Christianity and Logic

[Bork]

I was listening to a talk by Alister McGrath and heard him quote C.S.Lewis:

"I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else. "

Dr. McGrath seems to make the point that Christianity is true because everything makes sense from his christian stance point. I understand that the concept of God is not provable, or able to be disproved. However, he seems to be contingent in the idea that things are rational from his christian stance.

So, I was just going to ask what makes sense as a Christian for you that you think nonchristians might not have?

As for my other threads I have in here, I will go back to those- I just wanted to post this idea before I took a break from my computer...

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I was listening to a talk by Alister McGrath and heard him quote C.S.Lewis: Dr. McGrath seems to make the point that Christianity is true because everything makes sense from his christian stance point. I understand that the concept of God is not provable, or able to be disproved. However, he seems to be contingent in the idea that things are rational from his christian stance.

So, I was just going to ask what makes sense as a Christian for you that you think nonchristians might not have?

As for my other threads I have in here, I will go back to those- I just wanted to post this idea before I took a break from my computer...

What makes sense to the believer is foolishness to the unbeliever. The two viewpoints are polar opposites.

 

[The Princess Bride]

Christian faith is a lot simpler than people try to think that it is.

Logic and faith will always be at odds if logic tries to be the "bigger dog" in the matter.

 

[Digit]

I would agree with Heather in this regard. Truly opening myself to Christian beliefs was like the last piece of the puzzle falling into place. Suddenly everything made sense.

For example when I think about sin, the cause and effect nature of it and how it changes us, in secular life I was always wondering why some things happened, always trying to convince myself I did the right thing and there was no other way and it was ok. Yet when I shone the Christian light on it, all these things changed. It's odd, now if I look at my relationships with friends and family, they have all improved drastically - because I followed the teachings of Christ.

In addition, in marriage I find I can relate to my wife much better, and I can better understand her needs as I've learned how God created us, and how our creational differences become apparent in our lives.

The Bible is all about relationships, and I find it makes sense in my life as by following it's word, all my relationships have improved hugely.

Digit

 

[ebia]

I was listening to a talk by Alister McGrath and heard him quote C.S.Lewis: Dr. McGrath seems to make the point that Christianity is true because everything makes sense from his christian stance point. I understand that the concept of God is not provable, or able to be disproved. However, he seems to be contingent in the idea that things are rational from his christian stance.

So, I was just going to ask what makes sense as a Christian for you that you think nonchristians might not have?

As for my other threads I have in here, I will go back to those- I just wanted to post this idea before I took a break from my computer...

If you've got time, have a read of Simply Christian by Tom Wright. The first section of the book looks at 4 areas where he suggests one can hear "echos of a voice", that make a lot more sense when seen through the lens of Jesus of Nazareth (our sense of justice but our failure to ever implement it, our longing for spirtuality but failure to come up with one that satisfies, our longing for relationship but constant failure to make them work, and our appreciation for beauty that always fades.) (The first of those has more than a nod of acknowledgement towards CS Lewis in Mere Christianity, though he doesn't take the stance that he can prove God's existance through that.)

 

[jive4005]

Here's one Minister (Independent Baptist) who sees God's hand in all the history and the science. It all makes complete sense to me.

I'm no scientist or learned historian but have held a healthy interest in both my entire life (college, life).
The only problems sem to pop up when some person or group decides that "they are the correct thinkers/believers/whatever!).

My faith in the laws of nature (tho we only understand parts of the whole) comes from my faith in God... who planned it out and made it all work.

Sometime after that, He reminded us that we shouldn't lean too much upon our own understanding of these things.

His,
Rev J

 

[salida]

I will tell you Bork. I'm not a christian for spiritual reasons alone but its also an intellectual one. Read Evidence Demands A Verdict by Josh McDowell - it would stand up in court. And a great website is www.reasons.org - belief and science.

Biblical Evidence (Scratching the Surface Only)

Internal Evidences
Prophesies that are confirmed within Bible

- Life of Christ
The Tribe of Judah, Gen 49:10 - Luke 3:23-28
(Genesis was written 4004 BC to 1689 BC)
(Luke's time period is 60-70 AD)

Royal Line of David, Jer 23:5 -Matt 1:1
(Jeremiah 760 to 698 BC)/(Matthew 60-70 AD)

Born of a Virgin, Isaiah 7:14/Matt 1:18-23
(Isaiah 760 to 698 BC)/(60-70 AD)

**I can list at least 20 more of these.
-Rise of Empires
In the book of Daniel, Chapter 2 - four kingdoms are described in the interpretation of the dream of Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon: Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greek - Daniel 8:21, 10:20) and a fourth great kingdom to follow - part iron and clay - which is the Roman Empire - during this empire Christ came and the church was established - Daniel 2:44.

-Historical Accuracy
The Bible is loaded with historical statements concerning events hundreds of years ago, yet has not been proven incorrect on any.
(Bible compared to other ancient documents):
New Testament - starts at 25 years - between original and first surviving copies
Homer - starts at 500 years
Demosthenes - at 1400 years
Plato - at 1200 years
Caesar - at 1000 years

Number of Manuscript Copies
New Testament - 5,686
Homer - 643
Demosthenes - 200
Plato - 7
Caesar - 10

Consistency
Written by at least 40 men over a period of time exceeding 1400 years, and has no internal inconsistencies.

Claim of Inspiration
It claims to be spoken by God, 2 Tim 3:16-17). No other religious book makes such claims.

External Evidences
(Prophesies Outside the Bible)
These cities were prophesied to be destroyed and never be built again.
Nineveh - Nahum 1:10, 3:7,15, Zephaniah 2:13-14
Babylon - Isaiah 13:1-22)
Tyre (Ezekiel 26:1-28)

Bible before Science
He hangs the earth on nothing - Job 26:7
(Job was written at least 1000 years ago - some scholars think it could be even 3000 years ago)
Note: Man only knew this for 350 years
Earth is a sphere, Isaiah 40:22
Air has weight, Job 28:25
Gravity - Job 26:7, Job 38:31-33
Winds blow in cyclones, Eccl 1:6

Documents that Prove Bible is True
Gilgamesh Epic, The Sumerian King List, Mari Tablets, Babylonian Chronicles

Archealogoical Finds
Excavations of Ur, Location of Zoar, Ziggurats and the foundation of Tower of Babel

 

[Saucy]

I love all that stuff that Salida wrote and it's all true. There are things written in the bible that science hasn't even figured out until recently or even the past few hundred years.

The thing that makes more sense to me is creation. I grew up an atheist and believed in evolution, but if you look at how complex life is and how much information is packed into one strand of DNA and how much DNA is in one cell, you get a sense that there has to be a creator. So much information cannot just come out of nowhere. I don't believe that you can get something out of nothing and it's so much easier to believe that an intelligent God, who has always been, created all that we see. When you look at the world from a biblical standpoint and not the world's, so much stuff just seems clearer. No matter how many degrees someone has or how often they try to explain it, I will never get how life came out of nothing. Simple math equation 0+0=0. You can never have nothing and add nothing to it and have the universe and order that we have now.

 

[rocklife]

I was listening to a talk by Alister McGrath and heard him quote C.S.Lewis: Dr. McGrath seems to make the point that Christianity is true because everything makes sense from his christian stance point. I understand that the concept of God is not provable, or able to be disproved. However, he seems to be contingent in the idea that things are rational from his christian stance.

So, I was just going to ask what makes sense as a Christian for you that you think nonchristians might not have?

As for my other threads I have in here, I will go back to those- I just wanted to post this idea before I took a break from my computer...

I was a non-christian, criminal, totally evil. I eventually was threatened to be killed by my baby's daddy, very serious threats with some attempts. When I was being choked and couldn't breathe, the thought entered my head, "is this it? I die and evil murderer wins?" so I left that life with the help of police, and started searching for the meaning of life and death. I found Jesus as the answer to sin and death. He forgives our sins if we follow Him, and offers eternal life. That is a wonderful offer. I have also looked into Islam and buddhism and other things. Jesus is the answer, His cleaning my overloaded conscience and changing my life when I couldn't even with help of other doctors is a big testimony. so that is a difference I have from a non-christian to christian

I do believe facing death up close gives you more urgency, but I found hope in God that is available to everyone. we all die one day. what's the point of life? God has great answers, not always easy to follow, but He also promises to give us His Spirit to help, that is a blessing to me