• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Christian Universalism. What's not to like?

Status
Not open for further replies.

Jipsah

Blood Drinker
Aug 17, 2005
13,754
4,448
71
Franklin, Tennessee
✟282,899.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I support Manchester United so I hate Manchester City (I'm from the UK, apologies) but it needn't apply to matters of faith.
Man U? Nooooooo!

Oh, wait a minute, the team I support is in Championship, not Premier. Never mind. (Hey, I don't even hate West Ham.)

Spot on IMO.

For me, it's basically relief that God is a loving God and not a monster after all.
Same here. And while I'd like to see the members of the murderous Kim dynasty in Korea eaten by scorpions, I don't see that as being very God-like. I'd rather see them, and everybody else, saved and set right by the grace of God. That would be glorious!
 
Reactions: Hmm
Upvote 0

dqhall

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Jul 21, 2015
7,547
4,172
Florida
Visit site
✟811,723.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I do not believe in eternal torture punishment, for Jesus said, “Blessed are the merciful, for they will obtain mercy.” Shepherds do not torture their sheep.

One passage lets me know God intends to prevent the wicked from destroying the good and Holy:

Luke 13:22 Then Jesus went through the towns and villages, teaching as he made his way to Jerusalem. 23 Someone asked him, “Lord, are only a few people going to be saved?”

He said to them, 24 “Make every effort to enter through the narrow door, because many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to. 25 Once the owner of the house gets up and closes the door, you will stand outside knocking and pleading, ‘Sir, open the door for us.’

“But he will answer, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from.’

26 “Then you will say, ‘We ate and drank with you, and you taught in our streets.’

27 “But he will reply, ‘I don’t know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers!’

28 “There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out. 29 People will come from east and west and north and south, and will take their places at the feast in the kingdom of God. 30 Indeed there are those who are last who will be first, and first who will be last.”
 
Upvote 0

Basil the Great

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Mar 9, 2009
4,773
4,091
✟788,716.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Green
I really meant to be required to repent, not forced.
 
Reactions: Saint Steven
Upvote 0

Clare73

Blood-bought
Jun 12, 2012
29,066
7,503
North Carolina
✟343,026.00
Country
United States
Gender
Female
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Why is it so hard for you to believe the simple fact that it is not Biblical is the reason believers don't like it?
And they won't accept until it can be shown to be Bibilical, which it cannot.
 
Upvote 0

ozso

Site Supporter
Oct 2, 2020
27,340
14,945
PNW
✟956,751.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Why is it so hard for you to believe the simple fact that it is not Biblical is the reason believers don't like it?
And they won't accept until it can be shown to be Bibilical, which it cannot.

The reason why I'm willing to consider it, is because it has been shown to have Biblical backing. So I think the objection stems more from whatever theologies, doctrines, traditions and views one holds onto. That's why a devout Baptist (or whatever), will probably always be a devout Baptist, and will reject anything that doesn't fit in with Baptist doctrine and tradition.
 
Upvote 0

ozso

Site Supporter
Oct 2, 2020
27,340
14,945
PNW
✟956,751.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
One argument when it comes to what's Biblical, is that some things Jesus said are incorrectly ascribed to Him talking about hell, when instead He's giving national Judgements against Israel, the same as the OT prophets. Because Israel was about to be wiped out in a bloody firery holocaust. If one ascribes certain things Jesus said, to being about hell, then it seems He didn't have much to say about Israel's grim impending doom, which seems highly unlikely to me.
 
Upvote 0

Cormack

“I bet you're a real hulk on the internet...”
Apr 21, 2020
1,469
1,408
London
✟102,307.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ.
I Corinthians 15:22

Doesn't "all things" in this case mean that you're covered, too? "All" means "all," right?

Almost everyone in the church considers the “all” in Adam to be universal in scope, so it’s an iffy misstep to immediately switch from a universal all around Adam and death onto a restricted “all” for the all made alive in Christ.

The author was creating symmetry by repeated use of language and nearness of the whole construct, so whatever the first “all” means, the second all means something very similar.
 
Upvote 0

ozso

Site Supporter
Oct 2, 2020
27,340
14,945
PNW
✟956,751.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single

What could be more scriptural about it than 1 Corinthians 15:22?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Hmm

Hey, I'm just this guy, you know
Sep 27, 2019
4,866
5,027
35
Shropshire
✟193,879.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
Why is it so hard for you to believe the simple fact that it is not Biblical is the reason believers don't like it?

Well, for the simple reason that I believe universalism is the biblical position. One reason why it may be hard to see that is because of a misunderstanding of what Christian universalism actually is. It is not pluralistic but believes that we will all saved through Christ.

And they won't accept until it can be shown to be Bibilical, which it cannot.

It's easy to see it's biblical. This article alone shows that:
https://campuspress.yale.edu/keithderose/1129-2/

It's more a question of not wanting to accept it.
 
Upvote 0

Hmm

Hey, I'm just this guy, you know
Sep 27, 2019
4,866
5,027
35
Shropshire
✟193,879.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
Upvote 0

Hmm

Hey, I'm just this guy, you know
Sep 27, 2019
4,866
5,027
35
Shropshire
✟193,879.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
In Relationship
Man U? Nooooooo!

Oh, wait a minute, the team I support is in Championship, not Premier. Never mind. (Hey, I don't even hate West Ham.)

One thing about Man U is that it has more supporters outside of Manchester than within it. I think a lot of the fame and romance of the team came from the terrible Munich air disaster of 1958.

Coming from Tennessee, it's amazing that you would even have heard of a Championship team, let alone support one. Which team is it and why did you choose it?
 
Upvote 0

ozso

Site Supporter
Oct 2, 2020
27,340
14,945
PNW
✟956,751.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
So you said. Perhaps you could say why?

The irony is the thread posted is all about how universalism is untrue, whilst debunking it with
annihilationism, which just as many consider to be unbiblical heresy as well.
 
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Site Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
25,845
8,376
Dallas
✟1,086,812.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married

It’s not a matter of what we like or dislike it’s a matter of what is biblical, what the word of God actually says.
 
Upvote 0

BNR32FAN

He’s a Way of life
Site Supporter
Aug 11, 2017
25,845
8,376
Dallas
✟1,086,812.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married

No and that’s exactly why universalism is so dangerous, because it gives people a false sense of security leading them to believe that they don’t need to repent and believe in this life. That they can live however they want then just repent later and still be saved.
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,636
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,349.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,636
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,349.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.