right without actually even knowing what is good or right with God.

 

[Yarddog]

"A new study published by Ipsos in partnership with The Episcopal Church as part of its Jesus in America survey shows that Christians in America have a perception problem." The article Christians say Christians are loving. Other people don't, survey says indicates Christians see themselves much more favorably than they are seen by non-Christians.

"People who identified as Christians described Christians as:

1. Giving — 57 percent
2. Compassionate — 56 percent
3. Loving — 55 percent
4. Respectful — 50 percent
5. Friendly — 49 percent
6. Honest — 45 percent
7. Humble — 42 percent
8. Sharing — 42 percent
9. Truthful — 40 percent
10. Judgemental — 19 percent

People identifying with other religions described Christians as:

1. Judgemental — 37 percent
2. Hypocritical — 36 percent
3. Self-righteous — 33 percent
4. Arrogant — 21 percent
5. Friendly — 20 percent
6. Giving — 18 percent
7. Unforgiving — 16 percent
8. Disrespectful — 16 percent
9. Compassionate — 15 percent
10. Loving — 15 percent

People identifying as not religious described Christians as:

1. Hypocritical — 55 percent
2. Judgemental — 54 percent
3. Self-Righteous — 50 percent
4. Arrogant — 36 percent
5. Unforgiving — 23 percent
6. Selfish — 23 percent
7. Disrespectful — 19 percent
8. Giving — 16 percent
9. Friendly — 15 percent
10. Compassionate — 12 percent"

I think this disparity between how we see ourselves and how others see us must pose a barrier to drawing other people to the faith. I think this is worthy of discussion here. Thoughts?

(I wasn't sure the proper place for posting this so I invite Moderator to move it if it fits better elsewhere).

It's always harder to examine yourself than to examine others.

 

[Daniel Carlton]

Is there any known person or group that did recently faithfully obey God's Word , even partly , without any guile or deception or worldly purpose (of gain or popularity) ?

Not recently but the Puritans maybe? They saw the Church of England was corrupted by Rome and would not resolve the corruption. So they packed up everything and moved to a different country.