Christians are not commanded to observe the seventh day.

BobRyan · Dec 17, 2014

BobRyan said:
MoreCoffee said:

Seems to me that Genesis chapter two verses one, two, and three has God bless and hallow the seventh day in the vicinity of Eden. If it is a twenty four hour period that God hallowed it would be twenty four hours in Eden. In Hawaii, and New Zealand the evening and the morning would be at very different times, possibly outside of the hours of the seventh day in Eden.

Click to expand...

Apparently Christ knew what day it was... when He kept it.

And in Ex 16 God "still knew" when He said "tomorrow is the Sabbath"

So they had that whole - manna thing reminding them exactly what day it was.

And now - we have the Jews and the Christians both in agreement on what day is the 7th and what day is the first.

No wonder all those sources -- Catholic, Baptist, Westminster, R.C Sproul agree on Sunday as week-day one and Saturday as the seventh day.

That can't be good for those who want to insert confusion into Bible topics that are obvious and simple even across denominations.

MoreCoffee said:
That'd be because the Lord was "made under the Law" (gal 4:4). The Law came 430 years after Abraham (Gal 3:17).

So then Christ knew exactly what day of the week the Seventh day was - the Sabbath.

And in Ex 20:11 and in Gen 2:1-3 we are told that at creation week that day was "sanctified and made holy" and in Ex 20:11 it is also called the Sabbath.

It is God that says in Ex 20:11 that his actions in Genesis 2- make the weekly Sabbath.

in Christ,

Bob

MoreCoffee · Dec 17, 2014

Genesis 2:1-3 is alluded to in Exodus 20:8-11 yet Genesis 2:1-3 does not command seventh day observance nor does it set up a weekly cycle to be repeated forever. Genesis 1:1-2:3 sets up a unique seven days, six of which were creation days, and one of which was a rest from the work of creation and it was the one day of rest that was hallowed by God. The setting aside of a weekly cycle of seven days with the seventh as Sabbath had to await the giving of the commandments at mount Sinai.

AndOne · Dec 17, 2014

BobRyan said:
All the sources listed in this post #6

Agree that the Sabbath commandment as God gave it - was Saturday - the seventh day of the week.

And they admit that what we call Sunday is the "First day of the week' -- "week day 1"

(And that includes the Catholic sources listed)

Pretty hard to miss that point.

I'm not sure exactly what the point is though since none of them mandate sabbath worship and clearly explain why. Seems like you are cherry picking your sources without giving them due process.

BobRyan · Dec 17, 2014

BobRyan said:
All the sources listed in this post #6

Agree that the Sabbath commandment as God gave it - was Saturday - the seventh day of the week.

And they admit that what we call Sunday is the "First day of the week' -- "week day 1"

(And that includes the Catholic sources listed)

Pretty hard to miss that point.

BobRyan said:
Sabbath - Saturday

[FONT=&quot]page 243[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]

"nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lord's day From Saturday to Sunday. We know of the change only from the tradition of the Church - a fact handed down to us...that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many Non-Catholics, who say that they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and Yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lord's day on the say-so of the Catholic church"

Click to expand...

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]. (from "The Faith Explained" page 243.))[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
"we know that in the o.t it was the seventh day of the week - the Sabbath day - which was observed as the Lord's day. that was the law as God gave it...'remember to keep holy the Sabbath day.. the early Christian church determined as the Lord's day the first day of the week. That the church had the right to make such a law is evident...[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The reason for changing the Lord's day from Saturday to Sunday lies in the fact that to the Christian church the first day of the week had been made double holy...[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lord's day from Saturday to Sunday..that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many non-Catholic who say they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lord's day on the say-so of the Catholic church[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]=====================================================================[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]As R.C Sproul and even the Baptist Confession of Faith proves the 4th commandment as given by God in the actual Bible - points to Saturday.

NONE of those authors goes around arguing that the Israel at Sinai - were all "keeping Sunday".

They all admit that the Bible Sabbath is the 7th day - Saturday and Sunday is the FIRST day of the week. Impossible to miss.

But beyond this - a recent video shows a Baptist Pastor agreeing with the Catholic Church claim that the 4th Commandment has been changed by man - and yet also agreeing with the Baptist Confession of Faith - not only about the change of the 4th commandment - but also the fact that the TEN commandments were given to mankind in Eden.
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

So also does the Baptist Confession of Faith agree with this idea that the Bible Sabbath as given by God is not Sunday.

Quote:
22.7 As it is the law of nature that a portion of time by God's appointment should be set apart for the worship of God, so in his Word he has given a positive, moral, and perpetual commandment, binding all people in all ages. In particular he has appointed one day in seven as a Sabbath to be kept holy to him.1 From the beginning of the world to the resurrection of Christ this was the last day of the week, but from the resurrection of Christ it was changed to the first day of the week which is called the Lord's Day. This is to be continued to the end of the world as the Christian Sabbath, the observation of the last day of the week being abolished.2[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot](1) Gen 2:3; Exo 20:8-11; Mar 2:27-28; Rev 1:10
(2) Joh 20:1; Act 2:1; 20:7; 1Co 16:1; Rev 1:10; Col 2:16-17 [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]

They admit that a CHANGE was made in what the BIBLE states to be the Sabbath day - Saturday. Almost every Baptist on this board today - knows that the Bible Sabbath is Saturday.

The Change was done via man-made tradition NOT a "Commandment" in either NT or OT to "make the change of God's Law".

Rather we have Mark 7 flatly forbidding man-made-traditions the privilege of editing the Law of God.

Each time you seek to make a point here - it is found to be half-true.

Why do that as if you don't think I "will notice"???

We both know that I will indeed notice and will point to the flaw in your argument.

--- at the risk of repeating myself -- we do this "again" only this time with Spurgeon's own edit of the Baptist Confession of Faith and the fact that in the actual BIBLE the Sabbath is the SEVENTH day of the week - Saturday not the FIRST day of the week - SUNDAY.

Quote:
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]As it is the law of nature that in general a proportion of time, by God's appointment, should be set apart for the worship of God, so He has given in His Word a positive, moral and perpetual commandment, binding upon all men, in all ages to this effect. He has particularly appointed one day in seven for a Sabbath to be kept holy for Him. From the beginning of the world to the resurrection of Christ this was the last day of the week, and from the resurrection of Christ it was changed to the first day of the week and called the Lord's Day. This is to be continued until the end of the world as the Christian Sabbath, the observation of the last day of the week having been abolished. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]

=================================

My guess is that if pastor Reggie also saw this next video giving RCC sources on the non-Bible "Change" to the Sabbath - he would feel somewhat confirmed in his idea that man-made tradition should not be allowed to replace the Word of God.

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]========================================================[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]as The Catholic church fully endorses the Sabbath commandment as edited by the Catholic Church" vs "the Catholic church fully endorsed the Sabbath commandment as worded by God at Sinai"[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] . [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The Faith Explained[/FONT][FONT=&quot] (an RC commentary on the Baltimore catechism post Vatican ii) states on Page 242 that [/FONT][FONT=&quot]
(short summary)
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]changing the [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Lord's day[/FONT][FONT=&quot] to Sunday[/FONT][FONT=&quot] was in the power of the church since "in the gospels ..Jesus confers upon his church the power to make laws in his name". [/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]page 243

"Nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lord's day From Saturday to Sunday. We know of the change only from the tradition of the Church - a fact handed down to us...that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many Non-Catholics, who say that they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and Yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lord's day on the say-so of the Catholic church"

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]General summary of the Catholic position on this topic appears to be something like this --
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Point 7 Section 22 Baptist Confession of Faith.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]As it is the law of nature that in general a proportion of time, by God's appointment, should be set apart for the worship of God, so He has given in His Word a positive, moral and perpetual commandment, binding upon all men, in all ages to this effect. He has particularly appointed one day in seven for a Sabbath to be kept holy for Him. From the beginning of the world to the resurrection of Christ this was the last day of the week, and from the resurrection of Christ it was changed to the first day of the week and called the Lord's Day. This is to be continued until the end of the world as the Christian Sabbath, the observation of the last day of the week having been abolished. [/FONT]

West Minster Confession of Faith

[FONT=&quot]21.7. As it is of the law of nature, that, in general, a due proportion of time be set apart for the worship of God; so, in his Word, by a positive, moral, and perpetual commandment, binding all men in all ages, he has particularly appointed one day in seven for a Sabbath, to be kept holy unto him: which, from the beginning of the world to the resurrection of Christ, was the last day of the week; and, from the resurrection of Christ, was changed into the first day of the week, which in Scripture is called the Lord's Day, and is to be continued to the end of the world as the Christian Sabbath.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

Click to expand...

AndOne said:

I'm not sure exactly what the point is though since none of them mandate sabbath worship and clearly explain why. Seems like you are cherry picking your sources without giving them due process.

Click to expand...

you need to read the details. They are talking about an "edit" to the 4th commandment - not abolishing it.

( "The Faith Explained" - page 242-243.)
"we know that in the Old Testament it was the seventh day of the week - the Sabbath day - which was observed as the Lords Day. That was the law as God gave it...'remember to keep holy the Sabbath day..the early Christian church determined as the Lords Day the first day of the week. That the church had the right to make such a law is evident...the reason for changing the Lords Day from Saturday to Sunday lies in the fact that to the Christian church the first day of the week had been made double holy...nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lords Day from Saturday to Sunday..that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many non-catholic who say they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lords Day on the say-so of the catholic church.[FONT=&quot][/FONT]

BobRyan · Dec 17, 2014

AndOne said:
I'm not sure exactly what the point is though since none of them mandate sabbath worship and clearly explain why. Seems like you are cherry picking your sources without giving them due process.

When I oppose them I admit to what they get right - and point to where they get a detail incorrect.

BobRyan said:
Some things that even MC knows to be true ---

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

================================

( "The Faith Explained" - page 242-243.)
"we know that in the Old Testament it was the seventh day of the week - the Sabbath day - which was observed as the Lord’s Day. That was the law as God gave it...'remember to keep holy the Sabbath day..the early Christian church determined as the Lord’s Day the first day of the week. That the church had the right to make such a law is evident...the reason for changing the Lord’s Day from Saturday to Sunday lies in the fact that to the Christian church the first day of the week had been made double holy...nothing is said in the bible about the change of the Lord’s Day from Saturday to Sunday..that is why we find so illogical the attitude of many non-catholic who say they will believe nothing unless they can find it in the bible and yet will continue to keep Sunday as the Lord’s Day on the say-so of the catholic church.

BobRyan · Dec 17, 2014

MoreCoffee said:
Genesis 2:1-3 is alluded to in Exodus 20:8-11

How so?

Like this??
Ex 20:11
"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Ex 20 declares that the Gen 2 facts "alone" make the day holy, sanctified, binding.

So also it is commanded BEFORE Ex 20 -- in Ex 16.

Ex 20 is past tense not present tense.

"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

MoreCoffee said:
The setting aside of a weekly cycle of seven days with the seventh as Sabbath had to await the giving of the commandments at mount Sinai.

Until you read the actual Bible - where we find Sabbath rest commanded in Ex 16 and we find that God says the Sabbath is made a holy day in Gen 2:1-3 then in Ex 20:11 He again says past tense that this is when the day was made holy and set apart.

Even pro-Sunday sources admit to this.

====================================
Baptist Confession of Faith - includes the Sabbath Commandment - given in Eden.

[FONT=&quot]Section 19
. The Law of God [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]God gave to Adam a law[/FONT][FONT=&quot] of universal obedience which was written in his heart[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and He gave him very specific instruction about not eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. By this Adam and all his descendants were bound to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience, being promised life upon the fulfilling of the law, and threatened with death upon the breach of it. At the same time Adam was endued with power and ability to keep it. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN COMMANDMENTS, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man. [/FONT]

===========================

MoreCoffee · Dec 18, 2014

BobRyan said:
...
Until you read the actual Bible

You ought not to insult people in GT as you have insulted me in the bold text. You ought to withdraw that condescending remark and apologise for making it.

- where we find Sabbath rest commanded in Ex 16
...

The truth is that there is no seventh day of the week (Saturday) commandment in Exodus chapter sixteen but there is something else. There's the gift of manna and the six days in when the manna appeared with a double portion on the sixth day and none on the seventh day. There is a cycle of seven days duration with a rest from gathering manna on the seventh day but there is not a Saturday sabbath commandment like the one in Exodus chapter twenty. This is a commandment not to gather manna on the seventh day but instead to rest from gathering manna on the seventh day. Which day was the seventh is not stated. It may have been any day of the week, a Monday or a Tuesday or any other day including Saturday or Sunday. It isn't stated.

For the benefit of our readers here is what is said in Exodus chapter sixteen.

Exodus 16:1-30

The Wilderness of Sin. 1 Having set out from Elim, the whole Israelite community came into the wilderness of Sin, which is between Elim and Sinai, on the fifteenth day of the second month* after their departure from the land of Egypt. 2 Here in the wilderness the whole Israelite community grumbled against Moses and Aaron. 3 The Israelites said to them, “If only we had died at the LORD’s hand in the land of Egypt, as we sat by our kettles of meat and ate our fill of bread! But you have led us into this wilderness to make this whole assembly die of famine!”

The Quail and the Manna. 4 Then the LORD said to Moses:a I am going to rain down bread from heaven* for you. Each day the people are to go out and gather their daily portion; thus will I test them, to see whether they follow my instructions or not. 5 On the sixth day, however, when they prepare what they bring in, let it be twice as much as they gather on the other days. 6 So Moses and Aaron told all the Israelites,b “At evening you will know that it was the LORD who brought you out of the land of Egypt; 7 and in the morning you will see the glory of the LORD, when he hears your grumbling against him. But who are we that you should grumble against us?” 8 And Moses said, “When the LORD gives hears the grumbling you utter against him, who then are we? Your grumbling is not against us, but against the LORD.”

9 Then Moses said to Aaron, “Tell the whole Israelite community: Approach the LORD, for he has heard your grumbling.” 10 But while Aaron was speaking to the whole Israelite community, they turned in the direction of the wilderness, and there the glory of the LORD appeared in the cloud! 11 The LORD said to Moses: 12 I have heard the grumbling of the Israelites. Tell them: In the evening twilight you will eat meat, and in the morning you will have your fill of bread, and then you will know that I, the LORD, am your God.

13 In the evening, quail came up and covered the camp. In the morning there was a layer of dew all about the camp, 14 and when the layer of dew evaporated, fine flakes were on the surface of the wilderness, fine flakes like hoarfrost on the ground. 15 On seeing it, the Israelites asked one another, “What is this?”* for they did not know what it was. But Moses told them, “It is the bread which the LORD has given you to eat.d

Regulations Regarding the Manna. 16 “Now, this is what the LORD has commanded. Gather as much of it as each needs to eat, an omer* for each person for as many of you as there are, each of you providing for those in your own tent.” 17 The Israelites did so. Some gathered a large and some a small amount. 18* But when they measured it out by the omer, the one who had gathered a large amount did not have too much, and the one who had gathered a small amount did not have too little. They gathered as much as each needed to eat. 19 Moses said to them, “Let no one leave any of it over until morning.” 20 But they did not listen to Moses, and some kept a part of it over until morning, and it became wormy and stank. Therefore Moses was angry with them.

21 Morning after morning they gathered it, as much as each needed to eat; but when the sun grew hot, it melted away. 22 On the sixth day they gathered twice as much food, two omers for each person. When all the leaders of the community came and reported this to Moses, 23 he told them, “That is what the LORD has prescribed. Tomorrow is a day of rest, a holy sabbath of the LORD. Whatever you want to bake, bake; whatever you want to boil, boil; but whatever is left put away and keep until the morning.” 24 When they put it away until the morning, as Moses commanded, it did not stink nor were there worms in it. 25 Moses then said, “Eat it today, for today is the sabbath of the LORD. Today you will not find any in the field. 26 Six days you will gather it, but on the seventh day, the sabbath, it will not be there.” 27 Still, on the seventh day some of the people went out to gather it, but they did not find any. 28 Then the LORD said to Moses: How long will you refuse to keep my commandments and my instructions? 29 Take note! The LORD has given you the sabbath. That is why on the sixth day he gives you food for two days. Each of you stay where you are and let no one go out on the seventh day. 30 After that the people rested on the seventh day.

BobRyan · Dec 18, 2014

BobRyan said:
MoreCoffee said:

Genesis 2:1-3 is alluded to in Exodus 20:8-11

Click to expand...

How so?

Like this??
Ex 20:11
"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Ex 20 declares that the Gen 2 facts "alone" make the day holy, sanctified, binding.

So also it is commanded BEFORE Ex 20 -- in Ex 16.

Ex 20 is past tense not present tense.

"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

MoreCoffee said:

The setting aside of a weekly cycle of seven days with the seventh as Sabbath had to await the giving of the commandments at mount Sinai.

Click to expand...

(In the) actual Bible - where we find Sabbath rest commanded in Ex 16 and we find that God says the Sabbath is made a holy day in Gen 2:1-3 then in Ex 20:11 He again says past tense that this is when the day was made holy and set apart.

Even pro-Sunday sources admit to this.

====================================
Baptist Confession of Faith - includes the Sabbath Commandment - given in Eden.

[FONT=&quot]Section 19
. The Law of God [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]God gave to Adam a law[/FONT][FONT=&quot] of universal obedience which was written in his heart[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and He gave him very specific instruction about not eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. By this Adam and all his descendants were bound to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience, being promised life upon the fulfilling of the law, and threatened with death upon the breach of it. At the same time Adam was endued with power and ability to keep it. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN COMMANDMENTS, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man. [/FONT]

===========================

MoreCoffee said:
The truth is that there is no seventh day of the week (Saturday) commandment in Exodus chapter sixteen

The truth is that in the actual Bible we find that in Gen 2:1-3 before Exodus 16 we have --

Gen 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

And in Ex 16 as you point out we have ...

21 And they gathered it every morning, every man according to his eating: and when the sun waxed hot, it melted.
22 And it came to pass, that on the sixth day they gathered twice as much bread, two omers for one man: and all the rulers of the congregation came and told Moses.
23 And he said unto them, This is that which the Lord hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy Sabbath unto the Lord: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning.
24 And they laid it up till the morning, as Moses bade: and it did not stink, neither was there any worm therein.
25 And Moses said, Eat that to day; for to day is a sabbath unto the Lord: to day ye shall not find it in the field.
26 Six days ye shall gather it; but on the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, in it there shall be none.

MoreCoffee said:
There is a cycle of seven days duration with a rest from gathering manna on the seventh day but there is not a Saturday Sabbath

1. Your argument is "with the text".

2. Ex 20:8-11 does not mention the word "Saturday" but even the RCC admits it is Saturday - the seventh day of the week.

for those interested in doctrines based sola scriptura - I think the point of the holy Sabbath and "Tomorrow is the holy Sabbath unto the LORD" is pretty obvious in Ex 16.

I think we all can see that point.

Thekla · Dec 18, 2014

Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah ...

what Sabbath did they keep and how according to the Scriptures ?

listed · Dec 18, 2014

AndOne said:
I'm not sure exactly what the point is though since none of them mandate sabbath worship and clearly explain why. Seems like you are cherry picking your sources without giving them due process.

Very good observation. And welcome to this section of the forum.

listed · Dec 18, 2014

BobRyan said:
How so?

Like this??
Ex 20:11
"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:1-3
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Ex 20 declares that the Gen 2 facts "alone" make the day holy, sanctified, binding.

So also it is commanded BEFORE Ex 20 -- in Ex 16.

Ex 20 is past tense not present tense.

"11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Until you read the actual Bible - where we find Sabbath rest commanded in Ex 16 and we find that God says the Sabbath is made a holy day in Gen 2:1-3 then in Ex 20:11 He again says past tense that this is when the day was made holy and set apart.

Even pro-Sunday sources admit to this.

====================================
Baptist Confession of Faith - includes the Sabbath Commandment - given in Eden.

[FONT=&quot]Section 19
. The Law of God [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]God gave to Adam a law[/FONT][FONT=&quot] of universal obedience which was written in his heart[/FONT][FONT=&quot], and He gave him very specific instruction about not eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. By this Adam and all his descendants were bound to personal, total, exact, and perpetual obedience, being promised life upon the fulfilling of the law, and threatened with death upon the breach of it. At the same time Adam was endued with power and ability to keep it. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]The same law that was first written in the heart of man continued to be a perfect rule of righteousness after the Fall, and was delivered by God upon Mount Sinai in the TEN COMMANDMENTS, and written in two tables, the first four containing our duty towards God, and the other six, our duty to man. [/FONT]

===========================

Do you really mean someone snuck in a deleted Deuteronomy from my Bible? Is it in yours? Do you read and believe it? It has the same author as Genesis and Exodus.

VictorC · Dec 18, 2014

Thekla said:
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah ...

what Sabbath did they keep and how according to the Scriptures ?

All of these patriarchs you listed lived and died before the Sabbath existed. This is why Scripture is silent regarding them 'keeping' a non-entity.

listed · Dec 18, 2014

VictorC said:
All of these patriarchs you listed lived and died before the Sabbath existed. This is why Scripture is silent regarding them 'keeping' a non-entity.

Probably his point.

Sophrosyne · Dec 18, 2014

VictorC said:
All of these patriarchs you listed lived and died before the Sabbath existed. This is why Scripture is silent regarding them 'keeping' a non-entity.

hence the need for prestidigitation

BobRyan · Dec 18, 2014

Thekla said:
Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Noah ...

what Sabbath did they keep and how according to the Scriptures ?

In Ex 20:11 and Gen 2:1-3 we see that the seventh day was already made a holy day - in Genesis 2.

In Gen 4 God tells Cain not to murder his brother by saying "sin is at your door" but there was no law written in the Bible at that time about Murder, or dishonoring parents, or lying or worshiping false gods.

The reason this did not confuse Moses' readers is because they had access to all 5 books of Moses.

So they could read the fact that murder is sin in Ex 20.

And they were not confused about Genesis 6 and 7 talking about clean and unclean animals -- the clean by 7's and the unclean by 2's because they also had Lev 11 to explain it.

Just as when reading about the 7th day made a holy day - they could go to Ex 20:8-11 and Lev 23:1-2 to see that it was a day of rest and of corporate worship.

You probably knew this as well from reading the Bible.

in Christ,

Bob

AndOne · Dec 19, 2014

listed said:
Very good observation. And welcome to this section of the forum.

Thanks!

BobRyan · Dec 19, 2014

BobRyan said:
So then for those who read the Bible - we have Ex 20:8-11 by contrast to the OP

8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

so then that is what the actual TEN Commandments say about the seventh day - and the Sabbath.

And what of the TEN Commandments?

BobRyan said:
Some things that even MC knows to be true ---

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - and yet many who post against God's TEN commandments object to all of the points listed above. And sometimes they will even go on to complain that so many of the points above are in agreement with my position and opposed to the war-against-the-Ten-Commandments position.

================================

Pretty easy to understand the point.

in Christ,

Bob

BobRyan · Dec 19, 2014

AndOne said:
I'm not sure exactly what the point is though since none of them mandate sabbath worship and clearly explain why. Seems like you are cherry picking your sources without giving them due process.

Which ones would you say argue against the Sabbath Commandment?

Baptist Confession of Faith?

Westminster Confession of Faith?

Dies Domini?

The CCC?

D.L. Moody??

R.C.Sproul??

Andy Stanley??

Who??

Chris12 · Dec 19, 2014

Well you keep the law of Moses then, and I will keep the commandments of the Lord.

One is better than the other.. and its not the law of Moses which is better.

WindStaff · Dec 19, 2014

The reason for the change in the Sabbath was out of understanding what the Sabbath fundamentally is.

It is a day of reverence to the Lord. The difference was that before, it was about revering God and Creation. Now, it is about revering Christ.

It doesn't make any sense for a Christian to have the Sabbath on Saturday and not Sunday, which is the triumph day of Jesus.

Christians are not commanded to observe the seventh day.

Junior Member

Repentance works.

Deliver me oh Lord, from evil men

Junior Member

Junior Member

Junior Member

Repentance works.

Junior Member

Thekla

Guest

are you?

are you?

Jesus - that's my final answer

are you?

Let Your Light Shine.. Matt 5:16

Junior Member

Deliver me oh Lord, from evil men

Junior Member

Junior Member

Newbie

WindStaff

Guest

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency