Chivalry

[TeutonKnight]

Do you believe that chivalry is dead in today's world?
Do you believe that it has any place in today's world?
If so, should it be revived?


I do believe that it is still around but perhaps so small so minor that people think it is dead. I believe it should be revived and that it has a place in the world perhaps I have been reading to many Bernard Cornwell novels.

 

[Caitlin.ann]

Do you believe that chivalry is dead in today's world?
Do you believe that it has any place in today's world?
If so, should it be revived?


I do believe that it is still around but perhaps so small so minor that people think it is dead. I believe it should be revived and that it has a place in the world perhaps I have been reading to many Bernard Cornwell novels.

No
Yes
Yes

My fiance is very chivalrous and I think we definitely need more like him.

 

[Cognitive]

No
Yes
Yes

My fiance is very chivalrous and I think we definitely need more like him.

You're a sweetheart darling.

I agree with her answers, in my opinion it is almost a lost art which needs to be refined. People have little or no respect for women or their own personal honor these days and that sickens me.

People would rather step over someone laying on the street rather then help them or get too close... a pathetic look on the world today. It all comes down to personal greed.

 

[wanderingone]

Chivalry being the qualities idealized for knights in medieval times? I believe putting others before self, exhibiting responsibility and courage are good qualities, I don't think they should apply specifically to one gender showing those things for another gender. I don't think such behaviors were ever more prevalent at other times in history except in the minds of people who like to believe there were good old days that were better than good contemporary days.

 

[Bombila]

The origin of the word chivalry is the horse mounted warrior, the chevalier. Mediaeval chivalry was mostly a pretty concept practiced by the upper classes.

Half the ballads that come to us from that period are about the depradations of knights, particularly wrt women of lower status than themselves, songs of rape and hidden pregnancies and murders to conceal them.

I'd prefer people were just kind to each other, and willing to protect other people, male or female, that seem to need protection, without resurrecting Mediaeval concepts that were rooted in feudalism.

I've found that in my own province and indeed everywhere I've travelled, most people have been kind to me, have assisted me when I needed help, have offered hospitality and friendship. Perhaps I've been very lucky, or perhaps it is that I expect that most people are essentially well-meaning. 'Chivalry' may be dead, but good people abound. There are more good people than there are evil people - we just hear a lot more about the evil ones, and it is certainly true that we remember most the ones who treated us badly.

"Knights believed in the code of chivalry. They promised to defend the weak, be courteous to all women, be loyal to their king, and serve God at all times. Knights were expected to be humble before others, especially their superiors. They were also expected to not "talk too much". In other words, they shouldn't boast. The code of chivalry demanded that a knight give mercy to a vanquished enemy. However, the very fact that knights were trained as men of war belied this code. Even though they came from rich families, many knights were not their families' firstborn. They did not receive an inheritance. Thus they were little more than mercenaries. They plundered villages or cities that they captured, often defiling and destroying churches and other property. Also the code of chivalry did not extend to the peasants. The "weak" was widely interpreted as "noble women and children". They were often brutal to common folk. They could sometimes even rape young peasant women without fear of reprisal, all because they were part of the upper class."

http://library.thinkquest.org/10949/fief/medknight.html

 

[Asimov]

Do you believe that chivalry is dead in today's world?

I would hope so.

Do you believe that it has any place in today's world?
If so, should it be revived?

No, it shouldn't be revived if it's dead. Chivalry is the equivalent to "a womans place is in the kitchen" mentality. A society of individuals is a society of individuals, and everyone shouldn't have to behave or conform to a particular concept of "etiquette" just because someone says it's polite. I believe in equality, and in that sense of the word if people want to be treated like equals then they shouldn't expect special treatment on the basis that they are of a specific gender.

Unless by chivalrous you mean "people should treat other people with respect and common courtesy" then sure. If you mean that men should open doors for women and all that other romantic idealism "women should be swept off their feet and have flowers and chocolates thrown at them and have poetry written for them" nonsense.

I believe it should be revived and that it has a place in the world perhaps I have been reading to many Bernard Cornwell novels.

Stay away from the Harlequin romance novels...that or realize that there's a difference between reality and fantasy. I don't go around thinking everyone should say "live long and prosper" or "may the force be with you" just because I enjoy Star Trek and Star Wars.

 

[Asimov]

People have little or no respect for women or their own personal honor these days and that sickens me.

What bunk! It was in those "chivalrous" days that people had no respect for women. Just because you aren't getting doors opened for you or having your hand kissed doesn't mean you're not being respected.

It sickens me that women fought for equality and respect, to be treated like equals and now I'm reading this nonsense about wanting to go back to "damsels in distress" who can't fend for themselves in the big mean world?

People would rather step over someone laying on the street rather then help them or get too close... a pathetic look on the world today. It all comes down to personal greed.

Yes...because everything was super hunky-dory in the past where everyone danced instead of fought and nobody starved or died...ever.

The good ol' days...

 

[CreedIsChrist]

What bunk! It was in those "chivalrous" days that people had no respect for women. Just because you aren't getting doors opened for you or having your hand kissed doesn't mean you're not being respected.

It sickens me that women fought for equality and respect, to be treated like equals and now I'm reading this nonsense about wanting to go back to "damsels in distress" who can't fend for themselves in the big mean world?



Yes...because everything was super hunky-dory in the past where everyone danced instead of fought and nobody starved or died...ever.

The good ol' days...

Ugh, its this attitude that is dumbing down society to its sterile loveless nature.

A good marriage has forms of chivalry in it.

And yes, men should open doors for women. If someone has a problem with someone opening a door for them, then they have a problem with insecurity.

And respect for women in these days? As they walk around practically naked in rap videos with guys calling them hoes and being a "pimp"? Or women today wearing barely anything on them as they prance down the streets with men yelling at them? Women were much more respected back in the days. Domestic abuse has risen considerably and the divorce rate has gone up almost 50% since the begining of the 20th century.

People would rather step over someone laying on the street rather then help them or get too close... a pathetic look on the world today. It all comes down to personal greed.

In liberal hellholes like NYC if you have a heart attack in the middle of the road people will continue to walk by you without even helping. They had this one show where they did experiments where they had someone act like they hurt themselves in the middle of a NYC street. It took 45 minutes before ONE person came up to him and asked if he needed help. And this guy was making obvious signs of needing help from someone. So much for our wonderful secular values. Its turned people into heartless robots. Guess that happens when you teach people we are nothing but animals that came from monkeys that earlier came from a meaningless primordial soup.

 

[BobW188]

Bombilla has a very good point. Chivalry was too often coupled with snobbery and a rather offensive classism, its behaviors being due only to others of the class. we need to unite the best of traditional knighthood with the hoped-for equalities of the democratic republic.
Otherwise: No, but it is at risk; Yes; and Yes

 

[Yusuf Evans]

Wanna know why chivalry is dead? Women say they want a chivalrous man, but they only date pricks then whine about it. Most men that are chivalrous are considered "too nice", so women tend to not choose them as partners.

 

[BobW188]

And we chivalrous men live up to our code by being quite happy not to be chosen by such women.

 

[Admiral Kirk]

I agree with the original poster. Chivalry, especially it's moral values and concept of manners (i.e., gentleman's behavior), should be taught again to our future generations. The world's grown increasingly corrupt in one century alone.

 

[Asimov]

Ugh, its this attitude that is dumbing down society to its sterile loveless nature.

Sterile and loveless? Hardly. Since when is not treating women like commodities to be bought creating a loveless nature?

A good marriage has forms of chivalry in it.

Only by your definition of what a good marriage is, which is entirely up to you and your spouse. It's not representative of what all marriages should be like nor is it representative of what all male/female relationships should be like.

And yes, men should open doors for women. If someone has a problem with someone opening a door for them, then they have a problem with insecurity.

Entirely irrelevant. It is polite to open doors for anyone, not just because they're women. Having a vagina doesn't give one special consideration.

And respect for women in these days? As they walk around practically naked in rap videos with guys calling them hoes and being a "pimp"? Or women today wearing barely anything on them as they prance down the streets with men yelling at them? Women were much more respected back in the days. Domestic abuse has risen considerably and the divorce rate has gone up almost 50% since the begining of the 20th century.

Ah yes, quite objective observations of society. Good to know that we should trust your statements as if they were fact just because you said it.

In liberal hellholes like NYC if you have a heart attack in the middle of the road people will continue to walk by you without even helping. They had this one show where they did experiments where they had someone act like they hurt themselves in the middle of a NYC street. It took 45 minutes before ONE person came up to him and asked if he needed help. And this guy was making obvious signs of needing help from someone. So much for our wonderful secular values. Its turned people into heartless robots.

They had this one show where they did experiments...sounds like a fascinating story. Again I'm glad you're here to provide us with sound, indisputable fact that doesn't need to be referenced in any way, shape or form. Clearly, because this is obviously true, NYC is representative of all society and this one experiment is all that is needed to determine that such claims are true.

Secular values...you mean promoting freedom of religious worship and persecution from the government based on what religion you adhere to? That's what secular means.

Guess that happens when you teach people we are nothing but animals that came from monkeys that earlier came from a meaningless primordial soup.

No, it happens when you teach people they are nothing but dirty sinners worthy of death.

 

[Asimov]

I agree with the original poster. Chivalry, especially it's moral values and concept of manners (i.e., gentleman's behavior), should be taught again to our future generations. The world's grown increasingly corrupt in one century alone.

Yes, that's right. We should also remove the vote from women and reduce black people to nothing but slaves too. Oh yea, let's burn witches and kill natives who refuse to convert to Christianity.

Those were the good ol' days.

 

[GryffinSong]

Ah, chivalry. Misunderstood, idealized, and now pined for. I'm a member of a medieval re-creation group. We are very clear that we're creating a group that practices the ideal of chivalry, without all the sexist, rapacious, class-conscious garbage. In other words, we've created a fantasy, with a loose wrapping of history around it. When we talk about what we like about it, it's the fun, of course. Plus the helping others, the selflessness, the polite respect we attempt to share with each other. Kids are taught to respect each other, to play nice, and to learn as much as they can.

As for opening doors and such, I can take it or leave it. When I was younger I found it very offensive. Why? Because I felt that people were implying that I was weak and couldn't take care of myself. As I've aged, and after having a door-opening boyfriend a decade or so ago, I've come to take it in stride. I hold doors open for others, and sometimes have them held open for me. Unless I think a man is being condescending just because I'm a woman, I try to assume they mean well. But this sort of thing CAN contribute to sexism. It depends, at least in part, with attitude, both of the helper and the helpee.

 

[cantata]

I try to be chivalrous: I open doors for people, offer up my seat on the train or bus, help people with buggies and suitcases at train stations, &c., &c. But I guess that doesn't count because I'm a girl, right?

 

[Asimov]

As for opening doors and such, I can take it or leave it. When I was younger I found it very offensive. Why? Because I felt that people were implying that I was weak and couldn't take care of myself. As I've aged, and after having a door-opening boyfriend a decade or so ago, I've come to take it in stride. I hold doors open for others, and sometimes have them held open for me. Unless I think a man is being condescending just because I'm a woman, I try to assume they mean well. But this sort of thing CAN contribute to sexism. It depends, at least in part, with attitude, both of the helper and the helpee.

There's nothing wrong with helping people. There is something wrong with expecting it just because of the biological status of the individual.

I would rather have someone help me because they choose to, not out of some misguided sense of duty.

 

[1TrueDisciple]

Yes, that's right. We should also remove the vote from women and reduce black people to nothing but slaves too. Oh yea, let's burn witches and kill natives who refuse to convert to Christianity.

Those were the good ol' days.

Disgusting caricatures do nothing to support your cause.

Chivalry is nothing more than showing consideration for others and being kind for no reason other than to be kind to others.

Today's world is steeped in technological savagery in which people are crass brutes.

Take a look at your own unkind and inconsiderate responses on this thread to see what I mean.

 

[GryffinSong]

There's nothing wrong with helping people. There is something wrong with expecting it just because of the biological status of the individual.

I would rather have someone help me because they choose to, not out of some misguided sense of duty.

Exactly!!!

 

[cantata]

Disgusting caricatures do nothing to support your cause.

Chivalry is nothing more than showing consideration for others and being kind for no reason other than to be kind to others.

Today's world is steeped in technological savagery in which people are crass brutes.

Take a look at your own unkind and inconsiderate responses on this thread to see what I mean.

If it really is just showing consideration others and being kind to them, it's all good.

The problem is that people like to throw in a bit of sexism with their chivalry. That isn't cool.