Children Getting Too Personal

[Firscherscherling]

Few signifigant things: The children who are taught by a parent who did not finish high school score 55 percentage points higher then children with a parent who did not finish high school who are in the school system.
Check page 12 of this link for further details. Until you have refuted the researchers who say that homeschooling is a way to overcome a poor educational background your point is null.
http://www.fraserinstitute.ca/admin/books/files/homeschool.pdf

Who homeschools: The research
http://www.ncspe.org/publications_files/932_OP62_v2.pdf
http://epaa.asu.edu/epaa/v10n26.html

Actually I did help tutor other homeschoolers in math, so I DO THINK SO!

Reality check for you: My seventh grade science teacher was unsure if magnetic fields stopped radiation. This is high school physics. So I'd put me or my mom up against your daughter's teachers. And interestingly the first study I cited showed negligable improvement in test scores if the homeschooling parent had an educational degree.

Wow. Thanks for the links. They pretty much said exactly what I said. Home schoolers tend to be middle and upper middle class, white, two parent households, who speak english as their primary language, with at least one parent staying at home. Duh.

The second study said outright that the measure of the success of home schooling cannot yet be determined due to inadequate data.

These studies say nothing except that home schoolers do better on tests and what the demographic make-up is. It gives no substance as to the reasons the home schoolers do better when the two groups are taken as a whole.

So I say again, until you compare the test scores of the priveledged few who in public school who share the same demographic make-up, your comparisons mean absolutley nothing.

Point: Don't make bold assertions of fact based on nothing but your opinion. And when you are going to post articles in an attempt to bolster that opinion, the articles should at least provide facts to do that.

So tell me, what are the stats for public school kids who don't face the challenges of being a minority, are not exceedingly poor, are from a family with parents who have achieved at least a high school education, with two parents, with one parent living at home? How about an apples to apples comparison. This isn't that hard a concept.

What if you faound that the stats indicate a similar level of achievement. Would that break your heart? Not mine. It would be what I'd expect.

 

[Firscherscherling]

That's all fine and good, but you can't deny that jealousy may be a factor in some people's vehement opposition to homeschooling. Also I should add that most people who oppose homeschooling are always on watch when meeting children who are homeschooled. It is human nature to hunt for the negative qualities. If you meet a family who you know homeschools their children you're going to instinctively be looking for the first sign of introversion or slip-up when interacting with adults or other children. First time you witness such behavior, instead of thinking it could perhaps just be the way that child is, you're going to place the blame on homeschooling. I'm not saying there aren't any children out there who are the product of over-sheltering or homeschooling (the two don't always go hand in hand). My point is that no one can accuse me of making sweeping generalizations and broad assumptions about public school when most of you responding to this thread have been guilty of the same towards homeschooling and even private education to an extent.

Buzz...

It seems from thread to thead that you make major leaps and read a whole heck of a lot into people's posts.

So I'll say it again, just like someone a couple of posts before me said it. Home Schooling is not inherently bad. Public school is not inherently bad. Those of you who are saying either are basically full of it beause you don't really know. There are no studies I know of that tell us that in an accurate statistical manner. But it wold not surprise me one bit that in a apples to apples comparison (if that's possible) that the level of achievement is pretty much the same. It also would not surprise me if the study showed that some kids do better in one and some do better in another.

 

[ThePhoenix]

Wow. Thanks for the links. They pretty much said exactly what I said. Home schoolers tend to be middle and upper middle class, white, two parent households, who speak english as their primary language, with at least one parent staying at home. Duh.

The second study said outright that the measure of the success of home schooling cannot yet be determined due to inadequate data.

These studies say nothing except that home schoolers do better on tests and what the demographic make-up is. It gives no substance as to the reasons the home schoolers do better when the two groups are taken as a whole.

So I say again, until you compare the test scores of the priveledged few who in public school who share the same demographic make-up, your comparisons mean absolutley nothing.

Point: Don't make bold assertions of fact based on nothing but your opinion. And when you are going to post articles in an attempt to bolster that opinion, the articles should at least provide facts to do that.

So tell me, what are the stats for public school kids who don't face the challenges of being a minority, are not exceedingly poor, are from a family with parents who have achieved at least a high school education, with two parents, with one parent living at home? How about an apples to apples comparison. This isn't that hard a concept.

What if you faound that the stats indicate a similar level of achievement. Would that break your heart? Not mine. It would be what I'd expect.

Find them. I beg you. I gave you all that my reseach showed. They DON'T HAVE STATISTICS ON THIS. If this is the critical reading skills they teach in school I really don't need to learn it. I said that this was about all there was, and I'm pretty sure I'm right.

 

[Firscherscherling]

Dude, that's my point. You are making claims that home schooling is better PERIOD, yet you have no valid data to back that up. At the same time you present stuff as data saying it is evidence for your claim. Now you say there is no data. Make up your mind, man!

If this is the critical analysis your mom taught you, time for some remedial ed. May I suggest my daughters first-class public elementary school.

Geez. Some people...

 

[ThePhoenix]

Dude, that's my point. You are making claims that home schooling is better PERIOD, yet you have no valid data to back that up. At the same time you present stuff as data saying it is evidence for your claim. Now you say there is no data. Make up your mind, man!

If this is the critical analysis your mom taught you, time for some remedial ed. May I suggest my daughters first-class public elementary school.

Geez. Some people...

No, reread the thread. The claims were homeschooling is INFERIOR to school. Now you're trying to argue that it's ONLY equal to school. I think my point has been made.

 

[Firscherscherling]

Quotes from me just from my last few posts:

What if you found that the stats indicate a similar level of achievement. Would that break your heart? Not mine. It would be what I'd expect.

So I'll say it again, just like someone a couple of posts before me said it. Home Schooling is not inherently bad. Public school is not inherently bad. Those of you who are saying either are basically full of it beause you don't really know. There are no studies I know of that tell us that in an accurate statistical manner. But it wold not surprise me one bit that in a apples to apples comparison (if that's possible) that the level of achievement is pretty much the same. It also would not surprise me if the study showed that some kids do better in one and some do better in another.

Oops. Looks like you are wrong again. I never once made the claim that one was better than the other. Maybe you need to remove that big old chip and have a re-read.

 

[Susan]

::Mod hat on::

This is getting a little flamish.

[noflame]

/me pours water on thread


Ahhhh, that's better.

::Mod hat off::

 

[ThePhoenix]

Drug use isn't as dangerous as ignorance/stupidity, and they don't HAVE to go hand in hand.

There's lots of drug use at my school too, but I don't believe that to be a risk for the future of America, no. I believe that the biggest risk for America's future (aside from Mr. Bush) is how extremely ignorant these kids I go to school with are. Many of whom don't do drugs, many of whom don't fornicate. Fornication and drug use doesn't endanger society NEARLY as much as ignorant people do. I don't mean ignorance for the people who are less educated because of lack of experience, but ignorant because they just don't care to know anything besides trucks and cracking simple jokes.

So if you want your child to grow up a decent person, teach him the power of knowledge and give him a thirst for it, and raise him with morals. All you can honestly do for your kid is teach him between right and wrong, give him a solid foundation of life buolt upon compassion, sympathy, and integrity, and he/she will be fine.

Sheltering your child will just plant a seed of curiosity which has a good chance of sprouting once they move out of the house. I wonder how many people were sheltered as children, and then once they got out into the real world particiapted in all the things they never had a chance to experience as a teenager.

Equates homeschooling with ignorance.

Suspicions confirmed.

Mocking a homeschooler

I wouldnt worry too much. You cant mother the child forever. If you shut him in from the real world until hes an adult, he wont know how to deal with new and possibly bad situations. Highschool is lifes boot camp, it trains you for the real world.

Self-explainitory

No offense, but of course you may only think you are well socialized. My sister has many problems, she grew up with my father and step mother while I was raised by my mother. She thinks she is well socialized and healthy emotionally but I see many problems she doesn't want to. She went to a private school and grew up out in the country and was unable to socialize much more than the normal kids due to her living so far away from them. She doesn't get along with people her own age. She doesn't understand them. Success in a career doesn't mean squat.

Suggesting that homeschoolers can't interact socially with others.

My point is that you might have found college life very hard to adjust to if you had gone. Especially if you found yourself in a dorm, a thousand miles away from home, with hundreds of kids who have serious differences in their views. It is quite possible you would become a sort of "Shut In". I have seen that persoanlly with a guy who was homeschooled.

Ya know what? You can't hide your kid forever. Homeschool him now and he'll be 'shielded' til he is 17 or 18, then he'll go into college (or the workplace) and be completely blown away because I can guarantee you high school is a small, small glimpse of the real world.

Life is secular. Christians may not like that (personally I do) but that's the way it is. Teach you kid that he is a Christian, these are his beliefs, this is why, and this is how to practice them. Send him to high school and hope he doesn't do drugs or get anyone pregnant.

If ya don't now, I can assure you he will be COMPLETELY blown away by the real world once he leaves homeschooling. ya can't hide and duck forever.

Another post saying homeschoolers can't deal with "the real world"


That convince you that there's a few people who might have had small problems with homeschooling, and maybe suggested it was a bit inferior? My reread seems to fit my memory pretty well.

 

[Susan]

:timeout:

This post is directed to no one in particular, and I am not acting on the behalf of any side involved. This thread is off-topic and has devolved into petty arguing between members. Therefore, I am closing it for the sake of peace.