Christian Relationships

[legin]

In our church we don't date people who are not in the church, (we are in the world but not part of it and so should be separate from worldly things)
If someone new comes along who we might like we should give them time to become established in the church before we start dating, that way we know they are coming along for the right reasons and not just to find a partner.
The important thing is that they get spirit filled and baptised then walk in God's ways, then other things can follow in their own time.

 

[mannmann]

Wow...God created marriage...and hence it's not "Christian Issues"...Omgosh#1

Yes god did create marrage, but the idea of marrage has been around much longer than christianity, the problems posed is this forum are general problems that are in any relationship/marrage no matter what faith.

OMGosh#2....so in your theory, it was not through Christ that creation came abouts, but rather our own conscience?

You'll have to explain this in simpler terms for me... you've totally lost me to how this is relevent to marrage/dating etc

out of context? I believe your words about being "happy" is the old life, based on your context of a relationship with a non-Christian, because you're not enjoying the fruits of God's spirit within the partner, rather you're enjoying her heart and what she offers...

Quite frankly no, I didn't enjoy the fruits of God's sprit with a christian partner - I found it impossible to grow as a christian myself. Infact the 2 christians I've dated seriously damaded my own beliefs. Being with an understanding non-christian is letting me learn by myself at my own pace and is quite frankly much better. As you have no experience of this, I sugest you actually try dating/marrying someone before judging.....

OMGosh#3
IIRC?

you will need to pull out Corinthians and get it to me segmentedly, in such a way that it would prove your case and where you're standing.

What you have said there is a set that is inclusive of all, not exclusive and restricted into a minor set, rather a complete set. If you can't follow the logic in Corinthians, then my suggestion is for you to read Theological books, then have a discussion on the logic. Otherwise you're theory above is way out of ratio even for a Liberal Christian.

(If I Recall Correctly.... )
I'm willing to read and learn. - you do have a better knowledge of the bible than me.

OMGosh#4
God has, in your opinion, no soverignity...

God, in my opinion, has soverignity. But I am not fearfull of god. I am however, respectfull of god and fearful of gods judgement. God is a powerfull, but approachable King/Father. To be too fearful to question is a dictatorship, not a relationship. I question then belive. It appears that you simply belive.

I should pray for you that you may understand the real truth, the truth that through Christ that Christ was obedient to death on the cross, and lost his life for all....

PLEASE do!!!

I wonder how on earth am I going to deal with these post modern ideas seeping into Christian thinking....and making it heretical

Throught history there have been the 'acceptables' - only 100 years ago is was fine for the head of the Anglican church to have mistresses. few hundered years before that, the crusades...
Current day influences come and go, but the basics stay the same.

 

[shout2thelord]

Mannmann- You said that it didnt work with the 2nd christian girlfriend cos she was at church all the time but surely you knew that before you started dating her and if you werent that commited in church at the time then surely you knew it wouldnt work. If your friends first then you know that person.

The trouble is non christians will confirm any doubts or fears you have about christianity or non biblical ideas because they dont know Jesus.

Ive heard it explained that if you stay on the path to Jesus and your partner stays on the path to Jesus then at one point you will meet. But if you go off that path to specifically look for a wife/husband when the time isnt right then you wont find the right person.
Also from personal experience just after i became a christian i dated an unbeleiver and broke up after a week because i realised we were so different because he wasnt a christian. And i learnt as well that your relationship with God needs to be right before you enter into a romantic relationship.

The question is what is the most important thing in your life?

If you married the person your with now would you stay commited to God - for example how much time do spend for devotionals now, a relationship even with another christian takes up more of your time.

 

[Icystwolf]

Thats weird, I thought I replied this...must be a website error....

Yes god did create marrage, but the idea of marrage has been around much longer than christianity, the problems posed is this forum are general problems that are in any relationship/marrage no matter what faith.

Dude...I believe even the Hillsingers will burn you for that statement.

God created marriage, and the authority of marriage is not Christianity, it's God.

You'll have to explain this in simpler terms for me... you've totally lost me to how this is relevent to marrage/dating etc

That is by your logic that you've stated of how one is in front of another.

Quite frankly no, I didn't enjoy the fruits of God's sprit with a christian partner - I found it impossible to grow as a christian myself. Infact the 2 christians I've dated seriously damaded my own beliefs. Being with an understanding non-christian is letting me learn by myself at my own pace and is quite frankly much better. As you have no experience of this, I sugest you actually try dating/marrying someone before judging.....

Unfortunately you've hit yourself in the head with a hammer with what you just said.

I believe that Paul, though not married and didn't date either was commenting on Marriage and young widows. Now what Authority did Paul have to tell them this, even though he was single?

(If I Recall Correctly.... )
I'm willing to read and learn. - you do have a better knowledge of the bible than me.


God, in my opinion, has soverignity. But I am not fearfull of god. I am however, respectfull of god and fearful of gods judgement. God is a powerfull, but approachable King/Father. To be too fearful to question is a dictatorship, not a relationship. I question then belive. It appears that you simply belive.

Can anyone here, esspecially Hillsingers vouch for what he just said.

That he doesn't fear God....anyone?


What church do you go to that taught you this?

PLEASE do!!!


Throught history there have been the 'acceptables' - only 100 years ago is was fine for the head of the Anglican church to have mistresses. few hundered years before that, the crusades...
Current day influences come and go, but the basics stay the same.

The changes are made after realising that some tradition was not biblical. It wasn't 100yrs ago t'was much earlier than that.

Again, be responsible with what you say. I know for a fact you don't actually mean half the things you say up there....

 

[artofwar]

Oh dear mannmann what are you saying please clarify, many years ago I went out with a christian yes she was no good bad believe me non christians could very well lead you astray I have been out with many, your playing with fire mate it quite clearly states do not be unequally yoked with an unbeliever marriage is a God inspired thing, and you should fear God there is a great book the John bevre that I reckon you should read, we are not judging you we are merely stating the truth, i mean even Icy and I are in agreement on this so please think about it

 

[mannmann]

Thank you artofwar, legin and shout2thelord for some sensable comments, rather than just throwing irrelavent bible quotes around....

Still puzzled....

Why - 'non christians could very well lead you astray'??

Why? - 'The trouble is non christians will confirm any doubts or fears you have about christianity or non biblical ideas because they dont know Jesus.'
What basis has this got? - Confirm doubts??? Surely you should know and confront your own doubts yourself?? why would going out with a christian be helpfull for this??

I understand legin's view of really restricting the people that are potential dates to just those of your church, because that resolves many issues, but I dont think that that is what is meant my 'unequally yoked'.

'I've heard it explained that if you stay on the path to Jesus and your partner stays on the path to Jesus then at one point you will meet. But if you go off that path to specifically look for a wife/husband when the time isnt right then you wont find the right person.'
Very good explination and one that actually makes sense!!! Thanks!!

but...

I see some of my christian friends trying very hard to make christian/christian relationships work when they clearly dont - They are trying so damn hard simply because they do want to date someone, but not 'allowed' to date a non-christian.

I still dont see that being christian will help in many of the christian relationship issues, unless you take legin's view of only dating someone in your church....
Different churches have different views, different people like different ways of worshiping. Simply saying that God will resolve the differences doesn't hold true. I feel that it is simply a cop out...

To answer the question of 'If you married the person your with now would you stay commited to God?' The answer is YES because I know what the truth is, my g/f, although does not belive, is very well educated about christianity and is VERY supportive and LOVES ME.

 

[artofwar]

hmmm so you would want to marry someone who doesnt go to heaven with you? when you are married you are one body and if that half of the body is a non believe that is what is described as unevenly yoked, im not saying its easy to fins a good Christian girl and hey im speaking from experiences i went out with heaps of non christian girls and believe me your intentions are good but down the track its gonna be hard, especially she lures you into sin, i know you have good intentions but long term either you will backslide which is the mostprobable outcome or she may come to know Christ. But i wouldnt go out with anyone does to get them saved thats an old trick from the devil.

 

[mannmann]

hmmm so you would want to marry someone who doesnt go to heaven with you? when you are married you are one body and if that half of the body is a non believe that is what is described as unevenly yoked, im not saying its easy to fins a good Christian girl and hey im speaking from experiences i went out with heaps of non christian girls and believe me your intentions are good but down the track its gonna be hard, especially she lures you into sin, i know you have good intentions but long term either you will backslide which is the mostprobable outcome or she may come to know Christ. But i wouldnt go out with anyone does to get them saved thats an old trick from the devil.

Fair enough.. I still dont agree to the scare mongering 'lure in to sin' bit, but hey...

 

[artofwar]

not a scare tactic mate just what ive seen and experienced thats all , and of course what it says in the Bible

 

[Jaegang72]

mannmann,

I reckon in your position when you are in a pretty strong relationship with a girl non christian , I totally acknowledge it so hard to even contemplate leaving it because she isnt a christian.

You are right when you say a christian relationship btw 2 christians may not work out well. So why should you really bother with one?
To this I say, yes christian relationship is not perfect for some. Perhaps it is better for them to be with another christian . If they are married at least they share the most important thing (should be anyway). They have that common important thing that will help them work thru their marriage. 1 in 2 marriages fail. Christ will be the glue to hold things together when things are hard and seem to be failing.

You are right when you say your christian faith isnt compromised even though she is a non christian.
To this I say, it your CURRENT christian faith which is not compromised. Your level of walk with God is not compromised. But as you know everyone grows in their faith if they spend time in God's presence. What I am trying to say is, what is acceptable to you know may not be acceptable later with further growth in God.

Just like as a boy , we want toys and comics but when we are older, we want physical sports and the news. When you are married, it is for life. If then you find out that the wife isnt into the level or intensity of your christian faith, there is gonna be a falling out. Dont be fooled. I mean if we think that the spouse isnt gonna be unhappy if we ditch the waterfront property idea for something else which pays less but honours God more, we are kidding ourselves.

You say that you dont believe that a non christian will lead you astray. To this I say, she wont lead you astray from your current level of walk with God for now. In fact, I am absolutely sure that over time, you will backslide not because of any ill work on her behalf but just because her physical presence is so much more real to you than God. The thing about God is he is not easily found. Bible says.. he will reward you when you seek him earnestly and again he will be found when he sought with all our hearts. It is so much easier to look to the physically present wife than the invisible God when push comes to shove.

After saying all this, I think there is something within you which knows there is something here said is right. I see you fighting tooth and nail as if your life depended on it. Actually it may feel like this. Because the thought of giving up on something which feels so good must feel terrible. I just hope she converts to christianity for your sake.. If not, it's hard I realize to give it up but the correct thing nevetheless.

cheerio
dave

 

[mannmann]

You are right when you say a christian relationship btw 2 christians may not work out well. So why should you really bother with one?
To this I say, yes christian relationship is not perfect for some. Perhaps it is better for them to be with another christian .

So its better to have a not so happy relationship with a christian than a very happy relationship with a non-christian? - odd... - why?

If they are married at least they share the most important thing (should be anyway). They have that common important thing that will help them work thru their marriage. 1 in 2 marriages fail. Christ will be the glue to hold things together when things are hard and seem to be failing.

Na - get real. I know 3 'christian' couples who are having difficulties and quite simply should split up and get on with something else. Instead, they are hanging in there on a relationship that doesn't work under the pretence that Jesus will sort it out for them. A failing relationship needs more than a reliance on Jesus. Jesus will help, but most of the effort needsd to come from the couple. Using the 'excuse' that Jesus will be there is not enough for a relationship to work.

You are right when you say your christian faith isnt compromised even though she is a non christian.
To this I say, it your CURRENT christian faith which is not compromised. Your level of walk with God is not compromised. But as you know everyone grows in their faith if they spend time in God's presence. What I am trying to say is, what is acceptable to you know may not be acceptable later with further growth in God.

If you had read my posts properly... I've grown as a christian by being with a non-christian as I have my own space. I'm not 'forced' to a church I dont like, I'm not 'forced' in to my christianity is right discussions.

Just like as a boy , we want toys and comics but when we are older, we want physical sports and the news. When you are married, it is for life. If then you find out that the wife isnt into the level or intensity of your christian faith, there is gonna be a falling out. Dont be fooled. I mean if we think that the spouse isnt gonna be unhappy if we ditch the waterfront property idea for something else which pays less but honours God more, we are kidding ourselves.

I need to get that waterfront property in the first place!
Not all girls are after flash houses and cars. Infact most girls I know, rank happyness above materialistic items. (apart form flowers!!)

After saying all this, I think there is something within you which knows there is something here said is right. I see you fighting tooth and nail as if your life depended on it. Actually it may feel like this. Because the thought of giving up on something which feels so good must feel terrible. I just hope she converts to christianity for your sake.. If not, it's hard I realize to give it up but the correct thing nevetheless.

Not really. I'm very interested in this and I dont understand it. It seems to me that many ppl just accept the rules without questioning them too deeply. Its all very well quoting the 'corporate' line to me, because I will question that. I want reason and logic. I belive 100% in Jesus and God. I dont belive/understand in the many rules that are human made surrounding the whole topic. This appearsd to be one of those human made rules...

 

[Inquisitior]

I know of some churches which have 'counselling' before dating.

 

[Icystwolf]

Thank you artofwar, legin and shout2thelord for some sensable comments, rather than just throwing irrelavent bible quotes around....

Are you saying you're intellectually incapable of understanding the Bible quotes I've given you, that reflect the beliefs of Christians?

Or are you just incapable of just reading the quotes because it's just too damaging?

Still puzzled....

Why - 'non christians could very well lead you astray'??

What leads Christians away from God?
Money, Power, Sex....

All of which are desires from our sinful hearts...

Why? - 'The trouble is non christians will confirm any doubts or fears you have about christianity or non biblical ideas because they dont know Jesus.'
What basis has this got? - Confirm doubts??? Surely you should know and confront your own doubts yourself?? why would going out with a christian be helpfull for this??

Going out with a Christian helps you to question your beliefs and to refine areas and have theological discussions or debates.

If you're going out with a non-Christian, and you're having debates over whether God exists or not, just to keep the relationship, then I'd say you still question whether God exists or not.

I understand legin's view of really restricting the people that are potential dates to just those of your church, because that resolves many issues, but I dont think that that is what is meant my 'unequally yoked'.

'I've heard it explained that if you stay on the path to Jesus and your partner stays on the path to Jesus then at one point you will meet. But if you go off that path to specifically look for a wife/husband when the time isnt right then you wont find the right person.'
Very good explination and one that actually makes sense!!! Thanks!!

but...

I see some of my christian friends trying very hard to make christian/christian relationships work when they clearly dont - They are trying so damn hard simply because they do want to date someone, but not 'allowed' to date a non-christian.

The further we get into the argument, the more I realise how unloving you are towards Jesus.

If you had understood what nearly all churches teaches you, to be a Christian isn't just about going to church.

Its a massive transformation...this concept of transformation is something I doubt you'd even understood.

Just as much as polliniating an epidendrum to a cattleya, or a Tiger with a lion, if successful it would produce genetically sterile hybrids.

The purpose of being a Christian is to live life with Christ, and not to follow your own ways.

So far this arguement as been just about "YOU", and "YOUR" experiences which is complete "Garbage" because YOUR experiences do not outline the Christian faith.....You're Not JESUS, and You should be Following JESUS and not yourself, if you were to be a Christian.

I still dont see that being christian will help in many of the christian relationship issues, unless you take legin's view of only dating someone in your church....
Different churches have different views, different people like different ways of worshiping. Simply saying that God will resolve the differences doesn't hold true. I feel that it is simply a cop out...

To answer the question of 'If you married the person your with now would you stay commited to God?' The answer is YES because I know what the truth is, my g/f, although does not belive, is very well educated about christianity and is VERY supportive and LOVES ME.

I can see why you're other relationships didn't work out.

You don't like Christians that confront you and rebuke you, which is probably what happened...

I guess I'm just like those Christians you dated, which is why you so so so can't read my posts. I'm just a noisy gong arn't I...

Maybe you should learn that sometimes, it's not someone elses fault by "Your" fault.

 

[mannmann]

Are you saying you're intellectually incapable of understanding the Bible quotes I've given you, that reflect the beliefs of Christians?

Or are you just incapable of just reading the quotes because it's just too damaging?

I simply dont see/understand that the majority of your quotes are relavent.. I've asked you to clarify and you dont.

Going out with a Christian helps you to question your beliefs and to refine areas and have theological discussions or debates.

If you're going out with a non-Christian, and you're having debates over whether God exists or not, just to keep the relationship, then I'd say you still question whether God exists or not.

Wrong. Going out with a non-christian does not mean that you spend the whole time discussing the existance of God. I do not question the existance of god, what I question are the man made rules that seem to float around. (such as this one)

You don't like Christians that confront you and rebuke you, which is probably what happened...

I like being challenged, and I like challenging which is why I'm writing here....,

The bible clearly states about being unequally yoked is not helpfull. It is still possible to plough a field with u nequally yoked oxes, just more difficult. Nowhere in the bible does it say that it will hurt God or cause one to stray from the correct path, it is simply more difficult to stay on the straight and narrow., Churches introducing rules that say that you can only date someone in the same church are teaching the wrong thing...

 

[Icystwolf]

I simply dont see/understand that the majority of your quotes are relavent.. I've asked you to clarify and you dont.

what is there to clarify?

Instead of explaining it I've refined it to one single point for you to consider.

and this one point keeps pointing to the same argument. You're Not God, hence stop making up the rules!

Wrong. Going out with a non-christian does not mean that you spend the whole time discussing the existance of God. I do not question the existance of god, what I question are the man made rules that seem to float around. (such as this one)

Oh this is becoming more enjoyable, because I'm now realising a lot of your arguments are just what atheists use on Christians like myself.

I like being challenged, and I like challenging which is why I'm writing here....,

The bible clearly states about being unequally yoked is not helpfull. It is still possible to plough a field with u nequally yoked oxes, just more difficult. Nowhere in the bible does it say that it will hurt God or cause one to stray from the correct path, it is simply more difficult to stay on the straight and narrow., Churches introducing rules that say that you can only date someone in the same church are teaching the wrong thing...

Seriously, you have got the context so wrong. Paul was saying that, for those who have converted and their partners not converted, hence these are the possible actions to take.

As for dating Christians, well I'll take you down to the class room.

Adam and Christ are both the "son of God"
Adam was born of the flesh, Christ was born of the Spirit.

If we are to be reborn, we are to be born into the Spirit. Which represents our Transformation.

When one marries it is the joining of the flesh with each other...that was established in Genesis.
However when we are born in the Spirit, we're together with God. And the marriage between two Christians represents the marriage of Christ to the Church in the final days as Christ returns.

Your statement that Christ marrying the church used as a similie is absurd, it's used as a shadow of things to come. If you go read the Bible more, you'd find the significance and coherency of the whole Scriptures.

You won't understand the bible by reading it once, you have to get use to reading the Bible. Like Shakespeare, read for the first time, you'd still have no idea...until you continually keep reading it...

 

[mannmann]

. You're Not God, hence stop making up the rules!

I'm not - I'm just questioning the 'rules'.

I question the relevence because in my experience, the 2 christian girls I have dated have pushed me so far away from God I simply hated any thought about church and christianity. The one ex-christian girl I have dated has allowed me to grow as a christian. Hence I find many of the arguments against dating non-christians very difficult to understand.

The arguments that the majority of people put towards only dating non-christians are simply general relationship problems..

Your last couple of posts have been much more relevent and understandable than anyone else that I have talked to on the subject. - for this, thanks....

Need more thinking time....

 

[Macca]

I'm not - I'm just questioning the 'rules'.

I question the relevence because in my experience, the 2 christian girls I have dated have pushed me so far away from God I simply hated any thought about church and christianity. The one ex-christian girl I have dated has allowed me to grow as a christian. Hence I find many of the arguments against dating non-christians very difficult to understand.

The arguments that the majority of people put towards only dating non-christians are simply general relationship problems..

Your last couple of posts have been much more relevent and understandable than anyone else that I have talked to on the subject. - for this, thanks....

Need more thinking time....

You say earlier that marrying a non christian will not cause you to go astray.
Why do you think God didn't want the Israelites to mix with and marry the former residents of the land? Simply because it WOULD (and did) lead them astray from Him.
The 2 christian girls you dated pushed you away from God? Were you looking at them rather than looking to Jesus. Even in a christian boyfriend-girlfriend relationship, I believe the guy should take the lead role, not forcing but leading. If you were pushed away from God, I feel, you were lokking at the wrong things.
Macca.

 

[Icystwolf]

I'm not - I'm just questioning the 'rules'.

I question the relevence because in my experience, the 2 christian girls I have dated have pushed me so far away from God I simply hated any thought about church and christianity. The one ex-christian girl I have dated has allowed me to grow as a christian. Hence I find many of the arguments against dating non-christians very difficult to understand.

I can understand the fustration that some Christian girls place on guys and vice versa, but in the end, I personally would much rather stay single than to date a person that is not with God.

Each Christian I believe have a responsibility to live life with Christ. Even as I say this, there are some Christians who still fornicate which is sinning and distorts the scriptures because they want to get away from beening labled as a sinner.

I have a friend that calls himself a christian, yet has sex very often, changes partners heaps and his view on fornication is that it's no different to masturbation. And his whole view of the scriptures has been wrecked from that day forward.

The arguments that the majority of people put towards only dating non-christians are simply general relationship problems..

Your last couple of posts have been much more relevent and understandable than anyone else that I have talked to on the subject. - for this, thanks....

Need more thinking time....

Yes, I think I have been a bit slack on the expectation of some of my explanations...

Give it time and I should be more patient next time, if you have any questions...it's exam time in uni...

Other than that, the scriptures is the key!