Christian and Secular psychological models

[Sketcher]

I don't fully understand the theory. But it is very important to consider the whole context. As in, what is the patient (you, in this case) being seen for? What is the counselor trying to treat? You have faith, but if you also have a problem, that problem may be expressed through your faith, when in fact your faith can exist perfectly well without the problem. It's important to differentiate the faith from the problem.

 

[dms1972]

thankyou again for the replies and encouragement.

'a problem expressing itself through my 'faith' might be right but still not sure how to explain it. Im not really sure this IFS approach or viewing it in those terms would be the way to disentangle it.

I would say the underlying aspect might be depression, but from a young age, since beginning to know a bit about christianity what I seem to be doing is trying to pray for a christian conversion experience, or a realisation of a sort, and that I won't turn away.

Re the counselling, and thankyou if you have continued to read thus - my opinion given what limited background info I have is that its less a western reductionistic form of psychotherapy and may have more in common with Eastern mysticism, given his years practicing TM.

I would appreciate prayer for myself and the counsellor, not for 'stuff to come up' but to articulate things clearly.

 

[FireDragon76]

It sounds plausible to me based on what we know of neuroscience, we do have modes of brain activity where neurons fire together that we try to switch to in different situations, it is almost like a separate "personality". People with Multiple Personalities just have this to a much more extreme degree, to the point that consciousness of the different modes is lost or greatly reduced. Another approach might be helpful to you is Mindsight by Dan Siegel if you think that sounds plausible, it is very similar but based off the practice of mindfulness and comes from a neuroscience perspective.

Physical activities that involve your body, even something as simple as handwashing dishes can help with anxiety because it involves doing something physical, consciously and intentionally, and not being lost in your thoughts. Living in your head all the time or stuck with your own emotions isn't healthy. It's called rumination.

A good therapist with real training in psychology or social work with a Christian background who respects your beliefs is definitely a good choice.

 

[dms1972]

can you point me to something online to do with neuroscience and neurons firing together so i see what they are saying.

what does seem to happen, though i am not speaking as an expert, is that when people experience something traumatic they may dissociate, part of their experience becomes 'not me' so to speak. This might not mean multiple personalities for most people. But in some case a person who has been abused might cope by 'becoming' someone else while its happening. People cope in different ways. It could depend a lot on what the traumatic experience has been. Terms such as MPD are not always helpful, on the one hand they strain some peoples credulity who take them fairly literally and think that its impossible, in a sense it is impossible for people to really have multiple personalites, it more a case of fragmented personality. Again just my non-expert opinion.

But when I was ten and i had a fall backwards, which resulted in a heavy impact to my head, i was trying to cope right after that in some way, i recall thinking (though i can't be sure my precise thoughts) that I will never be the same person again, i was trying to cope in some way immediately following it.

I am somewhat skeptical of Richard Swartz and IFS because I can't help wondering if someone into Transcendental Meditation for years really is in touch with ordinary reality. TM is really is very contrary to common sense, those into it seem to completely give up common sense. Take "yogic flying" for example - these people mediate and believe they are levitating when its clear they are simply bouncing on a mattress.

Should I be cautious of IFS on the grounds that its founder practiced TM for several years?

Richard Swartz describes seeing young people not being helped by Psychoanalytic approaches to family therapy, and that could be the case. I have no idea if everyone understands psychoanalysis or employs its insights correctly and Freud is very out of popularity now. Christians such as CS Lewis compared Psychoanalysis and Christian morality as two approches to 'putting the human machine right' (see Mere Christianity)

Additionally in the last fifty or so years from the 1960s I would say, westerners have become far more open to Eastern ideas.

Carl Jung thought some eastern forms of meditation could be dangerous to westerners, and cautioned about meddling in them.

“One often hears and reads about the dangers of Yoga, particularly of the ill-reputed Kundalini Yoga. The deliberately induced psychotic state, which in certain unstable individuals might easily lead to a real psychosis, is a danger that needs to be taken very seriously indeed. These things really are dangerous and ought not to be meddled with in our typically Western way. It is a meddling with Fate, which strikes at the very roots of human existence and can let loose a flood of sufferings of which no sane person ever dreamed. These sufferings correspond to the hellish torments of the chönyid state…” C. G. Jung, Introduction to The Tibetan book of the Dead

 

[dms1972]

Physical activities that involve your body, even something as simple as handwashing dishes can help with anxiety because it involves doing something physical, consciously and intentionally, and not being lost in your thoughts. Living in your head all the time or stuck with your own emotions isn't healthy. It's called rumination.

Yes i find what you say about doing dishes to be the case. Thankyou.

 

[Mea_kākau]

what does seem to happen, though i am not speaking as an expert, is that when people experience something traumatic they may dissociate, part of their experience becomes 'not me' so to speak. This might not mean multiple personalities for most people. But in some case a person who has been abused might cope by 'becoming' someone else while its happening. People cope in different ways. It could depend a lot on what the traumatic experience has been. Terms such as MPD are not always helpful, on the one hand they strain some peoples credulity who take them fairly literally and think that its impossible, in a sense it is impossible for people to really have multiple personalities [sic], it more a case of fragmented personality. Again just my non-expert opinion.

It's no longer called MPD or Multiple Personality Disorder. It's DID or Dissociative Identity Disorder.

There is a continuum or spectrum for dissociation. It starts with normal everyday experiences of dissociation we all have, i.e.; driving in the car and finding ourselves at our destination without remembering the trip, to poly-fragmented DID at the extreme end. PTSD and amnesia/fugue are part of the spectrum.

I experienced poly-fragmented DID as a result of extreme abuse by my psychopathic father who was a serial killer. I divided my mind, emotions, and feelings into compartments and left my body (also dissociation) in order to survive something outside the normal human experience. I had the whole spectrum of dissociation with the most prominent being PTSD. I didn't use IFS and integrated my many alters (parts) and fragments (pieces). It occurred outside of the context of therapy over many years through prayer, listening to praise and worship music, and writing.

I am somewhat skeptical of Richard Swartz and IFS because I can't help wondering if someone into Transcendental Meditation for years really is in touch with ordinary reality. TM is really is very contrary to common sense, those into it seem to completely give up common sense. Take "yogic flying" for example - these people mediate and believe they are levitating when its clear they are simply bouncing on a mattress. Its all achieved through the mattress and limb movement and probably the state of mind they are in makes some difference to their body.

Should I critique IFS on the grounds that its founder practiced TM for several years?

Before I became a born-again Christian, I was a new-ager for many years. I practiced TM and can affirm that at times I wasn't in touch with ordinary reality. My take on "yogic flying" was demons influencing the people. I knew someone who practiced this on a daily basis. He changed from a reliable person to someone "out there." Years later did he stop practicing the "flying."

I have seen both Christian and secular therapists. When I couldn't find a Christian therapist who could handle the memories I had with my father, I found a secular therapist who helped me gain a different perspective on what I experienced and witnessed as a child. Any suggestions to use a technique by either Christian or secular therapists I thoroughly researched before deciding to engage in them.

Carl Jung thought some eastern forms of meditation could be dangerous to westerners, and cautioned about meddling in them.

I agree with Carl Jung as there are demonic influences in those practices.